Self Evident. Proof of Twin Tower CD = Remote Controlled, Swapped-in, Military Drone Aircraft on 9/1

Aloysius the Gaul

NewAgeMan
Mysterious Boeing NOT the United Flight 175 Boeing 767.

....

This message was sent on Sept 11, at 1323Z (9:23AM Eastern, 20 minutes after the time of the crash) to United Flight 175, tail number N612UA, routed through the PIT remote ground station (Pittsburgh International Airport).
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.
.
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This message was sent on Sept 11, at 1259Z (8:59AM Eastern) to United Flight 175, tail number N612UA, routed through the MDT remote ground station (Harrisburg International Airport, also known as Middleton)..

pilotsfor911truth.org...

which sows such a ridiculous lack of understanding that it is breathtaking.

1/ The messages were sent TO the aircraft - that is they had the aircraft addresses on them. That does not actually require the aircraft to exist!! Seriously - just like you could get on a ham radio and send out a call for a non-existent station or similar.

2/ The location of the ground bases that are recorded as sending these has little or nothing to do with the location of the aircraft at the time - ACARS messages will be transmitted from ground stations on the presumed flightpath from the flight plan - not from any up-to-date info as to the aircraft's current position.

this "proof" is really just more proof of either the ignorance or dishonesty of the people claiming it!

Hello, Gaul.

I do not get your point.

According to my understanding, ACARS technology does permit acknowledgement. That is that the sender on the ground will automatically know if the receiver (the plane) in the air received the message.

What this means, is that the ACARS system can confirm if the sent 'text' messages have been received or not without requiring any crew input to manually acknowledge the message was received.

The ACARS data is credible evidence that the plane was still airborne after its announced crash into the tower.

Since this is the you know, the area of the forums, well, never mind it would be off topic but anyway the point is that in a space like this, I ought to be able to do pretty much whatever I like, within reason of course, so I'm going to just bump forward bits and pieces of the best evidence gathered so far, starting with the speed of the plane itself, then perhaps we could flip back to CD evidence in the form of super-high temperatures, beyond mere spheroids of atomized steel, and then we've got to double back and investigate that passport, where it was found and who found it, you know how that came about and where it was discovered in relation to the twin towers, based on wind speed and direction on September 11th, 2001, although I suspect in remembering the smoke rising from the North Tower that it was very very light, and slightly due north west (but we'll see..).

Then it's on to the black box conspiracy, to revisit that aspect, where it appears that the FBI recovered, using locators, three or even all four of the black boxes while claiming that they were never found, at all, any of them, nada, nothing, zilch. According to the eyewitness who's credible, at least three of them were recovered, with a second witness on first-person hearsay (direct) that all FOUR were recovered, with the first of the two witnesses actually SEEING one himself, physically (they're bright orange they stand out) and hearing directly that of the remaining three, two others were found, with the FBI agents happy to have achieved their objective. Where are the black boxes and why were they taken away, with the Bush administration lying directly to the 9/11 Commission, which was chaired by Philip D. Zelikow, so we're come back to that part of the story, which, if you haven't heard of it yet, will leave you just astonished as this man's particular "prescience" or prophetic skills when it comes to all things 9/11 and the official history of 9/11.
I can show that it was already a well developed policy position, so it's a MIHOP (made it happen on purpose) not a LIHOP which isn't much better when you really come to think of it, and, it involved an egregious abuse of power that we are still feeling the effects of today, being groped like cattle at the airport, our very phones and facebook spying on us, voluntarily.

This is not the novel 1984.

It didn't work, it didn't TAKE and it has MUCH to teach us about history and the abuse of power and the victimization of so many, including we ourselves at some level.

But once realized, Zelikows historical "fulcrum" abruptly shifts, and there goes the 9/11 "universe" based on nothing but a BIG LIE and Cover-up, and thus the Crime of the Century. Like that Supertramp album.





That's not US, no way - they miscalculated.

Now I would never put anyone in that kind of predicament, no hardly it's our liberation in time and history when Mr. Zelikow has just handed over the whole kit and caboodle as we're into a whole new history, in a tipping point, relative TO the "big lie" (no caps), I mean it's still HORENDOUS, but it loses it's power, and at one level, we can simultaneously learn something looking back, while recapturing even if only to a degree that lost pre-9/11 innocence. And if it's a lie and WE are the victims, then hey none of us have anything to worry about and as to the perps themselves, no man can be their judge, and not I. No I've already done the work of forgiveness with respect to people like Dick Cheney and Socio-pathic Drunk George W. Bush, and then there's his father but that's a whole 'nother story as we all know.

