Why so many people–including scientists–suddenly believe in an afterlife

reply to post by CJCrawley

I find out of body experiences (OOBEs) more interesting, because they seem to indicate that consciousness is not local; therefore, if consciousness is not confined to the brain, it may be independent of it.

My own belief in an afterlife is based on the fact that I am alive now.

Is this a one-off event in the infinity of the universe/universes out there? I find that hard to believe.

Okay, then. We agree on that part. (Sorry for the late response). It seems to me that NDEs and OBEs are of the same 'nature'. The two together, plus reincarnation stories (people remembering accurately), and apparitions (or other 'contact' from beyond aside from 'seeing') all work together to establish "proof."

It's fascinating.

Spiramirabilis

I'm not really in the mood to rain on anyone's parade - but, proof? Hope springs eternal I think

Probably a matter of semantics. I've never seen anything I would call "proof" at all, including never having seen PROOF that I actually exist. I have, however, tripped across some mighty strong evidence at times. Strong enough to convince ME, until contradictory evidence comes along, but probably not strong enough to convict in court or the lab, since it's not really repeatable.

Now, YOU can call it "hope" or "faith" or even "cats-eye marbles" for all I care, it will still be what it is, and I will remain convinced until I'm not. I'm content to let you believe what you will in the matter, since there really isn't any "proof" either way. We all have to go where our individual evidence leads us, and that means me, you, and the rest of the world, and I'm content to let that be, but it IS fun discussing it.

reply to post by nenothtu

I'm content to let you believe what you will in the matter, since there really isn't any "proof" either way. We all have to go where our individual evidence leads us, and that means me, you, and the rest of the world, and I'm content to let that be, but it IS fun discussing it.

Exactly that Nenothtu

And that - exactly :-)

It's not worth losing sleep over anyhow since its sleep no matter how you look at it - perchance to dream

For in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

:-)

reply to post by nenothtu

We all have to go where our individual evidence leads us, and that means me, you, and the rest of the world, and I'm content to let that be, but it IS fun discussing it.

Ain't it, though???

I think if I suddenly "discovered" all the answers, I'd get bored....
there's something about the insolubility of the entire idea/field that keeps me reeled in and splashing about.

The great mysteries of life are unendingly compelling, for me.

reply to post by Spiramirabilis


There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio,
than are dreamt of in your philosophies.

Certainly keeps things interesting, eh?

reply to post by wildtimes

Certainly keeps things interesting, eh?

It does :-)

A lovely line - out of so many lovely lines. But, Shakespeare didn't know either

...there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so...

I think he had his suspicions though

:-)

Spiramirabilis

Exactly that Nenothtu

And that - exactly :-)

It's not worth losing sleep over anyhow since its sleep no matter how you look at it - perchance to dream

For in that sleep of death, what dreams may come?

:-)

Aye! And why should I, you, or anyone else disturb our peaceful slumbers over what someone else chooses to believe? That is THEIR journey to take, not ours.

We can talk, we can laugh, challenge, or provoke thought, but at the end of the day, we all get to rest in our own beds, the beds we've made ourselves. No reason to worry if the OTHER guy's bed is too high off the floor or has too soft a mattress, 'cause we ain't the ones sleeping in it.

Because of that, I tend not to get mad, upset, or overwrought over such discussions, and I value them as a test of my own thoughts, seeing if I can possibly find that new bit of evidence that won't fit in, or will force me to change or abandon them for something else.

wildtimes

Ain't it, though???

I think if I suddenly "discovered" all the answers, I'd get bored....
there's something about the insolubility of the entire idea/field that keeps me reeled in and splashing about.

The great mysteries of life are unendingly compelling, for me.

I think anyone who believes they have all the answers is just not asking the right questions. I have "answers" which work for me at the moment, but they are always subject to change, pending new discoveries, and indeed HAVE changed more than once over time.

I read somewhere once that the Aztecs had a philosophy that death was just the awakening from a dream of having lived. Whether that's true or not, that they actually believed that, I don't know... but I find it to be a nice thought.

Spiramirabilis


A lovely line - out of so many lovely lines. But, Shakespeare didn't know either

...there is nothing either good or bad, but thinking makes it so...

I think he had his suspicions though

:-)

Now that goes along with another thought I have. Life - and death - are mostly what we make of them. They may be up to 10% what happens to us, but the other 90 plus percent is what we do to THEM... how we react to them. It's mostly a matter of attitude and approach. "Thinking makes it so..." makes it "bad" or "good".

I was gonna throw in an "alas, poor Yorik. I knew him well." but just couldn't make it fit right.

reply to post by nenothtu

Because of that, I tend not to get mad, upset, or overwrought over such discussions, and I value them as a test of my own thoughts, seeing if I can possibly find that new bit of evidence that won't fit in, or will force me to change or abandon them for something else.

That right there is what I call intellectual integrity

Actually - other people call it that too

:-)

Wish these boards had more of it

reply to post by WarminIndy

I think AfterInfinity is saying there is a "Creative Possession". That's a concept I learned in film school. We were asked why we wanted to make films. The instructor explained that the best filmmakers have "Creative Possession" or something in them that won't let go of them until they express it.

No, nothing like that. I'm just very strange. Most people never really know who I am because I only show them the side I feel comfortable displaying around them. Every time I get too comfortable and start lowering my shields, letting them in further, they get all weirded out and point out the stuff I do that's bizarre. And then I clam up. And then they pretend its okay and I just find a way to either keep to myself or leave.

I haven't met very many people who like me for exactly who I am.

AfterInfinity

Every time I get too comfortable and starting lowering my shields, they get all weirded out and point out the stuff I do that's bizarre. And then I clam up. And then they pretend its okay and I just find a way to either keep to myself or leave.

