H5N1 Bird Flu and the Dementia Pandemic

Current coverage on H5N1 is chock full of pure bull puckey. For example, authorities say neurological symptoms are NOT common in H5N1 bird flu. In fact, neurological symptoms are extremely common in animals with H5N1. This most recent denial makes me wonder just what, exactly, is being covered up. What with the dementia pandemic and all… Even this report from 2009 warns that pandemic H5N1 "could initiate CNS disorders of protein aggregation including Parkinson's and Alzheimer's diseases."

2009: Highly pathogenic H5N1 influenza virus can enter the central nervous system and induce neuroinflammation and neurodegeneration.

…To date, 61% of the 433 known human cases of H5N1 infection have proved fatal. Animals infected by H5N1 viruses have demonstrated acute neurological signs ranging from mild encephalitis to motor disturbances to coma. However, no studies have examined the longer-term neurologic consequences of H5N1 infection among surviving hosts. …Our results suggest that a pandemic H5N1 pathogen, or other neurotropic influenza virus, could initiate CNS disorders of protein aggregation including Parkinson's and Alzheimer's diseases.

The WHO is investigating the death because initial reports have suggested the woman's symptoms were not entirely typical of H5N1 infections. Alberta's chief medical health office has said the woman had neurological symptoms that made doctors suspect she had encephalitis, or a brain infection.
It's not a common symptom of flu but has been reported in some H5N1 cases.
It's not known if an autopsy has been done.

Oct 10, 2012 - An H5N1 highly pathogenic avian influenza virus was isolated from conjunctiva of a whooper swan with neurological signs, which was captured during the latest H5N1 ... PMID: 23053526

Nov 5, 2013 - To evaluate the pathogenicity of a 2012 H5N1 HPAIV isolate and to ... In the infected ducks, clinical signs of disease, including neurological disorder, were observed. ... PMID: 24211664

2005. Bird Flu and Beyond: Chronic Disease to Kill 400 Million …the flu has long term impacts in survivors

Chronic disease results from pollution and industrial contamination, working in combination with very slowly progressive prion diseases. Infectious prions use the immune system to spread in the body, and spread more rapidly when the body is fighting infection - so most people who survive bird flu will suffer increasingly debilitating chronic disease.

[Dontcha hate it. Darn pesky little prions.]

Remember, you heard it here first. Spin and Counterspin: New Bird Flu Mutation has 91% Fatality Rate in Humans

Some flu viruses can cause dementia - they get into the nervous system, and cause the inflammation that leads to brain degeneration. Puts a whole new spin on the "zombie" thing - and shows that people are being manipulated into panic so they will support quarantine and euthanasia. WAKE UP!!!

I thought of the symptoms eagles are having when you described CNS symptoms in people (how the raptors appeared to be paralyzed and out of it). The eagle deaths have reached 40 in Utah and they are calling the culprit West Nile virus. Now that one doesn't spread from person to person but it comes from being bitten by a mosquito. This means its warm enough for Mosquitos in Utah right now? How much of this spread is from climate change?

I don't mean to take this off topic - it just came to mind. I understand the woman in Canada who died of the H5N1 was young and had no contact with birds while in China so they truly can't say it is an isolated incident. It's too soon for that IMO. A man in China died of this with the same circumstances - no contact with birds. If it isn't being transmitted person to person perhaps it is like West Nile virus - a mosquito or other insect bite.

reply to post by soficrow


Well I have some form of H/N Flu

Took me down for a couple of weeks.. Felt like I wanted to die, but I've lived through it

Particularly bad for me as I have Type 1 Diabetes

Nasty stuff

I'm a big strong man, weight lifter, hiker, outdoors-man... Not sure what would have happened to an older, less physical person

The flu is just beginning to hit in my area. No one has been hospitalized here yet, but a good portion of the community is based on retirees.
I hope we can be spared the worst of the flues going around.

reply to post by soficrow


So, this would be on the order of the chicken pox virus going dormant, to perhaps unleash shingles on a person years later?

Is this a common mechanism for viruses?

reply to post by semperfortis


Glad you came through okay. Just so you know, the healthiest, strongest people with the most vigorous immune systems tend to get the most sick with these viruses, unlike with normal flu. You might have just the right balance of healthy strength and chronic illness to neutralize the sucker. [Or not. What do I know?] Just glad you're okay.

reply to post by Dianec

Dianec
I thought of the symptoms eagles are having when you described CNS symptoms in people (how the raptors appeared to be paralyzed and out of it). The eagle deaths have reached 40 in Utah and they are calling the culprit West Nile virus. ...How much of this spread is from climate change?

I don't mean to take this off topic - it just came to mind. I understand the woman in Canada who died of the H5N1 was young and had no contact with birds while in China ...A man in China died of this with the same circumstances - no contact with birds. If it isn't being transmitted person to person perhaps it is like West Nile virus - a mosquito or other insect bite.

