Drive To End False Racism Charges - Libel -Slander - Censorship

reply to post by ketsuko


Nope racism is racism .
White hispanic or black.
Joe Arpaio is most likely Hispanic .
I'm sure he claims that's an Italian last name however.

elouina
And my speech is being censored by this false accusation.

You are censoring yourself - that's no one's fault but your own.

Censorship is the suppression of speech or other public communication which may be considered objectionable, harmful, sensitive, politically incorrect or inconvenient as determined by a government, media outlet or other controlling body. It can be done by governments and private organizations or by individuals who engage in self-censorship.
en.wikipedia.org...

mothershipzeta
reply to post by elouina

 

You have a right to say whatever you want, and everyone else has a right to respond. Freedom of speech/expression means the government can't censor you or punish you for what you say. It doesn't mean you get to say whatever you want without any criticism.

If you want libel/slander laws to be altered, then don't be surprised if the "public figure doctrine" is thrown out.

And expect people that are accused of complicity in conspiracies to sue this very site for defamation.

This is where you are wrong. You can say whatever you like, but it doesn't mean there can't be legal complications from it either. Choose your public words wisely or you very well could get sued. If you drag a company or a person through the mud, you better be prepared to back it up with proof. Otherwise you could be sued for damages.

As for sites such as ATS? It is just recirculation of the news, opinion, and conspiracies. Conspiracies are unproven and considered fictional fairy tales. And I am certain that this site has a disclaimer that says reader beware, this site is just for amusement. Thus why it is important to keep posts without proof in the conspiracy forums.

reply to post by elouina


It's a shame that there are people who will cast unwarranted aspersions in an effort to derail a conversation and I think everyone can agree that such tactics are repugnant. There are laws to protect a person's reputation from defamation but there are also limits to their application with good reason. I believe most people are unaware of how much the protections set forth in the First Amendment have been expanded, falsely believing that people have always enjoyed the same level of freedom to express themselves that we have today. It's a very slippery slope anytime we seek to impose restrictions on any type of free expression.

I'm regularly offended when I see people referred to as socialists, communists, unpatriotic, etc for expressing opinions contrary to those of conservatives but I'll gladly be offended because the alternative is censorship and that's intolerable.

mothershipzeta

elouina
And my speech is being censored by this false accusation.

You are censoring yourself - that's no one's fault but your own.

Censorship is the suppression of speech or other public communication which may be considered objectionable, harmful, sensitive, politically incorrect or inconvenient as determined by a government, media outlet or other controlling body. It can be done by governments and private organizations or by individuals who engage in self-censorship.
en.wikipedia.org...

Perhaps I could have phrased this differently. How about censorship invoked through a hostile environment precipitated by slanderous remarks?

sealing
reply to post by ketsuko

 

Nope racism is racism .
White hispanic or black.
Joe Arpaio is most likely Hispanic .
I'm sure he claims that's an Italian last name however.

All right, my apology. It just irks me. Often when I see lists like the one you posted, the follow up is that crazy claim that only whites can be racist because only they have the power. You know critical race theory which is all too prevalent.

reply to post by elouina


More like labeling with the intent to intimidate. In a sense, it's a form of bullying, but I hesitate to go there because I absolutely think we've taken THAT too far too.

reply to post by elouina


America is as racist today as in the 60s.



bossip.com... eliminate-hate/

However calling someone racist as a debate tactic is lame; As is marginalizing people with the "people like you" designation or other types of name calling that has become all to common on ATS. I don't think I have ever seen the personal attacks as bad as it currently is.

The name calling on ATS used to be creative and funny; now it's meant to hurt, denigrate, and attempt to solidify an agenda by bullying and even threats. So apparent in the Zimmerman/Martin threads.

theantediluvian
reply to post by elouina

 

It's a shame that there are people who will cast unwarranted aspersions in an effort to derail a conversation and I think everyone can agree that such tactics are repugnant. There are laws to protect a person's reputation from defamation but there are also limits to their application with good reason. I believe most people are unaware of how much the protections set forth in the First Amendment have been expanded, falsely believing that people have always enjoyed the same level of freedom to express themselves that we have today. It's a very slippery slope anytime we seek to impose restrictions on any type of free expression.

