Christians, A Call To Strength From A Dissenter Of Your Faith

ghostfacekilah00
Words of wisdom on the matter of defending your faith from Dr. Peter Kreeft, who I think might be a saint.
www.youtube.com...

this guy was great! is that a Catholic?

reply to post by Cuervo


What a nice OP, Cuervo.

Thank you for putting things into perspective.

Many Christian can't defend their faith because they and their leaders (unwittingly, unknowingly or willfully) do not believe they have a single Book that hold ALL the words of God (that is those that God wanted them to have) that they can hold in their hand and believe that those words true, holy and without error.

And as a result their leadership structure in their churches are not Biblical and therefore end up being entertained and worshiping religious celebrities instead of Jesus Christ.

the biggest problem is even with the little of God's word they hold and have they reject it and here are some things that happen when you reject the words of God.

Please remember that I am calling out Christians here not so much the unsaved even though I have included them.

The following are some general Scriptural observations in regards to what happens to a person when they reject the Holy words of God:

REJECT GOD’S WORDS = EVIL
[Rejection of the Holy words of God always carries a price]

I am convinced that when a person (lost or saved) chooses to deliberately ignore, turn away from, change, reject, or go against God’s words that there is a spiritual operation that takes place within that person which is as sure as the law of gravity or the two universal laws of Thermodynamics. The deliberate turning away from or rejection of the Holy words of God perversely affects our Heart, our Mind, and our Conscience (i.e. Our Faculties), which in turn adversely affects our Body, Soul, & Spirit (i.e. Our Substance). And no one (saved or lost) can anymore avoid the consequences of their conduct or behavior than they can avoid getting hurt (or killed) after falling off a 100 foot cliff. [Galatians 6:7]

The following list is only a partial exposition of what happens to a person’s faculties (be they man or woman – or whether they are lost or saved) when they deliberately choose to ignore, change, turn away from, reject, or go against God’s words.

THE HEART
Proverbs 4:23 Keep thy heart with all diligence; for out of it are the issues of life.

• Is hardened (John 12:40)
• Is darkened (Romans 1:21)
• Is blinded (Ephesians 4:18)
∆ Becomes EVIL (Hebrews 3:12)

THE CONSCIENCE
Acts 24:16 And herein do I exercise myself, to have always a conscience void of offence toward God, and toward men.

• Is defiled (Titus 1:15)
• Is seared (1Timothy 4:2)
∆ Becomes EVIL (Hebrews 10:22)

THE MIND
Ezekiel 11:5 And the Spirit of the LORD fell upon me, and said unto me, Speak; Thus saith the LORD; Thus have ye said, O house of Israel: for I know the things that come into your mind, every one of them.

• Is carnal (Romans 8:5-8)
• Is blinded (2 Corinthians 3:14; 2 Corinthians 4:4)
• Is alienated from God (Colossians 1:21)
• Becomes corrupt (2 Corinthians 11:3; 1 Timothy 6:5; 2 Timothy 3:8)
• Becomes defiled (Titus 1:15)
• Becomes reprobate (Romans 1:28; 2 Timothy 3:8)
∆ Becomes EVIL (Acts 14:2)

CONCLUSION: Rejection of God’s Words = EVIL!

When people mess with God’s words - God gives them up to:

“uncleanness through the lusts of their own hearts” [Romans 1:24]

“vile affections” [Romans 1:26]

“a reprobate mind” [Romans 1:28]

God chooses “their delusions” [Isaiah 66:1-5] and sends them “strong delusion” [2Thessalonians 2:10-12]

NOTE: Please remember these observations are "partial", and I never even covered the adverse affect these things have on our "Substance" (i.e. our body, soul, or spirit). Is it any wonder WHY the whole world is in the shape it's in, or WHY Christians (and the churches of God), which have chosen conform to the world [Romans 12:2], are in the sad shape that they are in?

