A smarty pants scientist makes an easy anaology about our planet - And now I am scared.

pikestaff

Mamatus
reply to post by watchitburn

 

How many test tubes do you think we have? Humanity has been severely reduced in population several times though out history. At one time we were down to 5000 humans world wide. This IMO will be the correction. A severe reduction in population. The seas provide well over 60% of all the worlds food. Once the fish are gone the world will go to war over food. I am gonna have to go with David Suzuki and the other scientists he speaks of. 59 minutes and counting


I find your figure interesting, could I have some more please? such as wheat tonnage, rice tonnage, potato tonnage, fish tonnage? I eat fish once a week, meat products four time a week, the other two days, other products, such as navy beans, for a hot meal.

pikestaff

Mamatus
reply to post by watchitburn

 

How many test tubes do you think we have? Humanity has been severely reduced in population several times though out history. At one time we were down to 5000 humans world wide. This IMO will be the correction. A severe reduction in population. The seas provide well over 60% of all the worlds food. Once the fish are gone the world will go to war over food. I am gonna have to go with David Suzuki and the other scientists he speaks of. 59 minutes and counting


I find your figure interesting, could I have some more please? such as wheat tonnage, rice tonnage, potato tonnage, fish tonnage? I eat fish once a week, meat products four time a week, the other two days, other products, such as navy beans, for a hot meal.

Just done some 'googling' most on Wikipedia;
2009 fish production, all sources, 141.3 million tonnes.
wheat, worldwide, 2012, 674.9 million metric tons.
rice, 2012, 469 million metric tons.
potato's 2010, 324 million tons.

I think the above figures outstrip fish by rather a lot more than 60 %, but yes, it is bad that fish stocks are depleted, I touch by Tuna from the pacific anymore, and if there is no 'origin' on the can, I dont buy it.

Tusks
reply to post by JadeStar

 

The Earth likely has some feedback loops that help maintain near steady-state for average temperatures. Volcanoes, clouds, dust---and we don't know what else. We do, however, know we're in an interglacial period.

There is no feedback loop which deals with waste heat other than the place becoming less habitable for us.

Perhaps that's your feedback loop? We die off.

The test tube analogy is used by the professor who has a Youtube video of a lecture he did on maths and exponential growth.

If you look at the Worlds population then in 1955 it was only around 2.5 Billion, 50 years later it had more than doubled and all of the increased growth is coming from Africa & Asia, so I'd say what we need to do is to is spend our money on teaching them about birth control, especially since they are traditionally (especially Africa) places where food is in short supply.

Maybe that's why they are migrating into Europe at faster and faster rates, but IMHO all that is happening is that they are exporting their problems to everyone else.

Education has to be the answer?

Power_Semi
The test tube analogy is used by the professor who has a Youtube video of a lecture he did on maths and exponential growth.

If you look at the Worlds population then in 1955 it was only around 2.5 Billion, 50 years later it had more than doubled and all of the increased growth is coming from Africa & Asia, so I'd say what we need to do is to is spend our money on teaching them about birth control, especially since they are traditionally (especially Africa) places where food is in short supply.

Maybe that's why they are migrating into Europe at faster and faster rates, but IMHO all that is happening is that they are exporting their problems to everyone else.

Education has to be the answer?

Your post is dangerously close to the R word.

But to answer your question, the key is not simply more birth control education.

These people, despite your low opinion of them, are not stupid, they are just as human as Europeans or anyone else in the "global north". They know what birth control is and how to use it.

There are cultural and systemic reasons why things are the way they are, where they are and they aren't any different than what was experienced in the past in Europe.

The answer to solving it is what happened in Europe: industrialization and development, which drives education which then leads to having less children. It was not long ago that Europeans had tons of kids, especially Catholics, to work farms, family businesses and take care of them in old age. Nor was it long ago that predominantly Catholic countries in Europe were among the poorest.

Having tons of kids is the oldest "social safety net" there is. In absence of any other social safety net, having a big family is the default for humanity.

The irony is that the one nation which is doing the most to invest in the industrialization of Africa and Asia is the most populous nation on Earth: China

Industrialization without increasing efficiency and sustainability by a lot will lead to a bigger problem than we have now.

And again, PEOPLES are not the problem. SYSTEMS are the problem. Change the system that sees it best to keep the situation in most of those countries as it is and then you can start to address the problems. Simply ignoring the systemic problems in the global economy does nothing for anyone.

reply to post by Mamatus


This is why war and depopulation happen, why cigs are legal but not weed, why cancer has no cure. We are controlled to slow down the time it will take till we hit 100%.....

reply to post by Mamatus


People like to fear and criticise the Chinese - rightly so in some cases (it would seem) - but they got probably the most important political decision there is right: Population control.

If able to, dumb animals will eat all of the resources in their ecosystem and natures answer to that is a massive cull in population due to starvation.

So the Chinese have shown they're capable of being more than dumb animals. Are the the rest of us?

Sad probability is that in the west such a rule would involve economic factors - the rich would be except. And because of this the rule would never stick long enough to effect change in our presently doomed course.