"Bizarre" is what makes the world go around (and I bet you thought centripedal force did that!) and keeps life interesting.

Embrace it. Celebrate it. Run with it. If other folks get wierded out by it, well, that's THEIR problem, not yours. Maybe they ought to loosen their hatbands a bit.

When you trip over that one that DOESN'T get wierded out, buy 'em a cup of coffee to ask them why over, then take it from there. Might have a friend for life there, one closer than a brother.

Kipling's "thousandth Man".

I have tons of acquaintances, and they all think I'm bizarre. I have but very few friends, and damn if they ain't QUALITY!

reply to post by AfterInfinity


There was something wrong with my PC today and all my posts were made in Safe Mode with Networking.....
But now it is fixed and I can see the screen better. I resurrected the Windows Host Service. Man, it was like a dying body, it had a NDE. I almost got the Blue Screen of Death, but with a little work, it was revived....

AfterInfinity, You may simply be eccentric. And that's ok, there's nothing wrong with that. Embrace the eccentricity. After all, what is normal?

reply to post by nenothtu

Because of that, I tend not to get mad, upset, or overwrought over such discussions, and I value them as a test of my own thoughts, seeing if I can possibly find that new bit of evidence that won't fit in, or will force me to change or abandon them for something else.

Hear, hear!!!!

I am attempting to cultivate that ability to not become 'overwrought'....
ATS has helped me a great deal.

Yeah - can I possibly find that new bit that won't fit in, or will force me to change?

Precisely.

wildtimes

[...] scientists –suddenly believe in an afterlife

Stopped reading when I realised this was a joke topic.

reply to post by wildtimes


Great job on the OP, Wildtimes! S&F!

I'm just now seeing this thread, but I can't wait to jump in and read all the links posted. I'm sure it will be some very good, enlightening information.

You rock, girl!!!

reply to post by wildtimes


Great post! I really enjoyed reading this.

I've always known... yes, known, that our physical death is not the end. NDEs don't get enough credit in my opinion.

One example i have told before:

A friend of my cousins was seriously ill, and has since sadly passed away. Before she passed away from her terrible illness she was in the hospital. She said "There's a door... it's beautiful.. i'm walking through it" and, sadly, she then passed.

Before this event, i was already a believer. But after hearing this, it just made me review my beliefs and once again be fully aware of what this life really is. It's something we need to go through to get to "the other side" Knowing there is "another side" is completely different to knowing what the "other side" is. I don't think we will ever know until 'that' day. This life is often extremely tough... But i'm sure it will be worth it.

For a young women to be ill for so long and for her to say these things before she unfortunately passed made me realize, once again, how this life is just the smallest part to a such a large picture.

iLemming

wildtimes

[...] scientists –suddenly believe in an afterlife

Stopped reading when I realised this was a joke topic.

So says the lemming before jumping off the cliff.

Hey, gravity works you lemmings, isn't that what science says?

BTW, didn't we all have an extra hour this morning? Scientists say we need that extra hour, why?

It didn't change a thing in the big picture...just another hour to keep our human based calendars on track. Wait, the calender has been changed how many times by professional mathematicians?

So see, they believe they are smart enough to have to keep fixing a calender when the ancients did everything right on time anyway. So where's the joke? Maybe the ancients knew more because they actively participated in their world?

All of what we have today are not new inventions, they are evolved from a previous thing. Maybe scientists are rediscovering what the ancients knew? Egyptians were doing brain surgery, imagine that.

Lemmings have been jumping off cliffs since lemmings existed. Nothing has changed for them, and now science is beginning to understand, there is nothing new under the sun.

I smoked Salvia a couples times approximately two years ago and the last time I did it shattered every illusion I was holding up until that point. I recall the experience like this...

Immediately after exhaling I saw countless variables of my environment, all of the possibilities, and then my vision collapsed downward almost as if into the earth? Everything was pitch black, no sensory input...but I was still aware to a very small degree, I just had zero awareness of my name, family, friends, age, sexuality, and whatever else you can think of.

I was aware of the pitch dark and that was it, it felt like eternity that I was waiting there until a fine point of light in the distance suddenly appeared (or it was always there and i failed to see it) and I stared at it while it grew in size and started to magnetically pull me towards it. I'm not joking when I say it was love at first sight lol! It was blinding but I looked, and when I got as close as possible I started being "sent back" and I sort of turned around with my mind and heart, soul and spirit, and I saw gradients of every color in between the white rays of light on my way back. I finally came back down to earth, so to speak, and I was put back into this/my body very gently.

The love, light, and fire that pierced me was ecstacy and purifying simultaneously, I just couldn't be more joyous, plus nothing could piss me off for a good couple of months afterwards, I even tested myself to see haha!

"I"feel this is important, especially for anyone who can make the connection; you are "I" and "I" are you, now read...

Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the Lord do all these things .

Lmao, that's hilarious if you really think and feel about it

Have fun!

i DONT know about that one, all I see is a link "amazon" . Doesnt really prove anything.
People just trying to push their religious agenda as usual, thats how I see it.
They're just trying to make a quick $$$ off the gullible .

Brain is excellent at creating illusions through drugs and even death once it shuts down.
Now the funny part is ONCE iT SHUTS DOWN for good, thats when the illusion
of hell and heaven stops existing. I dont think theres been any actual studies
of people coming back to life after a day to few days, where the brain finally
shut down.

There hasnt even been any "actual" scientific studies about it, only people
making claims of it, like posting random youtube videos, believing its 100%.

Death= a very long DIRT NAP.

Having to live life again or eternity sounds like a hell itself, it be rather boring.
To go on for eternity. You think it get boring.