And the result in the church as it rejects the word of God the only thing that happens is a falling away from that word. to replace the word they have experiences, entertainments, extra-Biblical teachings/doctrines, worldliness, and a host of other carnal inventions of man which include hatred for those who don't agree with them or try to lead them according to the preserved word of God.

reply to post by Cuervo


Honestly, few will even get the point of this thread.

My girlfriend is Christian and I am not. I go to church with her once a month. Your post describes are relationships in a way. My tolerance towards her faith has put faith in her that goodness can exist without faith. Through are differences we have only become stronger when we learn to live and let live. Frankly, she was a hard nut to crack.

"We grow even taller from water from another."

I just made that up, hehehe.

reply to post by eisegesis


Check out Akragon. You two have things in common.

Sorry for going OT, Cuervo....
and sorry for referencing a member in his absence.
But still: eisegisis, check out Akragon.

SisyphusRide
this guy was great! is that a Catholic?

Yes, Peter Kreeft is a Catholic writer and apologist. My favourite book of his is Between Heaven and Hell, in which he speculates on the possible conversation held in the afterlife by three famous people who died on the same day, 22 November, 1963 -- John F. Kennedy, C.S. Lewis and Aldous Huxley.

reply to post by wildtimes


Hey now, don't apologize.

If you're a believer, from what I've learned.....God forgives!
Just kidding...

Akragon you say? My eyes have been here for a while and have not caught his story. Good people though.

*Sounds off loud trumpet that only Akragon can hear*

If you are listening, I would be honored to swap a few stories. On topic of course!

The Bible does NOT interpret itself and God did NOT give everyone reading the Bible, the authority to interpret it. God gave that authority to the Church, logic, the same Church canonized Scripture.

If you are not Catholic, a help, read the footnotes of the English translation (Douay-Rheims) of the
first Bible, the Latin Vulgate for difficult verses. www.drbo.org...

This is why it is a heresy ~ Private interpretation of Scripture, its fruit, division and error.

Catechism of the Catholic Church

119 "It is the task of exegetes to work, according to these rules, towards a better understanding and explanation of the meaning of Sacred Scripture in order that their research may help the Church to form a firmer judgement. For, of course, all that has been said about the manner of interpreting Scripture is ultimately subject to the judgement of the Church which exercises the divinely conferred commission and ministry of watching over and interpreting the Word of God."88

But I would not believe in the Gospel, had not the authority of the Catholic Church already moved me.
*St. Augustine*

reply to post by Cuervo


My two cents..
If Jesus were ever real (not here to debate it) he'd be tossing in his little grave in the sky, considering how his teachings were twisted and warped.

My two points is quite simple.
* Jesus talked to his god in 'private', he taught this as a lession to avoid 'idoling' of any god. The reason is simple - To make an idol is to have a figure that is agree'd on; thus prejudgements, expectations, etc are made, and in turn anyone can say god did this, god says to do that. Jesus did this, Jesus did that. Then everyone under that faith has to believe it instead of hearing and having a *personal* relationship with God, because its all caught up in the radio static of bull# your brain is being fed. When he wanted you to spread the word, it was simple. Go into your room, close the door, open your hearts without an 'idol' in your mind and listen to what 'god' has to say. This is the way hinduism has continued the tradition in worshipping the lord.

* Because 'god' will talk to you if you learn to listen, and honestly you can't listen when you got people throwing words down your throat telling you to do this, and jesus did this that and the third.. Its kinda like trying to talk on the phone to someone who is at a noisy concert. You can't hear, see, or understand anything the only thing you are getting is your own forced fed cancelled out beliefs on what you 'interpret' the person is saying.

* Jesus understood the general rule of stupidity in great numbers and this is why he encouraged the religious and spiritualness to be quiet, instead of a guided meditation where the only thing you accomplish is what the disk tells you. (there's a quote somewhere in there i'm sure someone will be able to restate)

Last but not least I am NOT christian, I was forced into christianity as a child and got forcefed a load of crap and never had a 'true' relationship with anyone but the damn pastor. No offense rev you were nice and all, but your *Not* god no matter how much you preach.

