DNA analysis suggests Peruvian elongated skulls are NOT human!

JayinAR
reply to post by NephraTari

 

It wouldn't be the first sub species found.
Its not like we have alien DNA to compare it to, so this would just be considered a new branch on the evolutionary tree, even if it didn't seem to fit.

Remember the hobbit people discovery not too long ago? That one wasn't suppressed.

This has fakery stamped all over it until they come forward and publish their findings for peer review. Everyone should be asking why they haven't done so. And don't give them a damn dime for more tests. Its a con

To call it a con is a bit harsh; lots of people all over the world request money for all sorts of uses; given the economic situation we find ourselves in, group funding is the norm rather than the outlier. DNA research costs a LOT of money and some of this research has been only available for a year or two now and thus is very expensive.

And demanding 'peer review' is a two edged sword; plenty of great ideas have been so scoffed at by the mainstream scientists that they can never get a decent hearing on peer review, much less 'published' peer review. Magazines of all sorts exist to make money and much of that money comes from governments, which by definition at this point are corrupt and pushing their own agendas.

Same thing with the unnamed geneticists; perhaps they work at labs or universities that are funded at least partially by government money and are afraid of their jobs being at stake or their general funding, or of having this sideline exploration being associated with their employer in a way that comes back to bite. No harm in having the information sourced anonymously for now, as long as in the end run, the people who did the research publish both their credentials and findings to public (not necessarily peer) review.

This is a great topic and I look forward to discussing it on OOTB; I've been following Lloyd Pye (RIP) for years now and had several email conversations with him; he was a warm, wonderful, inquisitive guy with an open mind and heart; someone to emulate. Even he said repeatedly that calling the skull 'Starchild' was a misnomer and worked against it; it was named when it was very new to them and they had no idea what they had in their possession; oddly after all these years they still don't except that it wasn't a child's skull.

JayinAR
reply to post by EyesOpenMouthShut

 

Again, this isn't evidence of aliens so much as it is evidence of POSSIBLY another species of human.

These people were found bound by ropes. For some reason I doubt ancient aliens came down to Earth and were promptly enslaved by the primitive natives.

There are currently tribes on remote islands living today who throw spears and rocks at helicopters because they don't know what they are (maybe there thinking "dragons!"). To these people, we are aliens. If one of those pilots were to crash on one of those islands, I doubt he'd be getting invited to impregnate the chief's super-hot daughter. He'd most likely end up tied up and perhaps eaten (that's right, some of these tribes are still cannibals).

It's not that far fetched.

reply to post by signalfire


Yes, perhaps con is a harsh word...
But look at it like this, if it really is revolutionary, the data is right there for ANYONE to see...if it is legit.

Nobody should be afraid to put their name on it unless they are afraid their work is shoddy.

This isn't like archaeology where an alternative view can get you shunned. This is genetics. This is a matter of data, not speculation.

I just don't buy the "afraid of losing their credentials" argument on this one.

The 'tied up' comment is from buried skeletons that have been found; it's possible that the people were bound after death to make burial easier (you try digging a 6 foot long and deep grave without a shovel!), or they were buried as captives; is there any way to really tell?

I'm pretty sure that if a superior-brained race met up with a smaller-brained race, there'd be both violence and cooperative acceptance on both sides. Just like we have now... :-/

Occam's Razor would have us come to the conclusion that the large-skulled race was/is an unknown species; whether they came from some species on the planet we don't have a lot of archeological evidence for as of yet, or on board starships remains to be seen.

Cool topic, and one with real hands-on evidence for once.

JayinAR

AliceBleachWhite
reply to post by NephraTari

 

Please see my commentary posted in the discussion already well under way in this thread:
www.abovetopsecret.com...

"Your commentary" once again SUCKS.
We are saying the same thing right here in this thread WITHOUT calling people "clowns".

You are one of the hardest people to read on these boards and I don't know why your disgraceful attitude is allowed to persist.

Edit for clarification: the above poster linked to a comment in which he/she said that the sooner people die the better. The subject of which is a recently deceased man.
The very definition of disgraceful

edit on 7-2-2014 by JayinAR because: (no reason given)

Thank you for the unsolicited personal attack.

Please take notice of my criticism of the SUBJECT, and the Characters involved in perpetuating the sale of "wow" over actual science.
Please take notice that I am not criticizing members of ATS.

Please also refer to The Rise of the ATS Invertebrate, or; It takes a Spine to be a Conspiracy Theorist

Now, lets put my commentary (PLURAL, meaning several posts) into proper context:

Allow me to quote myself in response to basically the very same thread as this:

AliceBleachWhite

Lloyde Pye and Brien Foerster?

I'd say the Provenance at the very least is questionable.

Thus, we have a zero-find here.
It's a waste of time.

The tests need be re-done, with proper supervision of and observation to Provenance with legitimate accredited names in Science attached to the studies that actually stand to lose something.

When characters with no real academic credibility to lose go maniacally waving around some shiny new "discovery", it really means a whole lot of ZERO until actual, legitimate accredited folks can give it a proper go.

