'Suicide bomber' hits Russia's Volgograd train station

reply to post by zilebeliveunknown


Sure, he has every right to send more people to die in his futile struggle to kill an idea. He's done it for years and it's never worked.

reply to post by antonia


I like this one... she speaks it true...

I'm reading its the wife of another suicide bomber who died earlier this year. Chechen rebels.

reply to post by antonia

This is not going to be solved through violent means. You can find the cell and another will take it's place.

Antonia, what is your proposal then?
To negotiate with savages who're killing innocent people?

Sure, he has every right to send more people to die in his futile struggle to kill an idea. He's done it for years and it's never worked.

That's not how International Law works.
Those regions never have had statehoods.
Imagine what chaos will erupt if it's allowable for regions (which there are many in the world) within internationally recognizable countries to demand independence?

zilebeliveunknown
reply to post by antonia

Antonia, what is your proposal then?
To negotiate with savages who're killing innocent people?

And do you think the Russians haven't killed innocent people? Do you think Putin isn't responsible for the deaths of chechens who had nothing to do with terrorism? Or are all of the people to blame because terrorists came from the place they lived? Should you just kill them all because of that?

No, I'm not taking your argument. The Chechens have never been brought to the table by Putin, there has never been an attempt at peace on his part. He thinks he can rule through fear and it doesn't work as his opposition doesn't fear death. The Russians won't let them go because they want their natural resources. The 1997 agreement fell apart and due to the death of top leaders the movement became radicalized. You can thank Putin for that.


You can also thank Moscow for its refusal to live up to the obligations of the 1997 agreement. It pledged to give economic aid to rebuild the area. It did not honor that pledge. How was Maskhadov going to control the lawlessness in an environment of massive unemployment and poverty? Then Putin had him killed and any semblance of control was gone.

antonia
reply to post by zilebeliveunknown

 

Oh yea, everytime this happens he pounds on Chechnya. It never does any damn good.

People around here act like Putin is some kind of genius. He's little more than a bully in truth.

There is peace in Chechnya these days. So it does do some damn good - unfortunately.

I still think this is the way to sort out stuff like this....replacing the two in the vid with whoever are battling it out


Rainbows
Jane

zilebeliveunknown
reply to post by antonia

 

Imagine what chaos will erupt if it's allowable for regions (which there are many in the world) within internationally recognizable countries to demand independence?

edit on 29-12-2013 by zilebeliveunknown because: (no reason given)

Your read isn't right. The UN has repeatedly endorsed the right of people to self-determination. The Atlantic Charter was signed by 26 nations endorsing that right. If you are going to argue international law then you are doing it wrong.

Article 1 in both the International Covenant on Civil and Political Rights (ICCPR)[22] and the International Covenant on Economic, Social and Cultural Rights (ICESCR)[23] reads: "All peoples have the right of self-determination. By virtue of that right they freely determine their political status and freely pursue their economic, social and cultural development."

The UN declaration of human rights also includes this right.

ispyed


There is peace in Chechnya these days. So it does do some damn good - unfortunately.

There is stability as current the current president is Putin's lackey who is implicated in the torture, murder and kidnapping of many people. This activity is what lead to a move from outright rebellion to this terrorist network you see today. No one who lives there would describe it as safe.

reply to post by antonia

You've taken that out of context.
Self-determination, yes, to elect your political representatives, to have your economy, courts, somewhere even police, BUT in an autonomous region within the internationally recognized state.

zilebeliveunknown
antonia, what is your proposal then?
To negotiate with savages who're killing innocent people?

If I may...

Negotiations worked rather well in ending the Irish terrorists activities here in the UK. We remained resolute in the fact of their attacks and didn't respond (too) heavily - in the end, they lost steam, lost what little support they had and the actual people in Northern Ireland got a voice, rather than having it taken from them by a small group of idiots. Now we've had 15 years of (relative) peace.

The same can apply in the Caucasus. If Russia can stop sending in the tanks, planes and Spetnaz, take the high road and let it burn itself out, then that will open the possibility of more level headed people getting to talk. While there is tit-for-tat violence, there won't be peace.