Since then I have taken things I have learned and developed a true relationship with god. I must say my life has been a lot better now that i'm not sitting there listening to some guy talk about a supposid book thats 2,000 years + old.

The only thing I have been thankful to Christianity for.. well the interesting history of war, and shame that has been brought to all soils dirtied and tainted because of the inquisition. Honestly, those that were involved in such things I can't even begin to see how they could sit there impale women and children for the sake of a god JESUS specifically told us to worship in private.

The inquisition is responsible for so much loss of historical records, the complete wipe outs of towns, and total destruction of our human history, our past.

This my dear is why Jesus told people to speak to god in private and he will listen. This is why the bible says no 'idol gods' before me, the ignorance alone to the obvious statements is astonishing.

Do you really think god wanted you to mass murder women and children? NO, surely Satan was involved in that somehow huh? The bad guy is a guy that by default is going to inherit 80-90% of the world's population anyway.. christian, pagan, or any other.

(*crosses fingers* oh pick me, pick me!)

In the bible itself it says it is as hard for a rich man to get into heaven as it is for a camel to go through the eye of a needle. Yet sitting there leading 80% + of the world into a false belief that if they are a 'good boy or girl' they will get into heaven, is a load of crap.

Con artist have emerged recently because of this, this pathetic weakness humans have to grouping up to do stupid things for falsified beliefs, saying the world is going to end; the rapture is upon us; and the 9, only to walk away with close to 22 million dollars in assets. That people if they stopped going to church, closed the door and spent a few minutes in their room listening, thinking, relaxing, and allowing themselves to be open to God wouldn't have lost. That was the most recent winner of the May Rapture, yup that guy walked away with 22 million dollars, because people gave him their cars, their homes, and you wanna know the sad thing. They didn't get it back, so yes, continue to go to church agree with an idol for a god. Void all of the true teachings that the man died for, he let himself die simply to show the fact that people are idiots, especially in great numbers. (Yes, the masses that killed him were the example that your suppose to sit there and go omfg you idiots to, but nope the blame gets played out oh he's response no your responsible etc..)

Anyway thats my two cents - I really don't care what anyone says in reply to this, fact is you can do your own research and see its true, or actually use your head and recall your history lessions.

Continue Preaching - cause in the end when people actually do realize that the church is just a way to brainwash people to die for what they believe in, considering circumstances... i dunno maybe if we are lucky they will snap out of it. when the time comes.. doubt it.. so GOOD JOB!

What was that that the iraqs promised? 7/12 virgins in heaven should you kill yourself for god's cause.
Dunno about you but I kinda like learning about the world, and enjoying life. I don't want to sacrifice a life that was a 'gift' to me just because some mortal human being tells me to.

(no offense if god wanted us dead - judging by the flood he sent b4 to wipe out the sinners, he'd do it again, or nuke us like he did that sin city (forget name in bible thou)) We don't need anyone to tell us how to believe or how to have a relationship with 'god' or any other divine being.



Peace,
Black Arrow,

colbe
The Bible does NOT interpret itself and God did NOT give everyone reading the Bible, the authority to interpret it. God gave that authority to the Church, logic, the same Church canonized Scripture."

Thats kinda mean...

Acts 17:24, "God...dwelleth not in temples made with hands;"
(Acts 7:48; 17:24). Our body is now the temple of God, and the Spirit of God dwells within us

Again, who said anything about sitting there and idoling a bible, when you can have a real conversation with god? If he loves everyone so much you don't think he would speak to them? Tell them what they need to hear? They aren't Authorized to speak to god? God gave no authority to the church, in any bible. He gave the people the 'church' within their own bodies, the ability to make up their mind for themselves not sit there and listen to 'oh you don't have the authority because your not the church of *insert name here*.

That is a very anal and rude statement.


Here's a question for you. Since when did god take away my 'free will'? My ability to think, reason, and interpret for myself?