SixX18
reply to post by Mamatus

 

This is why war and depopulation happen, why cigs are legal but not weed,

I live in Washington state. the last part of what you said is not true here.

reply to post by pikestaff


I think that crap is in the North Atlantic now.

I think that Furford guy is full of crap, but they do plan to fully destroy the surface and inhabitants of the world, they will go under ground and wait, The Morlock's come the baby eaters.

This is totally a sick mess and these people control the world, we let them, because we stupid.

reply to post by OOOOOO


Lots of response to the OP that refute the nonsense and more frightening lots of stars if they are agreeing , anyhow, did anyone even take the time to look at the youtube video that I posted that debunks his very flawed interpretation of exponential growth ? and what amounts to ultimately as myself and others have referred to as propaganda, I won't fully say deny ignorance but I would say his case is very flawed and it is being used to induce fear.

WhiteAlice
reply to post by flice

 

Where our biggest problem is in terms of sustainability on this planet is our levels of waste and consumption. Quite frankly, we need to stop acting like ignorant bacteria that need a new iPhone the moment one comes out and start actually living, collectively, within our means in the truest of senses. On some level, it's like we all know that things are not good enough to have babies but we also have to really start comprehending that what we are drawing from this little test tube of ours is more than what our current population needs.

edit on 22/12/13 by WhiteAlice because: added link

i totally agree waste and consumption is a bad way to live. but this type of living is too ingrained in our society’s conscience. It will take a very serious event to snap people out of their sleep to make a change. We each have to change the way we buy and use products. Vote with your dollar and the companies will follow the lead.

phinubian
reply to post by OOOOOO

 

Lots of response to the OP that refute the nonsense and more frightening lots of stars if they are agreeing , anyhow, did anyone even take the time to look at the youtube video that I posted that debunks his very flawed interpretation of exponential growth ? and what amounts to ultimately as myself and others have referred to as propaganda, I won't fully say deny ignorance but I would say his case is very flawed and it is being used to induce fear.

Regardless of whether you accept what he says, we do face a looming crisis (well our grand and great-grand kids will) with the production of waste heat.

That's a themodynamic problem which we will face if we don't figure out how to recover much more of that waste heat as energy than we traditionally have.

reply to post by ShaeTheShaman


Earth will not sustain herself forever if we, as natures greatest conscious creators, don't sustain the planet that needs only to 'be' for us to exist.

People who have destroyed their own world do not deserve to get a reprieve from colonizing another planet. Hopefully if there are aliens monitoring this world they will not let us get off, and nip the planet destroying human race in the bud. Saving other worlds from us.

Sovaka
reply to post by webedoomed

 

Keeping to your namesake I see.

I disagree.

We don't have a runaway "greenhouse" issue.
We have more than enough plants at the moment to clear our atmosphere if we stopped polluting it.

plants that take in carbon dioxide have a limit to how much they can take in at any one time, it's basic biology. the people that should be worried are the 20 somethings. I have no vast wealth, no political power, no influential contacts, so my only power would come from being one person in a mass demonstration. if I were an alien, why would I even make contact with a lifeform that cannot sustain itself, due to overindulgence...no advanced alien race or group would want to let earth's "genie" out of it's destructive bottle...with that said, the only thing that might save humanity, would be a disease that could kill off a high percentage of humans...this should accomplish 2 things....1.) it will reduce population by the billions...and 2.) if that happens, the horrendous and catastrophic lesson that is learned, will convince even the most ignorant to achieve sustainability.

maybe this has already been happening for eons in a cyclical manner....humans get up to around our evolutionary level, and then boom, back to living out of caves. the building of stone structures and/or carving out of stone the warnings to future generations, might have been the only way our past civilizations thought these warnings would last long enough to break the cycle

jimmyx

Sovaka
reply to post by webedoomed

 

Keeping to your namesake I see.

I disagree.

We don't have a runaway "greenhouse" issue.
We have more than enough plants at the moment to clear our atmosphere if we stopped polluting it.

bad 2nd post

edit on 23-12-2013 by jimmyx because: (no reason given)

reply to post by Logman

Logman
reply to post by Mamatus

 

If civilisation is 6000 years old and we are in the 59th minute. We have 6000 years left.

David Suzuki, owned by his own analogy.

you misunderstood the math behind.. time is not exponential, only the growth is.
if both time and growth were exponential, the relationship will be linear.

meanwhile in japan, government pays citizens to have children...

I don't know what the rest of y'all are gonna do, but imma keep on believing in the God of Heaven and Earth; the same way Noah did. What? You don't think they called him "foolish". "Cray-cray"?

let them! go.
if you have ways to make Mars livable.
then use that to make Earth livable aging!

First STOP them! destroying Earth.
and raping her for all she has.

we spend millions on telescopes and other space and science things.
we need to stop for 25 (or more) years
and spend the money on saving earth.

and STOP ever one from making profit
from bleeding the earth.
this will be the hardest part.
it would be easier to make Venue livable!

reply to post by JadeStar


Did you watch the video ? the case he is making has been tackled before, by scientists and studies that are out there, it is not that I disagree, it is that all facts and math need to represent reality, just like someone else said in the thread, all things are not linear , there are many other factors to consider before putting out the scare tactics to those who don't consider or know what is missing from his equations.