The 10,000 year old civilization which was more advanced than us

Originally posted by nirav_neo
well said Sowhat ! kIu ! I think that the major technological advancements in the world were initiated only during the world wars, the inventions of different manufacturing processes, management systems, new alloys, computers, organics (as weapon),.... and there are lot more things that had roots putting up to world war, a need to struggle for existence, a need to prove stronger, safer, stabe..... and all this led to development and research of new technologies.. and hence here we are !! One invention stumbles upon another invention ! But if imagined another way, what would have happened if there were no world wars, would we have had developed the "so called technicalities" to what we are? similarly the ancient civilizations might not have thought of doing most of the inventions just because they just might not have felt its need.

. isnt it? and this is what we are talking about is 10000 years past, ooh man ! can u imagine the big figure ?? what could have happened in that period?? no one knows? Archeologist can not find each and every evidence on earth. Recently archeologists found the whole city of Dwarka during the time of Pandavas and Kauravas in the sea coasts of Gujarat , India !!

This whole epic script was considered to be just a fantasy or a fairy tale, but now, its a proof that these scripts were not a story but a hard core facts. We need to change our notions and think with the positive and optimistic view point of these scripts. Who know , we can come up and develop a new technology, based on ancient technology !!! ???? !!!

Easy tiger, the Empire State Building is not proof King Kong existed. Local myths and fables always use local place names. Not saying it is a myth or fable but we might need to look into it a bit more.

I just love it how some of you define advanced civilizations with factories, skyscrappers, manufacturing, computers, highways...

More materialistic doesnt have to mean more advanced

More capitalistic doesnt have to mean more advanced

Environmentally awared could on the other hand describe more advanced civilization. We are already heading towards this direction. Take a look at some coutries today enforcing various eco laws. I see them more advanced than others. Maybe these 10000 year old hi tech civilizations dont have any ''noticable'' remains because they were '100% organic'.

More spiritual is more advanced but I dont want to discuss this part cause we are far away from realizing this...

Originally posted by zhuzha

Environmentally awared could on the other hand describe more advanced civilization.

I agree, a society living hand in hand with nature, utilising natures technology which is far more advanced than we give it credit. Organic computers, phospherescent lighting, photosynthesis, solar, wind, water, im sure there are many other non-industrial type technology's that we havent even scratched the suface of that are non-invasive eco friendly. We just seem to be so tied up with fossil fuel technology that many other types have not even been considered. Harry Harrisons Eden series of books is the perfect example of possible advanced technology in the far past, purely fiction of course but it does make you think.

Originally posted by mojo4sale

Originally posted by zhuzha

Environmentally awared could on the other hand describe more advanced civilization.

I agree, a society living hand in hand with nature, utilising natures technology which is far more advanced than we give it credit.

Agreed... but people don't just walk out of the forests and invent a high tech civilization that's efficiently farming food resources and has flying machines and computers, etc. Every civilization develops from earlier stages. We have never seen any civilization that went from throwing rocks at each others to jet planes and spaceships in 5-20 years.

Lower tech civilizations are very hard on the environment when you get large groups together. They'll all throw trash out and around their living quarters (and move when it gets too smelly or trashy)... which really isn't an efficient form of recycling. They will tend to eat up all the resources in the area.

Originally posted by Byrd

Originally posted by mojo4sale

Originally posted by zhuzha

Environmentally awared could on the other hand describe more advanced civilization.

I agree, a society living hand in hand with nature, utilising natures

And agreed again. But surely (and i'm playing devils advocate here), there is the possibility that eco friendly technology may have existed and does not register in modern archaelogical research?

Rocketry has been around since the times of medieval China. This was around the year 0.

Your country has really infused in you a highly ego-centric education. There are too many things that you are saying that you just don't have the capacity, whether it be academic, or analytical, to definitely support.

[edit on 23-7-2007 by cognoscente]

[edit on 23-7-2007 by cognoscente]

Theory: Some civilizations first lived up their primitive tribadelic lives in which they somehow reached higher state of spirituality which gave them knowledge of advanced technology (which is obviously environmentally friendly, organic and possibly energy-free so they didn’t have to go through the materialistic-industrial stage of development that we are going through right now). They use that tech until they screw up something or until something screws them up and they disappear with no trace. Or the trace was hidden by today’s anti free energy and advanced technology propaganda and anti human spirituality evolution manipulators or simply new world order-zionist-reptiles-octopus-demons-aliens-Italians- or whatever you wanna call them so they can profit from us while living in this scientific-domgatic-corporate-materialistic-political-industrial-mind twisting era..