Last but not least, Since when does some organization of humans( Not God - for he gave us NO list of people throughout time to interpret this book), have the right to say who can interpret and who can't? Now you just crossed god and myself, cause as far as I am aware I am his child to, yet you straight up tell me I am not worthy enough to interpret god because I did not ordain myself as Priest of your particular church.




Your not violating my 'temple', for its not yours its my own, and God is within me. I don't care if the POPE himself tells you to. God who is within me forbids it, as do I. I'm not into wild religious orgies either, so the 'church' and anyone else who tells me god did not give me the ability to hear/listen and interpret for myself can go right back under the rock they came from, until they learn true god spoken from his own words and not from the mouths and hands of a human.


Peace,
I am the Priest of my own temple, and that is where I worship, and learn the works of god himself.

BlackArrow

colbe
The Bible does NOT interpret itself and God did NOT give everyone reading the Bible, the authority to interpret it. God gave that authority to the Church, logic, the same Church canonized Scripture."

Thats kinda mean...

Acts 17:24, "God...dwelleth not in temples made with hands;"
(Acts 7:48; 17:24). Our body is now the temple of God, and the Spirit of God dwells within us

Again, who said anything about sitting there and idoling a bible, when you can have a real conversation with god? If he loves everyone so much you don't think he would speak to them? Tell them what they need to hear? They aren't Authorized to speak to god? God gave no authority to the church, in any bible. He gave the people the 'church' within their own bodies, the ability to make up their mind for themselves not sit there and listen to 'oh you don't have the authority because your not the church of *insert name here*.

That is a very anal and rude statement.

edit on 9-12-2013 by BlackArrow because: fixing quote

Here's a question for you. Since when did god take away my 'free will'? My ability to think, reason, and interpret for myself?

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Last but not least, Since when does some organization of humans( Not God - for he gave us NO list of people throughout time to interpret this book), have the right to say who can interpret and who can't? Now you just crossed god and myself, cause as far as I am aware I am his child to, yet you straight up tell me I am not worthy enough to interpret god because I did not ordain myself as Priest of your particular church.

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edit on 9-12-2013 by BlackArrow because: collection

edit on 9-12-2013 by BlackArrow because: (no reason given)

How rude to use the word "anal", it is a slam, a put down, not nice. I haven't crossed God, He knows who compiled the Bible and who He gave the authority to interpret it. You can't be your own pope, it doesn't
work. Remember in the Old Covenant, God named a spiritual leader. The same in the New Covenant.

You can look at history, the Bible is not Protestant, it is Catholic. The Canon was decided by the
Church, Pope Damasus choices in 382. The same on interpretation, a divine gift and why it is important to read a Catholic Bible, the Douay-Rheims is a very good one, it is the English translation of the first Bible,
the Latin Vulgate. Read the footnotes on difficult verses.

The terrible fruit of "private judgment" of Scripture is division (40 thousand Protestant groups, denominations, non-denominations and home churches). The other is heresy, error, OSAS and the imputation heresy are two examples.

Remember for the time ahead.

God bless you,


colbe

How rude to use the word "anal", it is a slam, a put down, not nice. I haven't crossed God, He knows who compiled the Bible and who He gave the authority to interpret it. You can't be your own pope, it doesn't
work. Remember in the Old Covenant, God named a spiritual leader. The same in the New Covenant.

You can look at history, the Bible is not Protestant, it is Catholic. The Canon was decided by the
Church, Pope Damasus choices in 382. The same on interpretation, a divine gift and why it is important to read a Catholic Bible, the Douay-Rheims is a very good one, it is the English translation of the first Bible,
the Latin Vulgate. Read the footnotes on difficult verses.

The terrible fruit of "private judgment" of Scripture is division (40 thousand Protestant groups, denominations, non-denominations and home churches). The other is heresy, error, OSAS and the imputation heresy are two examples.

Remember for the time ahead.