I'm regularly offended when I see people referred to as socialists, communists, unpatriotic, etc for expressing opinions contrary to those of conservatives but I'll gladly be offended because the alternative is censorship and that's intolerable.

Yes most folks don't realize that there are limitations. Personally I feel that when someone unjustifiably growls, "racist" at a person that it is hate speech precipitated by race. I know this precedent has never been tried in court, but I personally feel that this could pass muster.

Now as far as calling someone communist, or socialist, if you can prove that any of their actions follow this doctrine then it is not defamation. The same applies if, for example, you can find newspaper clippings mentioning that the person is a member of say the Democratic Socialists of America.

reply to post by sealing

and you dont mention any of the black racism to whites....its obvious what side youre on. What your agenda is.

Racism works both ways, well more than just two, until you accept that and mention it in the same breath youre racist.

elouina
It annoys me to no end to see people being accused of racism where none exists. Now this thread is not about whether a person is racist or not, so don't go there. And the primary reason for these accusations of racism is to squash freedom of speech and expression, which is a violation of our constitutional rights. It is also damaging to the individual to be accused of such a thing in public, thus the libel and slander charges. So I feel that Americans should make a stand against these false and libelous statements, and put an end to them once and for all.

How you may ask? By using our courts to bring charges of libel, slander, and political censorship. Or at the very least turning around and telling the person that if they repeat the offense that they will be sued. It is only my intention to stop this atrocity, and not bog down the courts. And I would hope the threat of lawsuit would stop many of these people in their tracks.

We do have protections against these false charges! And we don't have to sit back and take it!

Here is a perfect example of a case where I should have stood up for my rights.

Prior to Oct 1st, and at work, me and an African American friend were talking about how Obamacare would have a bad impact on health insurance benefits. Another African American woman who overheard our conversation, walked up and screamed in our faces, "that is racist so shut up about the subject". Me and the other woman's jaws dropped and we shut up to keep the peace.

So not only did this woman embarrass me in public, I feel that I can no longer discuss the subject in public because I am white. So yes, I was publicly ridiculed and slandered, just for talking about health insurance. And my speech is being censored by this false accusation. So if she ever does this again, I will stand my ground.

For the irony in this, the woman falsely claiming racism now hates Obamacare with a passion since it has severely affected her own health insurance at work. And this workplace bully will no longer allow anyone around her to even talk about health insurance now in general since she is soo upset about the issue. Yes it hit her pocketbook and hard, the very thing we were originally discussing before her outburst.

Karma is a funny thing sometimes.

reply to post by elouina


For example, calling Pejau a socialist isn't a pejorative. That poster owns it proudly. There's another poster, TrueBrit, I believe who claims to be a communist.

I suppose it's all in how you use it. If I typed "friggin' commie scum" then it's pretty clear I'm intending to be pejorative, but if I were to ask "Pejau, what does a socialist like you think about this?" Then, it should be equally clear that I'm asking because I want the perspective of someone with that viewpoint.

Part of the problem is that we start to make certain words/concepts off limits because they might offend someone, sometimes not even the person they're being directed to, and then you rule out intelligent and sometimes necessary discussions. Look at the infamous "n" word, for example. You can't even type it, so how can you discuss it or its use or disuse in society or literature as an academic exercise? And, sometimes, we need to have those talks as a society. But this prevents us from even being honest.

mothershipzeta

ketsuko
reply to post by sealing

 

Any reason all those examples have to with whites?

You wouldn't by chance believe that only whites can be racist.

Feel free to offer your own examples.

I know - it's so hard to be a white male in American society. So difficult. I know I struggle with it every day - never getting pulled over for failing to signal a lane change, not having security follow me as I shop in a nice store...

You forgot: having your heart rate increase when someone dressed as a rapper/gansta/baller enters your view....and you are wondering if you are in the wrong neighborhood, are wearing the wrong color, looked him in the eye, looked weak or made the wrong gesture with your hand and you're about to get attacked....and then feeling racist for thinking that.

You forgot: turning on the TV and seeing people who look like you portrayed as idiots, perverts, criminals or just uncool, while actors, singers and athletes with skin darker than yours are held up as the model for humanity....and then being racist if you mention that.