Originally posted by zhuzha


in which they somehow reached higher state of spirituality which gave them knowledge of advanced technology


They use that tech until they screw up something or until something screws them up and they disappear with no trace.


Or the trace was hidden by today’s anti free energy and advanced technology propaganda and anti human spirituality evolution manipulators or simply new world order-zionist-reptiles-octopus-demons-aliens-Italians- or whatever you wanna call them so they can profit from us while living in this scientific-domgatic-corporate-materialistic-political-industrial-mind twisting era..

So American is advance or the opposite?

Originally posted by skychief
I've read of other similar stories of glass being found deep in the deserts of the world (signifying nuclear blasts) and the finds of ancient computer like objects pulled from the Mediterranean sea.

Glass fields found in desert regions tend to be caused by meteor impacts that cause the glass to form by the immense heat of the impacts.
Glass formed by meteor impacts

The other thing you are referring too I believe is the Antikythera mechanism

en.wikipedia.org.... While an amazing piece of work, it is only indicative of the abilities of humanity, not of some 10,000 year old advanced civilization. All the ancient civilizations had some pretty amazing things. To learn more about them I highly recommend watching the History Channel's Ancient Discoveries show. Each one of them amazes me.

www.history.com...

[edit on 23-7-2007 by pavil]

CR - A very good thread to start. Thanks. I'am a keen observer of this ancient and fantastic mystery. I'am not qualified to delve into the technical aspects of what is written in those amazing books but from what I can make out:

1. The authenticity of the time period of the Vedas is proved beyond doubt due to the huge amount of astronomical data in them. They can be dated back to thousands of years.

2. They come from reliable sources and are the result of collective intelligence of thousands of people over hundereds of years.

3. The detail in which they have defined and described some of these phenomenon is mind boggling. I don't think it is a fiction of someone's imagination.

I was so fascinated about my secondary research on the subject that I went ahead and started the threat below here on ATS some months back. My thread deals with only the subject of Flying Machines in Ancient India.

Shocking - Can this be true? Aeroplanes in Ancient India?

Yes,it's true that there are no HARD evidences to prove the authenticity but I think a time will come when all of us will be in awe. And the argument that the Vedas are just religious text is illogical. They are a collective body of knowledge. We all will realize this sooner or later.It might not happen immediately in our lifetime,but I think it will happen.


AryanWatch

I was under the impression that a nuclear blast/ bomb or what not, left radoactive particals, so shouldnt we be able to detect gamma radiation or what ever it is ? i might be wrong, i aint no expert on bombs but im sure that there is some left over, or the radiation coukld of gone after such long time.

Take Care, Vix.

I don't think anything that advanced could have happened 10,000 years ago, but I do wonder what would happen if a huge EMP went off crippling all the electronic media, all its information stored, and perhaps a nuke.

Would that reset to a year zero for those who survived? Say those that survived where just average Joes, didn't know about politics, didn't know about creating advanced super computers - at best they can build a house due to having lego as a kid.

Originally posted by Chriswok
I don't think anything that advanced could have happened 10,000 years ago, but I do wonder what would happen if a huge EMP went off crippling all the electronic media, all its information stored, and perhaps a nuke.

I think there may have been quite a few such peaks of humanity in the 250 000 years that we have been around. This current one took only 10 000 years, so in theory there is room for 24 previous times we could have done the same.
My personal views are based on a lot of data, studied over decades, which points to at least one ancient advanced people, and likely more than one.
There is plenty of evidence supporting such an idea, some of which fits poorly into presently accepted theories of our past.
Not many folks have the time or interest to bother studying these anomalies, though, and prefer to accept the 'experts' theories.
Often, these theories can be easily disproven, if one only cares to look into the subject, but they don't.
One such piece of evidence is the great pyramid at Giza. Deep study of this one structure is, imo, good supporting evidence of these ancient greats.

I have to agree that there has definitely been the time available for a prior civilisation to advance beyond the stage we have reached but hard evidence is yet to be discovered. It's unthinkable that ALL evidence of an advanced society with radical technology could be wiped out so easily.