God bless you,


colbe

Well guess what I found my name in the bible too when i was 12(bible code booyah), and yes you are in control of your own body (which acts, and several others, clearly state is the temple in which god lives), but unless you consider the church doesn't own me, then there's no question who is the 'priestess' of her own temple. Oh wait I forgot your god doesn't allow Priestess, let me guess because of Lilith right?
Or is it because women can't speak in public? Oh yeay; so what you want to see is women wrapped up like a burito from head to toe so she can't see? How nice, good going woman bashing religion. Next edition they gonna fix it right considering atm there's more females then there are males, would be smart.

But you still didn't answer a single one of my questions.

The origional (oldest documented 'sacred book') bible was jewish, yet you still think the jews don't know their own damn book they wrote? XD Just cause you go in and change a few names and dates doesn't mean it didn't origionate from them. + I'm still waiting for the quote where he says I give this church the authority to interpret me, and these names you talk about(all of them been dead for thousands of years yet new editions, and interpretations, keep coming out...)

Btw.. god named the last spiritual leader, that was jesus, he didn't say spiritual leader name another before you die. Instead name them ALL, and let them know they are ALL my children, and ALL have the power to do great things.

He did not name any of the popes, or any other person who stepped up for wealth and fame (exactly what it is), and JESUS said within *us* is the temple of god, thus that spiritual leader told us that right then and there after him it is everyone for we are all his children and our body is the temple in which we can find god, that is why he 'died for our sins' to give us the will and power within ourselves.

You sit there and say worship in private is wrong, well guess what that is what FAMILY is for. Family, and Friends, they sit there they talk to god, then they relate to each other with emotions and feelings. This my friend is what Jesus did, he had his disciples with him who were his family, and his friends, who he talked to about his god, and the things he heard.

On a boat with his disciples the storm was fierce, and about to topple the ship over, Jesus comes out of the cabin, and looks at them. He lifts an arm and states "Have you learned nothing? Tell the storm to be still and it shall"

That is a direct reference to god listening to everyone, talking to everyone, and that all we need is ourselves. Not a church, not jesus, for we are ALL his children.

Anyway..
Loved the last 4 editions of them where when you open the book on the very front page it says its a fictitious story anyway.
Fyi - Fictitious means fake/false not fact.





One last thing thou, why is it so important I read YOUR bible, when i've read 4 other versions? Its all the same stuff with a crapload of changes, events and dates added, and to hide the fact that its a baby bashing, pillage supporting, women raping, slave supporting, twist of a book. Love the fact that they didn't hestitate to remove adam's first wife cause she wanted to be on top during sex.

Poor Lilith, eager to please her man, wanting to ride him and let him relax gets cast into the pits of hell because she enjoyed it to much, and this made her man all pissy cause she finally got off while riding him. Something he obviously failed at on his own to be so but hurt about it that he has to cry up to god and have her condemed.

BlackArrow

How rude to use the word "anal", it is a slam, a put down, not nice. I haven't crossed God, He knows who compiled the Bible and who He gave the authority to interpret it. You can't be your own pope, it doesn't
work. Remember in the Old Covenant, God named a spiritual leader. The same in the New Covenant.

You can look at history, the Bible is not Protestant, it is Catholic. The Canon was decided by the
Church, Pope Damasus choices in 382. The same on interpretation, a divine gift and why it is important to read a Catholic Bible, the Douay-Rheims is a very good one, it is the English translation of the first Bible,
the Latin Vulgate. Read the footnotes on difficult verses.

The terrible fruit of "private judgment" of Scripture is division (40 thousand Protestant groups, denominations, non-denominations and home churches). The other is heresy, error, OSAS and the imputation heresy are two examples.

Remember for the time ahead.

God bless you,


colbe

Well guess what I found my name in the bible too when i was 12(bible code booyah), and yes you are in control of your own body (which acts, and several others, clearly state is the temple in which god lives), but unless you consider the church doesn't own me, then there's no question who is the 'priestess' of her own temple. Oh wait I forgot your god doesn't allow Priestess, let me guess because of Lilith right?
Or is it because women can't speak in public? Oh yeay; so what you want to see is women wrapped up like a burito from head to toe so she can't see? How nice, good going woman bashing religion. Next edition they gonna fix it right considering atm there's more females then there are males, would be smart.