I'm not here to demonize anyone in particular, nor in any way disparage the prior beauty and magnificence of the United States as it was BEFORE 9/11. If 9/11 is a lie or the biggest HOAX ever perpetrated, then by God, and in his awareness, who received all those souls, we can recover something of our own REAL history, in a real world, that isn't at some deep level founded and based on a dumbing down lie of the very worst kind the kind you just cannot accept, no matter what the cost to the truth and reality, even your own they'll make you lie to yourself to believe THEIR lie, and that's sad, not on you, but them, when you at last recover your senses, give your head a shake and realize your OWN truth and freedom, even as an active historical participant for whom telling the truth, the story, the bad news, while terribly sad and difficult and enough to drive some among my fellow truthers stark raving mad, nevertheless contains within itself as a learning experience the possibility of serving a REAL justice, to all the many victims of 9/11 including ourselves.

As a Christian, I however am left with no option but to not only cry but pray for them, and forgive them, there's nothing else to do but do that work, even if it means bringing tears to one's eyes in trying to carry the weight of it, I was going to say down here in the hoax bin, but that's off topic.

Our mutual benefit, for the sake of human history, is something completely other and foreign to what they tried to feed us and poke and prod us like cattle.
The jokes on them, provided we can forgive, and provided that they too seek out their own salvation in time and history which never forgets.

As the new Pope has pointed out, the Lord has a deep and profound and abiding sense of history. The akashic record does not lie.

So because I would never want anyone to be under those bars, I am freed already (let's hope so!) and what I want is to liberate my fellow man from a bad policy position. Take over the world didn't work out so well.

It wasn't OUR fault though, and so it passes, the torch of light and liberty, to us with the responsibility to somehow.. forgive, but NEVER FORGET. That's the key.

It's just not believable, the official story about what happened and what took place on September 11th, 2001.

It's unacceptable.

Something's got to change, and as John the Baptist said "when the hearts of men change, kingdoms change". and so the "heart war" goes on. It's terrible business to be involved in really, and it's driven many a man stark raving mad trying to deal with it.

So I figured if I could somehow try to reconcile with it that it might make it easier for my fellow man to also do so, liberating us all, following Jesus, to the real and authentic doorway like a cleft in Zelikow's parallel universe, to freedom, truth, life, liberty and justice for all, but for REAL, again, if it ever was, but it will be. Somehow the human spirit will triumph, and human ingenuity. I'm quite hopeful and optimistic actually.
We have every reason to be hopeful when we're committed to the truth and reality at all cost except at the cost of truth and reality itself.

It's powerful, influencial, but it's a terrible weight, and yet by sharing the story, the weight can be lifted and shared for the sake of our mutual best interest or as Jesus would have it, our mutual happiness and shared glory together in a new world we are only just beginning to create for ourselves. A "tipping point" in other words. Zelikow should have know that it would happen eventually, his PhD was in historical tipping points, sudden shifts in the movement of history based on the idea of a shared public myth, but shared with the "relevant ruling class" which is really no more or at it's end, since "they've" all but lost their "relevancy", & it's up to the next gen

dazbog
Bologna ! Order contracts are only issued AFTER said prototypes are determines to meet the criteria set forth by the purchasing agency. Hundreds of millions are spent by Companies competing for a contract.
The loser simply absorbs the loss. It is a serious downside to the process. I assume you are a pilot or hope to be. This process is especially obvious when a branch of the Military opens bids for a new fighter. Two companies are selected, they BOTH invest huge amounts but one wins and the other sucks it up and moves on. Not the best example in this case, however the principal still applies . I normally agree with the majority of your posts, unfortunately this is not one of them.

You're right, and you're wrong. Nothing happens until after an RFP is issued for the new design. The interested companies send their designs in, after which the military chooses at least two to compete for the contract. They are awarded a contract to develop a small number of prototypes for flight testing. Until that point, nothing is done as far as physically building an aircraft.

No company simply goes out and builds a prototype for a plane without having a contract in hand for that prototype. They absorb the loss after the competition ends. They don't build planes for no reason. There was no RFP, or contract for a KC-767 until after 2001, so there was no KC-767 built.

It doesn't have to be a "KC-767" make and model.

Call it a high speed monster plane whatever, give it a bad name, but it wasn't flight 175, it was flying at 575-600mph, and well over 500 no matter what, at 700 feet altitude.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


You said it was a KC-767, now you're back tracking on that? So what was it then if not a commercial 767 or a KC-767? It has to be something that exists.