Technological advances are driven by improvements in survival methods like agricultural machinery etc so a large enough percentage of the population has free time to pursue and improve their science ideas - time that would have been spent hunting for dinner and avoiding being eaten by larger predators in a more primitive age. As only only a very small percentage would actually be suited to the pursuit of science the remainder benefit in terms of increased leisure time. Evidence of the earliest stages of an industrial revolution along with the infrastructure for exploiting natural resources would be very hard to conceal.

So if anything is ever discovered to confirm these ancient advanced societies it will most likely be something like an ipod, TV, digital watch or cooking appliance

I must admit that the most enduring form of information storage/retrieval ever developed is carving it on a piece of stone but the discovery of a fossilised ballpoint pen or its equivalent would be tantalising evidence.

As yet there's nothing but myth and cryptic carvings but who knows

Coincidently I am just reading David Childress Hatcher's "Vimana, aircarft of ancient India & Atlantis" right now, which is what the original post started off about.

I haven't read all the posts on this thread, but can note a few things:

1) Recently discovered city west of India in the sea reported to be 9000 years old (already known by the local fisherman for generations, although none of the history books write about it, which is why it has been neglected).

2) If civilization ended as we know it today, how much information about this planet would really survive. Most information is now stored digitally. With regards to archaeological evidence, there is plenty of evidence supporting advanced civilizations, we've just been led to believe otherwise (or creationism, or Darwinism, as long as it is one of the two).

3) Who says that advanced civilizations in the past were anything like our world is today? They appeared to work mainly with natural elements, which in my opinion an advanced civilization should/would rather than the consumptive greed orientated consumables produced today which have no regard to the planet's health.

4) The story of India's advanced civilization talks of different eras, known as Yugas. These Yugas can bee regarded as periods of 6000 years long, or 360 years long (a bit like the different mayan calendar systems). Their history teaches that a Lumeria type civilization was destroyed around 22000 BC, and survivors split into different groups. This resulted in the Atlantean civilization, which was a war type culture like the US is unfortunately turning into, looking for global hegenomy, and the Indian civilization as two main ones. The Indian civilization was focused on the spiritual and did not believe in war. The Atlanteans eventually tried to subdue the Indian race, whom used their powers and helped Atlantis sink. These are translations from ancient texts leading back to 4000BC, and earlier (no earlier copies found). Note, in 4000BC they were not aware that the reality of Atlantis would be a discussion point 6000 years later, they simply wrote down their history as they knew it, never questioning its validity. There is therefore no misleading here, and no conspiracy, history just needs to be accepted for what it really is, whether it fits in one's personal beliefs or not.

When I was young I vowed never to become like my father, now I become more like him every day and proud of it. Perceptions change over time, so maybe judgements are best left till all the information is on the table....

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
If there was a nuclear catastrophe, why isn't there any residual radiation?

And the "vrimanas" -- there isn't anything at all that describes their propulsion system; all the stuff I read at your links is simply guesses by modern day UFO-ologists.

Sorry. I think there are a lot of undiscovered things under the sun, but there's no hard evidence for a mohenjo-daro or harappan civilization with advanced technology.

Actually they have detected radiation at many of these Indian sites. Also metallic artifacts do not survive the test of time. They tend to oxidize and fall apart. That's why you'd never see skyscrapers or any electronic devices.

Radiation still so intense, the area is highly dangerous A heavy layer of radioactive ash in Rajasthan, India, covers a three-square mile area, ten miles west of Jodhpur. Scientists are investigating the site, where a housing development was being built.

Some more evidence can be found here
www.s8int.com...

Dr Strangecraft,

Thanks for your posts, you make some interesting points and are obviously well studied on this. I have been studying this area for some time also and I see evidence supporting both sides.

For anyone interested in this topic and willing to look at it from an open minded perspective (I think you have to if you want to understand the possibility of ancient civilizations with nuclear technology) and who has two hours to spare, go to www.tv-links.co.uk , click on documentaries and watch "destruction of Atlantis" by Michael Tsarion (excuse his presentation techniques, but his information is very very broad and goes into depth where necessary)

Regarding your comment on Mohenjo Daro, why is this not an area worth discussing to you. I have seen the pictures of the remnants of countless people on the streets there from thousands of years ago, and the radioactivity levels are 50x the norm (is this why you don't want it discussed?).