But you still didn't answer a single one of my questions.

The origional (oldest documented 'sacred book') bible was jewish, yet you still think the jews don't know their own damn book they wrote? XD Just cause you go in and change a few names and dates doesn't mean it didn't origionate from them. + I'm still waiting for the quote where he says I give this church the authority to interpret me, and these names you talk about(all of them been dead for thousands of years yet new editions, and interpretations, keep coming out...)

Btw.. god named the last spiritual leader, that was jesus, he didn't say spiritual leader name another before you die. Instead name them ALL, and let them know they are ALL my children, and ALL have the power to do great things.

He did not name any of the popes, or any other person who stepped up for wealth and fame (exactly what it is), and JESUS said within *us* is the temple of god, thus that spiritual leader told us that right then and there after him it is everyone for we are all his children and our body is the temple in which we can find god, that is why he 'died for our sins' to give us the will and power within ourselves.

You sit there and say worship in private is wrong, well guess what that is what FAMILY is for. Family, and Friends, they sit there they talk to god, then they relate to each other with emotions and feelings. This my friend is what Jesus did, he had his disciples with him who were his family, and his friends, who he talked to about his god, and the things he heard.

On a boat with his disciples the storm was fierce, and about to topple the ship over, Jesus comes out of the cabin, and looks at them. He lifts an arm and states "Have you learned nothing? Tell the storm to be still and it shall"

That is a direct reference to god listening to everyone, talking to everyone, and that all we need is ourselves. Not a church, not jesus, for we are ALL his children.

Anyway..
Loved the last 4 editions of them where when you open the book on the very front page it says its a fictitious story anyway.

Fyi - Fictitious means fake/false not fact.

edit on 9-12-2013 by BlackArrow because: fixed quote

edit on 9-12-2013 by BlackArrow because: (no reason given)

BlackArrow,

You are sweet, no hard feelings. That is all I can say right now.


love,

colbe

love you too make sure you update i tend to edit stuff.. i know XD i should read throu but what can i say i do know this topic. Considering i've been called worse for smoking a cigerette, including "If people knew every time you smoked one of those things you let the devil in" type of deal, yeah i could of used a lot more vile words for saying i have no rights at all in the eyes of god.


i did update it, gotta get my girl lilith in there :> after all she was the first woman, seems at the only women do wrong 2 of them get banished right off the bat. Lilith, Eve.. I don't discriminate any verses. Oh thats old test it doesn't matter now.


btw my 'bible code' comment was a joke that was really popular when i was growing up, so yeah i had to mock it a bit


I am open to any and all religions that do not punish me because of a label instead of what is in my heart. But that also means I question those that say i have no rights as a child of the divine. Its just who I am, women have earned their bit of freedom and I have no intention of losing that freedom or rights because of any religion or politician.

colbe
The Bible does NOT interpret itself and God did NOT give everyone reading the Bible, the authority to interpret it. God gave that authority to the Church, logic, the same Church canonized Scripture.

If you are not Catholic, a help, read the footnotes of the English translation (Douay-Rheims) of the
first Bible, the Latin Vulgate for difficult verses. www.drbo.org...

This is why it is a heresy ~ Private interpretation of Scripture, its fruit, division and error.

Catechism of the Catholic Church

119 "It is the task of exegetes to work, according to these rules, towards a better understanding and explanation of the meaning of Sacred Scripture in order that their research may help the Church to form a firmer judgement. For, of course, all that has been said about the manner of interpreting Scripture is ultimately subject to the judgement of the Church which exercises the divinely conferred commission and ministry of watching over and interpreting the Word of God."88

But I would not believe in the Gospel, had not the authority of the Catholic Church already moved me.
*St. Augustine*

The church is not the Roman Catholic church they are what was known as the Alexandrians in Acts and later was the accepted religion of at the time of Constantine, that religion came from Alexandria Egypt. Acts 6:9 Then there arose certain of the synagogue, which is called [the synagogue] of the Libertines, and Cyrenians, and Alexandrians, and of them of Cilicia and of Asia, disputing with Stephen.