The same can be said of that Israel problem too. When they respond to a rocket blowing up some fig trees with a fighter jet dropping a 500Lb bomb on someone's house, they can't be too surprised when another rocket blows up another field.

That said, both countries have a well-ingrained defence industry which is vital to their economies, so it isn't surprising they respond in the manner they do.

reply to post by zilebeliveunknown


Which Chechnya doesn't have.

Really, you can look at the failure of the U.S. in the middle east just to see how well the strategy you advocate is going to turn out. It's brought nothing but failure up to this point, yet you cling to it. Literally over a century of failure if we include the Tsars and the Soviets. There is no logic in that. These people will continue to do these things regardless of how many people Putin's puppet-president murders. Furthermore, the action will embolden these people. They will get even more recruits out of the deal.

They'll probably hit the olympics too.

reply to post by antonia

Again, this has nothing to do with Middle East and US.
Chechnya is Republic in Russian Federation therefore equal as other federal subjects of the federation and has voice in federal parliament.
The citizens of Checnya elects their presidents and leadership.
There are no Putin's puppet-presidents in Chechnya which you were led to believe.
Handful of people want independance from federation (mostly terrorists), but this does not reflect the stance of majority.

reply to post by zilebeliveunknown



So you are telling me an unelected man put in his position by Putin isn't a puppet?

chrismarco
reply to post by Biigs

 

Is it wrong to say I'm happy the terrorists are hitting Russia...I'm not happy however that innocent people were killed. So please make that distinction clear....

Putin tries to portray himself as a big brother for the Middle East and North Korea so regardless how many times you feed a big wild bear, eventually they are going to bite you.

Yes, it's very wrong... Innocent people have died. Be mad at Govt's all you want, but don't be happy when innocent people pay the ultimate price for their Govt's shortcomings..

Although there seems to be alot of stress about Chechnya on this thread I wish to point this article at you about why there was a bombing in Volgograd railway station and its got little to do with Chechnya!! Assuming the bomber was a "Black widow", this could very well be being orchestrated by Saudi Arabia.

A couple of months ago the Saudi Arabian foreign minister Bandar Bin Saltan threatened Mr Putin with terrorism at Sochi if the Russians refused to stop supporting Assad in Syria, and allowed the Qatar and Saudi funded insurgents to carry on.

"

Bandar told Putin, "...The terrorist threat is growing in light of the phenomena spawned by the Arab Spring. We have lost some regimes. And what we got in return were terrorist experiences, as evidenced by the experience of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt and the extremist groups in Libya.... As an example, I can give you a guarantee to protect the Winter Olympics in the city of Sochi on the Black Sea next year. The Chechen groups that threaten the security of the games are controlled by us..."

Read the post www.zerohedge.com...

This is the first rational explanation for the explosion I have seen. You can't trust those Saudis.....

reply to post by ispyed



There is some truth to this, but without the ongoing mess in the region the Saudi's would have no foot soldiers. That is the point.

We are born and raised to believe that military dominance is the only path to peace, and violence is the only path to change.
Until the world view changes, it will remain this way.
You can not support violence and war and still be an advocate peace, IMHO.

reply to post by Biigs


Putin / FSB know how to handle these sons of bitches (Read Bandar Saudi masterpuppet). They will hunt them down and kill them all and make them think long and hard before they ever try anything like this again. In the 1980's a Russian Diplomat was kidnapped by Hezbollah in Lebanon. In stead of giving into their demands, the Russians kidnapped the brother of the Hezbollah leader, cut-off his hand and put it into a box with a note and had it delivered to Hezbollah. The note simply said, this is your brother's hand and if our diplomat is not released within 24 hours the next box you will receive will contain your brother's head.

reply to post by antonia


There are plenty of muslims who live in Russia quite happily. Why can't the Chechnya? Armenia and Georgia now live in peace though Georgia had its nose put out of joint when the South Ossetians wanted to join the Russian Federation.

Chechnya made a big mistake when it decided to use islam as a vehicle for its aspirations for independence and it will have to live with that. I have little sympathy for them.