Also note that in the Gobi desert there is the green crystalline formation as a result of extremely high surface temperatures. The dead sea has radiation isotopes dating back to approx 1800BC and has radiation levesl higher than normal. There are areas in France, ireland and South america where the process of rock fusion (still unexplained today) has occured.

Interesting posts, keep it up!

Originally posted by SevenThunders

Originally posted by Off_The_Street
If there was a nuclear catastrophe, why isn't there any residual radiation?

And the "vrimanas" -- there isn't anything at all that describes their propulsion system; all the stuff I read at your links is simply guesses by modern day UFO-ologists.

Sorry. I think there are a lot of undiscovered things under the sun, but there's no hard evidence for a mohenjo-daro or harappan civilization with advanced technology.

Actually they have detected radiation at many of these Indian sites.

But only in the areas where there are deposits of natural uranium that they mine.

Also metallic artifacts do not survive the test of time. They tend to oxidize and fall apart. That's why you'd never see skyscrapers or any electronic devices.

High tech materials are very durable and not usually metal. Plastics and ceramics are particularly durable. We don't find any ancient synthetic compounds.

And the word, "vimana" means "temple roof."

Radiation still so intense, the area is highly dangerous A heavy layer of radioactive ash in Rajasthan, India, covers a three-square mile area, ten miles west of Jodhpur. Scientists are investigating the site, where a housing development was being built.

We've looked into this before and the statement there is rather overblown.

Some more evidence can be found here
www.s8int.com...

Others have pointed out that the site isn't reliable. You might not want to use that to support your arguments.

Hi Byrd,

If you want extra information on Vimanas, check out Maharshi Bharadwaaja's - Vymaanika Shaastra where three main types of Vimanas are discussed (and they don't refer to different types of roof temples ;-) )

Please also note that Uranium deposits give of different radiation signatures than nuke sites.

Past technologically advanced civilizations (and probably advanced in many other ways) do not necessarily need to be representative of our present society with cans, plastics etc. Thinking they would be the same is almost drawing to an ignorant conclusion (not meant to offend, but does highlight the amount of speculative assumption being used by the author).

Does this mean that the other information is then also to be regarded as assumptive and unresearched?

There seems to be plenty of evidence suggesting past advanced technology not understood today (Giza Egypt has enough examples to validate this alone), the only thing that really seems to be absent is the willingness to embrace the possibility (which any good researcher would do until sufficient evidence proves otherwise).

I write this only to entise further discussion, not in order to be right or prove someone else wrong.

This is just complete speculation:

A few generations ago before the present one humanity had just developed steam engines for the second time in history and came up with applications that sparked the industrial revolution. To me thats amazing that in just a couple of hundred years we went from horses to where we are today.

One of things I have been wondering about is Alcohol as a fuel source. The whole idea of bio fuels intrigues me. Bio Diesel is soybean oil and ethanol, grain alcohol. The diesel engine itself was designed almost one hundred years ago to run off of vegetable oil. Bio Diesel can propel tanks, helicopters, planes, trains. Bio diesel is already used by the US military to suppliment JP8 and it is planned to replace it as the primary fuel of the US military.

We know for a fact that humans have been farming and fermenting as far back as 12,000 years ago. How hard would of it been to either invent a Combustion or Steam Engine with copper and possibly other metals used in early metallurgy. We know for a fact that copper has been worked for over 10,000 years.

Another idea is ceramics. Today Ceramic engines are made and are comparable to Diesel engines. We know for a fact that Ceramics have been made as far back 26,000 years ago. There is pottery dating back to 12,000 years ago from Japan. Me personally I like the idea of Ceramics instead of Copper. It seems more plausible. The field of technical ceramics is amazing. It is used in modern times for tank armor, capacitors, superconductors, data storage, lubricants, insulators, semiconductors, ceramic blades, body armor, turbine engines, and bio ceramics: teeth and bones.

Heres another oddbit. The Baghdad Battery which I know is only 2300 years old. It is a Ceramic Battery with a Copper Core. It needed only Fruit Juice to work. On their own they dont have much Voltage output, but when put in Network Arrays they do.

So we have Alcohol, Vegetable Oil, Fruit Juice, Ceramics, and maybe Copper. Is it that hard to imagine that some human as smart as we are didnt put 2 and 2 together and build a Ceramic Engine and Ceramic Batteries?









[edit on 4/8/07 by MikeboydUS]