The church are the true believers who are the body of Christ a spiritual body not an organization as such.

God's word tells all to Study the word of truth 2Tim 2:15. Interpretation belongs unto God. Ge 40:8 And they said unto him, We have dreamed a dream, and [there is] no interpreter of it. And Joseph said unto them, [Do] not interpretations [belong] to God? tell me [them], I pray you.

He promised to preserve his words unto our generation Psalm 12:6, 7, and has but in only one English version ( English being today's trade language just as Hebrew, Chaldean, Greek and Latin in their day were) not in a plethora of versions that have some of his words.

There is only one Bible that has all His words preserved in it and is God's interpretation of which we are to study and that there is no private interpretations 2Peter1:20.

So the questions that have to be asked and answered only by reading are
1) which Bible in English has ALL the words of God, that would include all words, verses, chapters?
2) which Bible is the Most hated by the religious elite of our day as the Living word was in his day?
3) which Bible has a built in dictionary by which any word in it can be defined by the context?
4) which Bible has a supernatural Cross reference that all others do not?

Answer all four of these and you will know which one is God's fulfilled promise to preserve his words to all generations.

reply to post by Cuervo


Thanks OP......I am a Christian and must admit that I get frustrated constantly finding myself defending my beliefs in something that seems so straight forward and easy to understand. I look at the trees and animals and the the sun setting and my kids and think.....how can there not be a God. I forget that it is not so "apparent" to others.

Jesus did not give up on people.....He continued on through ridicule and terrible treatment.....even to his death. I should be prepared to do the same though with much less wisdom and understanding.

I never said that there is more then 'one' bible, only editions that even the higher ups can't agree on which 'edition' is correct. I can easily agree with your statement of 1 word, but the question then becomes 'who's.
With all of the editing, tampering, and lack thereof modifying its content to be relative to today's lifestyle instead of that of sheepherder's sitting around a fire it leaves a lot to interpret. But by 'private' interpretation, the question becomes simple what does that mean to 'you' as an individual not as a company preprogrammed to spew out what they are told.

Looking inside oneself is not as easy as this sound monks spend their entire lives, meditation in connections with the god of their culture, in isolation. Hinduism is very much the same, if you ever seen any video's of people trying to explain their connection with god, they can't. For there are no words to truely interpret the connection between mortal and divine.

The bible was designed, with the contradictions left and right to allow the person to choose their path of interpretation on what they feel is right to them.

Individual interpretation is part of our free will and the ability to think, reason, comphrend, all it takes is weither the individual is ready to think on a logical note, outside of the box of the mainstream reasoning, and not just a few words in a book but life in general.

One of my favorite stories - hitchhikers guide to the galexy. "What is the meaning of life", come back in (h/e many thousands of years and I will have an answer for you.

So they all gather before the computer at the time that was stated. the answer "42"
"42 whats that mean" "that is the meaning of life".

That is because the 'meaning' is defined by the usage of the word to the individual of the time of its usage.
One of my favorite examples of this althou a bit childish of a pointout here is the simple word f*ck. That word alone has over 40 interpretations based on circumstance of time of use. To just open your mouth and say it would be just to say it but not to imply the actual meaning that you intend to use it with.

But honestly sitting there and pointing me to links of churches, and prespewed nonsense that only the winners of war write is a load of crap. It simply is heresay, and yes that is a famous saying that only the winners of war's right the history to ensure that they are the victums of the initiated.

Our history books are full of lies and deceit, and you think a book that is mass produced like milk at a dairy farm is immune to flaws? That would just be plain ignorance to the fact humans have errored more times then they have succeed in the majority of missions.

In the United States they still doesn't teach about Tesla. This is another example of with held information for power and money, merely to protect the name of 'celeb criminals'. Considering the fact that 'churches' have even attacked free schooling in a freedom of religion country with creationist idea's instead of things that add up mathmatically I really do not see people immune to error no matter where they came from.