Only seems a tad off topic - it's all connected, even if we don't see the links yet. Great thought on the eagles - but could be either - West Nile has neuro symptoms too. ...Excellent point about the vectors (insect bite) - we do know that H5N1 has numerous reservoirs (water, soil, animals, insects, etc) and potential routes of infection (airways, gut and skin).

Life on our planet is undergoing a period of accelerated evolution. The process is most obvious in viruses and microbes, and it seems to be really taking off now. Interesting times.

reply to post by DontTreadOnMe

So, this would be on the order of the chicken pox virus going dormant, to perhaps unleash shingles on a person years later?

Is this a common mechanism for viruses?

Flu might have a latency mechanism similar to herpes but I don't know - and I don't think anyone understands latency in any event. Unfortunately, investigating the link between flu infection and chronic illness has been verboten for almost a century - the best data was collected and is privately owned by global health insurers, and protected as intellectual property. Right now, information is being released as it serves certain agendas - notably in support of Eugenics policies and euthanasia.

...No one understands viral latency OR immunity OR the role of exposure and disease in adaptation and evolution. These are the important issues, and more information will change how we think about it all.

Ed to add SURVIVAL TIP

We don't understand latency but DO know that flare ups are "triggered" - so pay attention to your body, environment and the interactions. The goal is to identify those triggers and avoid them if we can - to prevent flare-ups, shorten those we can't prevent. No one has absolute power over their own health, but we do have some, sometimes a lot. Learn what that power is and how to use it.

reply to post by DontTreadOnMe


I never thought of it from the chicken pox/shingles view but the flu planting a memory in our bodies - in its favor, or lying dormant would be a survival mechanism. While we think we have beat it - it has set up shop for a future generation of itself.
We have always looked at it from an immunity standpoint (how our bodies adapt after symptoms are gone). What of the adaptation within that we can't see?

Measles, mumps, polio, etc., didn't make it through immunity, but the flu always mutates. It's a superbug so we can't truly know how many ways it assures its survival - even if for years later to come back in some other form. Something triggers its dormancy or the parent virus simply wakes up from the one coming in and gives a double whammy. Maybe I'm taking the thought too far but it's definitely an interesting thing to think about.

reply to post by Dianec

...the flu planting a memory in our bodies - in its favor, or lying dormant would be a survival mechanism. While we think we have beat it - it has set up shop for a future generation of itself.
We have always looked at it from an immunity standpoint (how our bodies adapt after symptoms are gone). What of the adaptation within that we can't see?

Are you saying latency/dormancy is a survival mechanism for the bug, and the host? ...That it's BOTH? - that latency doesn't just ensure the bug's survival, but also protects the host by triggering an adaptive response to environmental trigger(s)? ...Seems to me that's how it works, more or less.

reply to post by Dianec

...the flu planting a memory in our bodies - in its favor, or lying dormant would be a survival mechanism. While we think we have beat it - it has set up shop for a future generation of itself.
We have always looked at it from an immunity standpoint (how our bodies adapt after symptoms are gone). What of the adaptation within that we can't see?

Are you saying latency/dormancy is a survival mechanism for the bug, and the host? ...That it's BOTH? - that latency doesn't just ensure the bug's survival, but also protects the host by triggering an adaptive response to environmental trigger(s)? ...Seems to me that's how it works, more or less.

RECAP
* A pandemic is looming, and the fatality rate is expected to be very high; however,
* The burden of chronic disease in survivors will be FAR worse, and cases with long term neurological complications including dementia can be expected;
* Current costs of the chronic disease pandemic are already bankrupting many nations; and
* Active and passive euthanasia are considered legitimate counteractions, and related policies already are being implemented in some countries.

Chronic disease to cost $47 trillion by 2030: WEF

…Mental health [including the dementias], which is typically left off lists of leading NCDs, will account for $16 trillion -- a third of the overall $47 trillion anticipated costs.

The CDC's official position on neurological complications/dementia from flu, written by staffer Cyntia Goldsmith, and published by CIDRAP yesterday (4 days after this thread was posted). NOTE: The only way to prove flu viruses infect the CNS is to isolate the virus from the cells, but due to the fear of infection, autopsies are seldom performed.

Report details brain complications in Canada's H5N1 case.

Brain complications in previous H5N1 cases

The authors say brain infections are uncommon in H5N1 cases, although animal studies show that the virus can invade the central nervous system (CNS). They reference a review of human H5N1 cases published in The Lancet in 2008, which cited one patient who had a coma along with evidence of the virus in CSF, suggesting CNS involvement. That review also said a few autopsies of H5N1 victims suggested that the virus replicated in nonrespiratory tissues, including the brain.

...neurologic manifestations are seen occasionally in seasonal flu cases and have been reported in a few H5N1 cases.