It's shoddy work like this that poisons legitimate interest in these topics for fear of ridicule by association.
If the clown car would stop trolling around the block, then, given some safe distance and time from the circus, some legitimate names might be willing to give it a poke.

These folks, however, poison the whole subject by association.
Once they go away, die, and stop fogging up the air with their spookiness, someone with a name and reputation might be willing to put up a stake in doing some actual research.

after that, in response to a member claiming that Brian F didn't do the DNA testing himself, but, ONLY collected the DNA, my response was as follows:

AliceBleachWhite

What part of Integrity of Provenance is difficult to understand?

WHO obtained the samples?
Right.

For all we know they could of stuck a Howler monkey, a chihuahua dog, iguana, and a poison dart frog in a blender, fapped some human DNA into the mix, and sent a sample of THAT.

Questionable Provenance, at the least, as well as procedural methodology.

Samples need be collected under the supervision, of Legitimate Accredited Names, BY Legitimate Accredited Names or their doctoral candidates.
The entire process from DNA extraction, to final interpretation of lab results requires Legitimate Accredited Names attached.

The moment any fringer circus clowns start popping up, especially if there's any opportunity for them to contaminate anything, if only by association, the legitimacy of the whole thing falls to question.

Legitimate Scientists wouldn't knowingly accept money from these fringers due the association such clowns could cause in risking a tarnish on credibility.

These fringers are radioactive, in that respect, and until they get far far far away from whatever they're trying to push, no one is going to give them legitimacy and risk poisoning their career and reputation by association.

Now, I could go on with the debate that started about the whole skull suture nonsense, but, the points are that these NON-Academics are making "wow" claims, and have zero legitimacy or credibility.
If anything they do more damage to the field of study than they help as now, and specimens they've handled are likely hopelessly contaminated against any future Legitimate study by actual lettered Scientists.

reply to post by JayinAR


Times are definitely changing in that regard, but for now, default position for most scientists is 'don't get ridiculed'; most scientists (I use the term loosely) are squarely stuck in conventional thinking. Mega-years of university courses will do that to you.

It's a bad analogy, but try to get elected to high public office after declaring you're an atheist, or a vegan or believe in UFOs or have seen one...

Ridicule is almost the best way ever devised of shutting down 'new thought'; that's why it's used so much by the media and those in power. It brings back genetic memories of being shunned and driven from the village which was a death sentence for thousands of years.

I agree that the data should be available for public review, but all in good time; first they have to be dead sure about it.

signalfire
The 'tied up' comment is from buried skeletons that have been found; it's possible that the people were bound after death to make burial easier (you try digging a 6 foot long and deep grave without a shovel!), or they were buried as captives; is there any way to really tell?

I'm pretty sure that if a superior-brained race met up with a smaller-brained race, there'd be both violence and cooperative acceptance on both sides. Just like we have now... :-/

Occam's Razor would have us come to the conclusion that the large-skulled race was/is an unknown species; whether they came from some species on the planet we don't have a lot of archeological evidence for as of yet, or on board starships remains to be seen.

Cool topic, and one with real hands-on evidence for once.

Doesn't Occam's Razor state that the explanation requiring the fewest assumptions is most likely to be correct?

And who has their hands on the evidence and why won't they share with reputable labs? For twice.

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite


I basically said your commentary reads like crap and said your attitude is disgraceful. If you perceive that as an attack I apologize.
But to quote you on this very subject of Pye, a recently deceased man, you said:

" These folks, however, poison the whole subject by association. Once they go away, die, and stop fogging up the air with their spookiness, someone with a name and reputation might be willing to put up a stake in doing some actual research."

This is disgraceful and I stand by it.

Good day

There is already a thread about this.
Go post in it, and stop wasting everyone's time with a duplicate thread.
COME ON MODS

www.abovetopsecret.com...

It should also be noted that this isn't even new information on this topic...
Before Its News - Oct 2013

Sample 2A from the skull bone is very special. I recovered an almost complete sequence of mtDNA from it and presumably a lot of nuclear sequences as well, but I did not analyze this aspect yet. The mtDNA sequence is very interesting. It does match human mtDNA, but has a LOT of unique mutations that are not present in most known haplotypes from A to Y, nor in Denisova or Neanderthal. Many of them are completely unique and not what is normally found in South America. Lloyd Pye

and even goes back so far as 2010 (as far as I can tell and referenced on the same website this story was spewed out of...)

Recent DNA testing, by a German team in 2010 of nearby Nazca skulls, as well as a sampling of Paracas ones, indicate that both the Nazca and Paracas were not genetically related to any other people in what is now known as Peru.

Ancient origins


So, in fact it very well may be a con....it is obviously working too. Brian Foerster charges 3000 a person to go hunting for Nephilim (yea they claim these are the legendary Nephelim) as well as his books and lectures....

This is interesting. I have seen some programs on the H-2 channel, that basically come to the same conclusion. But I think before I make my final decision, I am going to wait and see if I can pick this up on another maybe scientific leaning site or in other areas of the media.