Hitler was really good at speech, this was how he got into office, he was good with the people told them want they wanted. So he was elected into office, just because he could move the people with words.

The most powerful weapon we as individual's have is the 'word' that escapes our lips. Millions are manipulated, deceived every day, and its silly to think 1 group, or 1 person has the correct anything without solid proof to back it up.

I don't need to sit there pointing out websites (which i have millions that I can if you would like, but since you won't look it would be a waste of time) to know what is my heart, and the heart of god.

I don't fear monger my believes, and say my way is correct. God know's i'm probably wrong on somethings and right on others, but the truth is. Having a relationship with the Pastor of your church does not equal having a relationship with God. That is kinda like me saying, oh since i'm friends with voice actor *Barney Rubble and Fred Flintstone* that makes me friends with dinosaurs and would make me a creationist who believe humans and dinosaurs walked together.

To much assumptions not enough fact to back it up. I'm still waiting to hear the religious uproar and discrediting of that geneticist who say we are related to both pigs and monkeys. I figure its only a matter of time before religion attacks that to.

If you don't think your related to a pig, til your head back and look in the mirror at your nose, that is the genetic shape of a pigs nose. The location dropped because of the cross of the money, and evolution.

Side note, I think its awesome what the satanist are doing in O.K., freedom of religion if one person has the right to spread 'the word' so does another. So A++ to them for standing up for their own belief's.

No i'm not a satanist either, I am a free thinker who judges a person based on actions.

I am that which I am.

ChesterJohn

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The Bible does NOT interpret itself and God did NOT give everyone reading the Bible, the authority to interpret it. God gave that authority to the Church, logic, the same Church canonized Scripture.

If you are not Catholic, a help, read the footnotes of the English translation (Douay-Rheims) of the
first Bible, the Latin Vulgate for difficult verses. www.drbo.org...

This is why it is a heresy ~ Private interpretation of Scripture, its fruit, division and error.

Catechism of the Catholic Church

119 "It is the task of exegetes to work, according to these rules, towards a better understanding and explanation of the meaning of Sacred Scripture in order that their research may help the Church to form a firmer judgement. For, of course, all that has been said about the manner of interpreting Scripture is ultimately subject to the judgement of the Church which exercises the divinely conferred commission and ministry of watching over and interpreting the Word of God."88

But I would not believe in the Gospel, had not the authority of the Catholic Church already moved me.
*St. Augustine*

The church is not the Roman Catholic church they are what was known as the Alexandrians in Acts and later was the accepted religion of at the time of Constantine, that religion came from Alexandria Egypt. Acts 6:9 Then there arose certain of the synagogue, which is called [the synagogue] of the Libertines, and Cyrenians, and Alexandrians, and of them of Cilicia and of Asia, disputing with Stephen.


The church are the true believers who are the body of Christ a spiritual body not an organization as such.

God's word tells all to Study the word of truth 2Tim 2:15. Interpretation belongs unto God. Ge 40:8 And they said unto him, We have dreamed a dream, and [there is] no interpreter of it. And Joseph said unto them, [Do] not interpretations [belong] to God? tell me [them], I pray you.

He promised to preserve his words unto our generation Psalm 12:6, 7, and has but in only one English version ( English being today's trade language just as Hebrew, Chaldean, Greek and Latin in their day were) not in a plethora of versions that have some of his words.

There is only one Bible that has all His words preserved in it and is God's interpretation of which we are to study and that there is no private interpretations 2Peter1:20.

So the questions that have to be asked and answered only by reading are
1) which Bible in English has ALL the words of God, that would include all words, verses, chapters?
2) which Bible is the Most hated by the religious elite of our day as the Living word was in his day?
3) which Bible has a built in dictionary by which any word in it can be defined by the context?
4) which Bible has a supernatural Cross reference that all others do not?

Answer all four of these and you will know which one is God's fulfilled promise to preserve his words to all generations.

So which Bible has a supernatural Cross reference?