You forgot: owning a small office supply store and not being able to get big clients because they have a secret policy of only getting their office supplies from minority-owned office supply distributors ***cough Wells Fargo*** But only a racist would mention that.

I'll admit, when you stack it up against slavery and segregation and lynchings, it looks pretty weak. But be patient, comrades. Removing the privileged race from its throne will take a long time.

Snsoc

You forgot: having your heart rate increase when someone dressed as a rapper/gansta/baller enters your view....and you are wondering if you are in the wrong neighborhood, are wearing the wrong color, looked him in the eye, looked weak or made the wrong gesture with your hand and you're about to get attacked....and then feeling racist for thinking that.

Actually you would be quite surprised. I work in a hospital in a very rough neighborhood. Folks get shot there regularly also. The local gas station clerk is behind bullet proof glass. Anyways, the rough, young, thug like appearing men are actually very decent folks and treat us with much respect outside of the hospital. We get yes mam, causal talk, smiles etc... Although I have unwittingly lent out my lighter to someone smoking crack. LOL... But still, they are good people.

Yesterday I was quite amused. A man tried to bum a cigarette from me and his girlfriend smacked his arm and yelled at him. "Don't you ever let me catch you bumming a smoke ever again!" Yeah I get asked 2 or more times a day for cigarettes. We are told by work that we shouldn't since it is a drug.

Anyways, my point is that you need to know people to understand them. Then maybe they won't be so scarey to you?

This racist crap has major ramifications. I have been accused of being a racist (I am not, my roommate was a black until I got married)

What color did he turn when you got married?

Sorry, had to! lol

mothershipzeta


Feel free to offer your own examples.

I know - it's so hard to be a white male in American society. So difficult. I know I struggle with it every day - never getting pulled over for failing to signal a lane change, not having security follow me as I shop in a nice store...

Oh god, lose the self-hate already.

Self-hate among the majority in America is the reason our government gets away with so much!

reply to post by olaru12

America is as racist today as in the 60s.

That is absolute BULL!

I was in New England in the 50s through the nineties. I saw a heck of a lot of racism then. I have been in the south from the nineties to present.

Last night I was at a church festival with Whites, Blacks, Orientals and Hispanics. There was NO racism. Heck we are "Danm Yankees" and have been treated well by most groups

My last ~20 years up north was spent in Boston and racism was very much alive and well. I have NEVER met a nastier group of people!

reply to post by elouina


First Amendment rights, I will defend anyone's right to say anything not directly threatening to the death. Doesn't mean I agree with what they say, just that they have the right to say it.

I also have the right to say what I find appropriate in such situations, which is usually to inquire as to their need to judge me on issues that they have not properly researched and their apparent need to call me an inflammatory and derogatory word when I have not addressed them as such.

What 'Political Correctness' has done is divide the peoples of the United States of America even farther than they had been divided. I grew up in the 60's and 70's, before all of these 'proper' terms were even thought of, and people worked together, played together, and socialized across the entire gamut of skin colors.

I have never accepted the idea of racial differences, the differences are caused by the genetic histories of our forebears resulting from differing environments. We are all of one race, if we were not we could not breed successfully.

I refuse to speak 'Politically Correct', it is nothing but 'newspeak' (google it if you don't know the term). The only African American I have ever known was a white South African immigrant who had received his US citizenship. He was an African American, the black people that I know and have known who were born and raised here in the US are Americans, pure and simple.

A note to black people: If you market yourselves as ignorant, uneducated, non-conforming gangstas, with your music and dress, don't blame us if it has a negative impact on your race. People by and large are not racist's when it comes to blacks, the fact that a black man sits in the white house proves this beyond a shadow of a doubt as blacks by themselves could not have come close to getting someone on the ticket let alone in the WH.

There will always be racist's in society and there are as many black racists as white or brown and to pretend otherwise is truly ignorant. Relations will not improve however until blacks are willing to move forward and pull themselves up to equality with hard work and less whining. Whites have already gone the extra mile it's time for you to carry your own weight.

reply to post by tmeister182


Obama is black? news to me!

Society is not equal or everyone have equal chance, its total BS but its well hidden, at least here in the west, majority will always have control and things will favour them more. Probably same for a Muslim guy in middle east.

Worse is to be a middle class, to top it off, a minority.