Ok. I can understand that. But we arent talking about the other elongated skulls from specific tribes (with photo and personal evidence)...who've mimicked the binding of skulls correct?

Because those...we documented, so Im assuming its addressing others discovered.

draknoir2
Doesn't Occam's Razor state that the explanation requiring the fewest assumptions is most likely to be correct?
And who has their hands on the evidence and why won't they share with reputable labs? For twice.

My thoughts are along those same lines. The more "excuses" you have to come up with in order to get a scenario to work makes it much less likely the scenario is correct.

In real science, you don't let the dog eat your homework.

reply to post by NephraTari


Try as I might I actually can't find any evidence of this work being published and peer reviewed.

I've read hundreds of genetics papers, this doesn't feel like any bona fide peer reviewed peice of work I've seen. I seen the published magazine like Cell etc, and I've not seen anything like this. I've done a damn good hunt and can't find anything like a reliable source for this 'DNA study'.

Basically, if it looks like BS and smells like BS.....

JayinAR
reply to post by AliceBleachWhite

 

I basically said your commentary reads like crap and said your attitude is disgraceful. If you perceive that as an attack I apologize.
But to quote you on this very subject of Pye, a recently deceased man, you said:

" These folks, however, poison the whole subject by association. Once they go away, die, and stop fogging up the air with their spookiness, someone with a name and reputation might be willing to put up a stake in doing some actual research."

This is disgraceful and I stand by it.

Good day

Ah, so, it's not at all disgraceful and repugnant for NON-academics to dig up or obtain access to the very REAL remains of REAL PEOPLE like the poor child below:



or a similar child where the one pictured resulted from parental gene mutation caused by exposure from the Kyshtym Nuclear Disaster of 1957 in soviet Russia.

And it's not disgraceful and repugnant for these same laymen without any accreditation to fondle these remains of REAL ACTUAL HUMAN BEINGS to EXPLOIT these remains of these actual real people to advance their circus sideshow interpretations of a Starchild, aliens, other unknown Humans, without the supervision, acknowledgement, or consent of the legitimate scientific community, or, the heritage peoples whom these human remains belong to?

They're desecrating the remains of real people, and exploiting the unusual variability of their morphologies which resulted from Artificial Cranial Deformation, or some other means.

They're exploiting the dead in advancing their own circus side show agendas to sell entertainment "wow" books, and that's not disgusting, disgraceful, and outright repugnant?

I disagree.
I feel quite secure in expressing full liberty in criticising these Disgusting Specimens of humanity, alive or dead, with as much vernacular and color of language as necessary for their utter contempt in exploiting the human remains of real people for their own gains.



boom

reply to post by AliceBleachWhite



"Boom?"

Good grief, I have never seen such childish behavior from someone who seems as learned as you obviously are.

First of all you seem to hold "science" in a position of supreme authority when it clearly is not. Science is a philosophical construct like countless others.

Secondly, you act as if these "disgusting specimens of human beings" ran out and robbed the graves of other people, and that is not true. These remains were GIVEN to Pye by someone who had them in a box in their attic, of all places. And if I'm not mistaken, THAT person had had them passed down by a family member.

So basically you are slandering not one, but at least two, people now deceased.

Who died and named "science" God anyways?

It's a hoax, pissing match over yes?

reply to post by Thorneblood


No, I've still got some in the tank.
I am now wondering why my post was received as ill-mannered when I was simply calling out someone for basically saying someone was "better off dead"because why? Because they don't have credentials.

Lmao

Lincoln was a self-educated land lawyer. Perhaps that's why John Wilkes Booth killed him? Because he didn't get a formal education, so he clearly wasn't qualified to be a president, right?

Sounds outlandish, right?
This is precisely the same logic and its disgusting.

And with that I am done.

JayinAR
reply to post by AliceBleachWhite

 

"Boom?"

Good grief, I have never seen such childish behavior from someone who seems as learned as you obviously are.

First of all you seem to hold "science" in a position of supreme authority when it clearly is not. Science is a philosophical construct like countless others.

Secondly, you act as if these "disgusting specimens of human beings" ran out and robbed the graves of other people, and that is not true. These remains were GIVEN to Pye by someone who had them in a box in their attic, of all places. And if I'm not mistaken, THAT person had had them passed down by a family member.

So basically you are slandering not one, but at least two, people now deceased.

Who died and named "science" God anyways?

Again, personal attacks and personal commentary against/about an ATS Member you're engaging with.
I strongly suggest a review of the T&C.

Please also provide authenticated fidelity of Provenance that gives integrity of origin and obtainment for these human remains.
Or, do people just idly pass dead bodies around to other people without any real credentials to fondle and wow over?

I'm fairly certain the possession of human remains without a license or proper documentation is a felony in many places.

I would also suggest, for those interested, some self education regarding the legal definitions of "slander" and "libel".
Here, this might help: Defamation.

Thorneblood
It's a hoax, pissing match over yes?

It is not.

Seriously why even come in here with that nonsense unless you can back it up.

Again WHY is this thread still open? There is one already on this and the OP didn't even post anything but a link and a link and plug for their show.