NewAgeMan
This message was sent on Sept 11, at 1323Z (9:23AM Eastern, 20 minutes after the time of the crash) to United Flight 175, tail number N612UA, routed through the PIT remote ground station (Pittsburgh International Airport).

DDLXCXA CHIAK CH158R
.CHIAKUA DA 111323/ED
CMD
AN N612UA/GL PIT
- QUCHIYRUA 1UA175 BOSLAX
- MESSAGE FROM CHIDD -
/BEWARE ANY COCKPIT INTROUSION: TWO AIRCAFT IN NY . HIT TRADE C
NTER BUILDS...
CHIDD ED BALLINGER

;09111323 108575 0574

The second time stamp on the bottom of the message, at United Airlines, is the "Technical Acknowledgement" from the airplane that the message has been received.

Oh dear, this has been shown to be crap here several times before. Why not do a search before reposting crap that has been debunked here before? No wonder this thread is in the Hoax forum!
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Just so you all know, those time stamps are completly unrelated to if/when the aircraft received the acars. The top one is the referrence to when the acars is sent, the one on the bottom is basically a footer for the person who sent the message: ";09111303 108575 0545" The first part is the date/time, the second is the id of the sending terminal and the last is the telex number. The only way to check if it was received or not is to go into the message system of the acars program and scan the sent and received messages. I send and scan acars messages every day at work. Sorry, none of these messages can confirm that the aircraft received any of the acars, they are just the hard copy of messages that were sent, which usually come out on a telex printer and stored for referrence.

reply to post by Zaphod58


Monster plane.

reply to post by NewAgeMan


Oh really? And you can find evidence that a "monster plane" was built and flown prior to 9/11 right?

HEADS UP

There is NO NEED to quote and repost your previous posts in a thread. It is spamming and it is against forum rules.

ATS Terms and Conditions

15h.) Spamming: You will not Post identical content, or snippets of identical content, to multiple threads in the discussion forums. You will also not create more than one thread for your topic, or create multiple "slightly different" threads for a single topic.

The practice stops NOW.

Further re-posts of this manner will be subject to stricter moderation.

Plane as fuel air bomb, missile, remotely piloted, exceeding, by far, the performance envelope for that particular aircraft because it was flying between 550 and 585 mph, at 700 feet altitude, maneuvering rather deftly I might add on that longg arc, making rapid adjustments to target including that final turn in. It's not a matter of just going at full tilt, it exceeded the performance envelope even by an order of magnitude, so what else was it then, in light of proof of CD, than a re-built Boeing commercial airliner, even painted correctly?

For a moment just suspend your held point of point and consider it from the right perspective, and go through all the info and visit Pilots for truth's site, and comb it, instead of just continually trying to raise reasonable doubt with the first thing that comes to your mind, while trying to make ME look like the whacky one.

I'm just operating on the basis of physical reality, including the evidence that the twin towers were exploded and did not "collapse" from the fires, nor the impacts, which even the NIST Report indicated was not the cause, but a weakening of the steel precipitating a global collapse, once the threshold was reached (with firefighters preparing to put out the fire). That to them seemed like the most plausible hypothesis, and forget about trying to explain the dynamics of destruction and just assume the causal mechanism - the planes.

That's not science that's an assumption, which is not based in the physical reality itself or the occurrence of destruction or what actually took place, in other words, leaving it up to everyone to logically assume by Occam's Razor that the building's destruction was a direct and sole result of the plane impacts - the lie, selling itself - because of course the US is under attack by a foreign enemy, who were probably participating in the war games and hijacking "simulations" gone "live", resulting in the actual thing that the simulations were meant to simulate - that day.

Oh sigh..

reply to post by neformore


Fair enough, sorry, I can obviously link to what I need, thanks for the heads up. I assumed, thinking anything goes in this forum, because no one generally cares about it much or pays it much attention.

No problem.

Best Regards.

NewAgeMan
Plane as fuel air bomb, missile, remotely piloted, exceeding, by far, the performance envelope for that particular aircraft because it was flying between 550 and 858 mph, at 700 feet altitude, maneuvering rather deftly I might add on that longg arc, making rapid adjustments to target including that final turn in. It's not a matter of just going at full tilt, it exceeded the performance envelope even by an order of magnitude, so what else was it then, in light of proof of CD, than a re-built Boeing commercial airliner, even painted correctly?

For a moment just suspend your held point of point and consider it from the right perspective, and go through all the info and visit Pilots for truth's site, and comb it, instead of just continually trying to raise reasonable doubt with the first thing that comes to your mind, while trying to make ME look like the whacky one.