...influenza virus infection of the respiratory tract can cause cytokine dysregulation, the intense inflammatory response also known as cytokine storm, and this is believed to be the cause of neurologic complications in seasonal flu cases.

"Seasonal influenza viruses are not thought to be infecting the brain," Uyeki said. "But inflammation can produce a fulminant encephalitis."

In the rare H5N1 cases with neurologic complications, however, the picture seems a little different, in that there has been some evidence of actual infection in the brain, he said.

For example, a 2007 report in The Lancet reported on two H5N1 cases, one of which involved a man who had pneumonia and, while hospitalized, experienced irritability and convulsions followed by decreased consciousness. An autopsy revealed evidence of H5N1 virus infection in his brain, Uyeki said, adding, "So that suggests that H5N1 virus can directly infect brain tissue. H5N1 virus can disseminate from the lungs into the blood, and then spread throughout the body, including to the CNS."

He also noted that in a report in the New England Journal of Medicine in 2005, H5N1 virus was isolated from the CSF in a child with encephalitis who died.

…Uyeki also commented that a few other H5N1 cases with CNS complications have occurred worldwide but have not been reported publicly. "It's not unprecedented, but it's probably rare," he said.

reply to post by soficrow


That's really sad - people getting hit with this stuff. I'm personally sick of being sick. What is floating around my area is long standing. People are getting diagnosed with flu, pnemonia, sttep, and sinus infections - many in place all at once. I think people must be giving to each other over and over because none of this should last for a month. I think our bodies can only take so much N5 or not. My joints have never been in pain like they have been for the past few days. A cytokines storm? Reports in the community match my own - people just not kicking it out and/or only getting worse. Children included.

When a pandemic hits I will know what people feel like - why it has to be the worst thing that can plague us - prolonged illness to the point where one forgets what normal functioning is like. Disabling until death, disability, or hopefully recovery. If you were to begin seeing people around you dying where would the hope lie? I hope I'm not around to see that happen. Their suffering would be difficult to witness but equally as hard would be the mindset.

reply to post by Dianec


I was sick for almost a month this year. Swollen glands that would not go away, severe headache, , pain , inflammation, fevers, alternating with super low body temp, blurry vision, turned to pneumonia, nausea, bloody diarrhea, abdominal pain. I already have asthma and CIDP, Honestly though I was going to die, but the standard rapid flu and strep test were negative. I am FINALLY starting to recover. I honestly do not know what that was, but I never want to see it again. I literally wrote out my will.

Blood tests shown a rise in neutrophils, low platelets and low co2. Now that Im better blood work back to normal. My platelets had dropped to half their normal level. Ct scan rulled out internal bleeding and such. My intestines were so inflamed with this, I think it caused the bleeding. That happened the last week of it.

Flu is just hitting here. I have a feeling it was a flu, but did not register on normal flu test.

reply to post by amatrine


Thank you for sharing. I am going back in tomorrow. I've had no blood work but my entire body is swollen, feet and hands cold and numb - so painful they are stinging, vision disturbance, cold flashes - never had heard of them until they started, bone and joint pain, kidney pain, etc. I feel like an human icicle. I can't get warm. Also - shooting sensations from time to time and a new sore throat. Am I'm on antibiotics! I'm normally pretty darn healthy so am quite bothered by this. I feel like something is seriously wrong yet also think I'm just being a big baby - others going through it too so I'm not dying but sure feel like it.

Now that your better take extra care to not catch anything else. If you do get sick again don't wait to go in. I'm not sure about this antiviral they want to give people "just in case" since I've read it can kill other stuff in your body too. When your sick it's hard to do normal things let alone research. There is just too much going on with newer antidotes and disease. People who got the flu shot are faring well so far (not even catching the other things such as sinus, strep, common cold). Has it inoculated people from all seasonal stuff? Maybe it was a boost to immunity overall that made them super immune this year. I don't know.

reply to post by Dianec

I'm not sure about this antiviral they want to give people "just in case" since I've read it can kill other stuff in your body too.

All meds have a downside but I think you're confusing antivirals with antibacterials/antibiotics. Yogurt helps balance the body after taking antibiotics but I'm not sure if you need to rebalance after antivirals, or what would help. ...Anyone?

Dianec
reply to post by DontTreadOnMe

 

I never thought of it from the chicken pox/shingles view but the flu planting a memory in our bodies - in its favor, or lying dormant would be a survival mechanism. While we think we have beat it - it has set up shop for a future generation of itself.
We have always looked at it from an immunity standpoint (how our bodies adapt after symptoms are gone). What of the adaptation within that we can't see?

Just got it. You're suggesting that what appears to be immunity may be latency. Makes sense. Unfortunately. Then again, all the experts say flu never, never never goes dormant. They say it spends the winter in the tropics then comes back, already mutated.