Courts Quietly Confirm MMR Vaccine Causes Autism

Rubinstein

Pardon?
Where's the list?

Here's a list below of some of the autoimmune diseases which can be triggered by vaccines to start you off, there are many more and all kinds of obscure disease subtypes which vaccines can cause. Here also is a link to a huge number diseases, disorders and events which vaccines can cause Vaccination Diseases

THATS your source? Your going to use THAT source as ammunition for your claim? Wooow, this thread just keeps getting better and better! Hahahahaha.

As for the list itself, totally insane. Well done for inadvertantly debunking your own theory.

angryhulk

THATS your source? Your going to use THAT source as ammunition for your claim? Wooow, this thread just keeps getting better and better! Hahahahaha.

As for the list itself, totally insane. Well done for inadvertantly debunking your own theory.

The source is actually very well sourced, you go on believing what you want to believe, I'll stay true to the science. Those who can think critically know what's going on with vaccines. Your posts so far have all lacked substance and shown no experience/knowledge on this topic.

Rubinstein

angryhulk

THATS your source? Your going to use THAT source as ammunition for your claim? Wooow, this thread just keeps getting better and better! Hahahahaha.

As for the list itself, totally insane. Well done for inadvertantly debunking your own theory.

The source is actually very well sourced, you go on believing what you want to believe, I'll stay true to the science. Those who can think critically know what's going on with vaccines. Your posts so far have all lacked substance and shown no experience/knowledge on this topic.

edit on 4-12-2013 by Rubinstein because: (no reason given)

Actually I provided all the sources I needed to (regarding mr. wakefield) on the first page of this thread. Remember that's what this thread is about.

You probably missed that (I forgive you) hahaha.

And talking about experience, my daughter is fine following her vaccine, and so are my friends children. That's all the experience I need.

Knowledge is a different thing altogether of course, and no I don't know how a vaccine works, I also don't know what exactly is in them, however I don't pretend to know everything on the subject (like you) by copying and pasting utter nonsense from ridiculous websites.

However, what I do know is how to research a topic correctly and provide factual information from trusted sources (albeit not all sources are perfect, yours are absolutely insane).

reply to post by OneManArmy

Notice the mortality rate of measles was falling dramatically long before the vaccinations even began.
Source

I posted the source of the 1/1500 - 1/5000 mortality rate in the UK earlier in the thread, I will try to find it later, Im going to bed right now.

The fact that the mortality rate was falling before vaccination is non relevant. Improving medical care and health caused it. It doesn't mean that the decrease keeps occuring after a certain point. That's the same bs you see on the child health safety site. That guy kept insisting the mortality was one in millions even though I posted him the data showing that he was incorrect. The way you work out a mortality is by cases divided by fatalities; actual hard facts, not by some projection that isn't backed up by current statistics.

Unless your stats show the outbreaks they derive from with number of infected and mortalities, they are not reliable. I only use primary source data not second hand numbers; I dig up the numbers myself. I will concede that 1/1500 or even higher might be typical for healthy adults infected. However in a totally unvaccinated scenario nearly everyone gets measles in young childhood, and the mortality rate for the very young/frail is way higher. You might get lucky with a less virulent strain doing the rounds, as seems to have happened in Wales recently, or a unlucky with nastier one which has a much higher death rate, like that school in Philledelphia. I took the two European outbreaks as my control group because they had access to free, good quality public health care and had no vaccinations due to religious reasons (for the most part).

I have kids, they've both had all their jabs and are fine. I know a friend whose eldest is mildly autistic so, she didn't vaccinate her younger, and he has exactly the same type of asd as the elder, so she went and had him vaccinated after the diagnosis.

I'm not young. I remember kids who would now be diagnosed as autistic and adhd being called naughty, sensitive, weird when I was a child and teen. They changed the diagnostic criteria for autism in the 80's, and suddenly all these odd but functioning kids are being called autistic. Me included, as I have mild HF Aspergers which just wasn't on the radar back then. There hasn't been any change in the number of severely autustic kids diagnosed, it's all been in the milder cases.

I also have a relative who swears her autistic son was fine before vaccination. She's not remembering how at pre jab age she was telling me how funny he was around strangers, slow to speak he was and how he always had a dodgy tummy and would only eat a limited range of stuff. After his diagnosis she swore he was normal before. Selective memory. He also has a significant 'odd/misshapen' look to his face, and that only happens in early foetal development. So I take anecdotal evidence with a pinch of salt in autism cases due to experience.