So let me see if I have this straight..... It couldn't have been a commercial Boeing aircraft, because it exceeded its operational capability, by orders of magnitude, so it had to be a rebuilt Boeing aircraft so it could do that? Do you not see how that makes no sense at all? If Boeing had the ability to allow a 767 to be rebuilt to be able to do that, why wouldn't they just build them to those specifications in the first place?

Ah right, the P4T guys know the truth, and everyone else (regardless of experience) that disagrees with them is wrong. And where have I made you try to look like "the whacky one"? I haven't said a word about you now have I? I have gone after your evidence, which is wrong and makes no sense, I haven't said a word about you, or tried to make you look like anything.

NewAgeMan
it was flying between 550 and 858 mph,

Just when you thought truthers "evidence" had hit the high point of craziness, they come out with more "evidence" even crazier - now they are claiming one of the passenger jets may have exceeded the sound barrier....

Zaphod58

Zaphod, if fire a bullet into a steel girder, what happens? Think of the densest
and highest velocity round you care to. Now think of a thousand or ten bullets
firing simultaneously at many girders rooted to one another and bedrock.
What happens?

All here who defend the O.S. have been defending it strenuously for a long time
now it seems. Does one even have to ask, what gives?

I do take hope though. Nothing is ever as bad as it seems.
And boy does it seem bad.

Aloysius the Gaul

NewAgeMan
Mysterious Boeing NOT the United Flight 175 Boeing 767.

....

This message was sent on Sept 11, at 1323Z (9:23AM Eastern, 20 minutes after the time of the crash) to United Flight 175, tail number N612UA, routed through the PIT remote ground station (Pittsburgh International Airport).
.
.
.
.
This message was sent on Sept 11, at 1259Z (8:59AM Eastern) to United Flight 175, tail number N612UA, routed through the MDT remote ground station (Harrisburg International Airport, also known as Middleton)..

pilotsfor911truth.org...

which sows such a ridiculous lack of understanding that it is breathtaking.

1/ The messages were sent TO the aircraft - that is they had the aircraft addresses on them. That does not actually require the aircraft to exist!! Seriously - just like you could get on a ham radio and send out a call for a non-existent station or similar.

2/ The location of the ground bases that are recorded as sending these has little or nothing to do with the location of the aircraft at the time - ACARS messages will be transmitted from ground stations on the presumed flightpath from the flight plan - not from any up-to-date info as to the aircraft's current position.

this "proof" is really just more proof of either the ignorance or dishonesty of the people claiming it!

As I understand this from pilotsfor911truth

The 9/11 Commission has claimed which messages have been received by the aircraft. According to a another Memorandum For The Record (MFR), four ACARS messages were sent between 8:59AM and 9:03AM on the morning of Sept 11, to United Flight 175. The MFR reads as follows(3) -

1259:19Z A dispatcher-initiated message that reached the plane but not crew acknowledged stating "I heard of a reported incident."
1259:29 Additional dispatcher-initiated message
1259:30 Additional dispatcher-initiated message
1303:17 Rogers-initiated message not received by the aircraft

The first message at 1259:19Z, as stated, was received by the aircraft, but not crew acknowledged, which is not required as technical acknowledgements are automatic. This is referring to the message noted above sent through MDT by Jerry TSEN (First coded ACARS message at top). The second (1259:29Z) and third messages (1259:30Z) referenced in the MFR were not provided through the FOIA. The last message (1303:17Z) referenced in the MFR is claimed to not have been received by the aircraft according to the 9/11 Commission.

the 911 commission has acknowledged ACARS messages were received.

According to pilotsfor911truth the ACARS technology works like cell phone technology. The cell phone towers keep track of your location as you move around. If someone sends you a message the network knows which towers you are near and routes the message to the tower nearest to you.

The debunkers assert that this is not true.

OneFreeMan
All here who defend the O.S. have been defending it strenuously for a long time
now it seems. Does one even have to ask, what gives?.

All here and elsewhere who have been making up conspiracy theories for a long time now, with no evidence at all for a long time now it seems. Does one even have to ask, why do they?

reply to post by OneFreeMan


And if you fire a bullet through the joins of two girders, what do you think would happen? Because that's where the plane entered the building. The joins failed, and the beams bent. You try to make it sound like it broke the girders in two and went right through them, which isn't true at all. The joins failed.

leostokes
According to pilotsfor911truth

There's your first problem right there. They also claim that a sensor that was never activated proves that there was no hijacking.