Autistic kids can have a very nasty reaction to the jab, as co morbity with epilepsy and other conditions is common. I suspect that's where a lot of this grief started; undiagnosed mildly autistic kids getting a bad reaction. Their behavioural differences typically get more obvious in the age group that gets vaccinated, they fail to hit milestones about this point, and they deviate further from their peers as they get older. Gettng further behind in speech etc. It's easy to see how the jab got the blame.

However, measles encephalitis can cause brain damage that mimics primary autism. That's been known in very rare cases with vaccines, but the kid will have been in the ICU for weeks before, so it's very obvious when it happens. Caused (exremely rarely) by the live virus in the vaccine. Also sometimes caused by chickenpox and cold sore virus.I suspect any damage that could possibly be caused by a live virus vaccine, will be caused by the wild virus, and way worse by the wild virus. It's a case of which does least harm.

I have nineteen studies about the frequency of autism in the population. If you are interested I'll post links to some/all as requested.

sigh, incapable of short posts.

Rates of all kinds of autoimmune disease have increases. It doesn't appear to have anything to do with vaccinations, it has to with the lower level of exposure to all kinds of parasites and germs and increasing use of antibiotics in childhood.

It's apparently passed you by the Crohns is treated with intestinal worms, and MS subsides too.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

Several studies implicate infectious and non-infectious environmental factors present during childhood and young adulthood as strong determinants of MS risk, although their exact nature remains unidentified. Microbial infections can act as triggers inducing or promoting autoimmunity, resulting in clinical disease manifestations in genetically predisposed individuals.[/exnews

and

Several studies both in humans and in animal models have shown helminths to be powerful modulators of host immune responses (La Flamme et al., 2003; Sewell et al., 2003; Jankovic et al., 2006). Following this premise, we recently demonstrated that helminth-infected MS patients showed significantly lower disease activity, compared to uninfected MS subjects (Correale and Farez, 2007)

Just a sample of much work showing vaccinations have nothing to do with MS.

you've got tunnel vision rube.

edit on 4-12-2013 by Antigod because: buggered it up

Antigod

Rates of all kinds of autoimmune disease have increases. It doesn't appear to have anything to do with vaccinations, it has to with the lower level of exposure to all kinds of parasites and germs and increasing use of antibiotics in childhood.

It's apparently passed you by the Crohns is treated with intestinal worms, and MS subsides too.

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov...

You really think for one moment that the pharmaceuticals want to prove that vaccines cause Autoimmune diseases? You think they want to put people off their vaccines? Stop being naive, you've already been provided a high quality PLOS One Study showing that vaccines cause autoimmune disease, now you come up with a corporate McStudy and thing that's going to change anything; you need to learn to check for conflicts of interest.

From your link:-

Conflict of interest statement "Jorge Correale is a board member of Merck-Serono Argentina, Novartis Argentina, Biogen-Idec LATAm, and Merck Serono LATAM. Dr. Correale has received reimbursement for developing educational presentations for Merck-Serono Argentina y LATAM, Biogen – Idec Argentina, and TEVA-Tuteur Argentina as well as professional travel accommodations stipends. "

OneManArmy

Antigod
reply to post by OneManArmy

 

Show me one baby that has died as a result of MY opinion

Hang about and I'll get the news item on the measles deaths in America n school.

www.nytimes.com...

A sixth child whose family opposes measles vaccinations for religious reasons died here today, and five others were inoculated against the disease undercourt order

Well that's one. A few years ago a group of them died.

That was before this thread even existed, it couldnt have been MY opinion. I only formed mine in the last couple of months.
My whole argument has been that the measles disease mortality is equal to the vaccine..
1/1500 to 1/5000. Measles has a higher mortality in the third world with poor hygeine, diet, and health care.
I posted much "official" stats showing that the risk of measles is overblown in the first world.

Rather intellectually dishonest of you to miss out the incidence rate of measles pre and post vaccination, don't you think?

Have a look and see:

Here’s the problem. It’s not surprising that death rates were declining before introduction of the vaccines. Medicine was improving. More importantly, supportive care was improving. For example, take the case of polio. Before the introduction of the iron lung and its widespread use, for example, if a polio patient developed paralysis of the respiratory muscles, he would almost certainly die. The iron lung allowed such patients to live. Some even survived in an iron lung for decades. No doubt improved nutrition also played a role as well. However, if you want to get an idea of the impact of vaccines on infectious disease, take a look at this graph from the CDC of measles incidence, not death rates:

www.sciencebasedmedicine.org...

angryhulk
And talking about experience, my daughter is fine following her vaccine, and so are my friends children. That's all the experience I need.