A Microbiologist Explains Her Conversion From Evolution To Creation.

reply to post by OpenMindedRealist


I never said I figured you (or anyone else) out. If I offended you, sorry - it is not my intention.

All I did is point to single construct today creationist use in absence of evidence - evolution exist to some degree, but diversity can't be explained with evolution - which more then once was mentioned in this topic, and other often used argument by creationists - 'random' evolution.

Both of those are well explained by Dr. Dawkins in his book Selfish Gene and it is clear that there is no randomness as what specie will survive and have offspring. As well in case of global disaster that scientist believe happened many times on earth, some more prevailing species have better chance at survival, that is how we come to Crocodiles. (mentioned before as example of kind of Dinosaurs that survived global extinction. It is well known that crocodiles did not change much in 180 million years of its existence, and that they develop survivability that allows them to live without food for 2 years. Even they don't like cold weather (because they are cold blooded) they can survive even cold freezing water and hibernate. This helped this kind survive extinction.

sulaw


So we see common equatable factor in that we are all built off the same building blocks in regards to DNA. Hardly, proves evolution or we'd all evolve into 1 single supierior species, hardly the case.

I do see your point however.

Only small thing you forgot - Neanderthals. There were 2 superior species, and one went extinct not that long ago... Guess where you can find some of their genetic code.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Try this one A.I.

So it seems a matter of convenience to me. So that if I say something
like, all serpents/reptiles were cursed to go on their bellys and eat the
dust of the earth in Genesis. That being why there are no more upright
walking reptiles. Dinosaurs suddenly become warm blooded mammals.

Or if I deny that crocodiles were related to dinos because dinos were mammals
back to egg laying cold blooded subtle reptiles we go.

Stop moving the G-D goal posts you calcified cookie crumbling conspirators
and make up my mind ?

chr0naut

SuperFrog
reply to post by tomoe723

 

Let's guess what is more likely to cure cancer - scientist who are looking for cure or prayers?

I don't have problems with scientists using mouse in experiments.

Currently, prayers seem to be winning at curing cancer.

I'm going to assume you're being sarcastic here but in case you're not I'm sure you're going to give us some examples of prayers cursing cancer?

randyvs
reply to post by solomons path

 

Science: Theory is not promoted to fact. Facts are explained by theory.
Religion: Ideology is promoted to fact. Facts are misrepresented to fit Ideology.

So pertaining to evolution Sol.
Dinosaurs are ?

A. Reptiles

B. Mammals

C. Mamtiles
Or
D. Able to shift according to scientific preference during the course
of a discussion such as this one.

Right now I would say D. Obviously !

edit on 29-10-2013 by randyvs because: (no reason given)

E. None of the Above

Dinosaurs are neither mammals nor reptiles.

Now tell me are Dinosaurs mammals or reptiles according to your god?

windword
But who designed and created God?

Who said that God had to be created?

Those who believe in evolution believe that creation created itself, right?
So why can't evolutionists believe that a God can create itself ??
Wouldn't the same principle be applied?

And no, I"m not taking sides on evolution vs creationism.
I'm asking the question to the atheists so I can understand their position.

reply to post by FlyersFan

Who said that God had to be created?

Those who believe in evolution believe that creation created itself, right?
So why can't evolutionists believe that a God can create itself ??
Wouldn't the same principle be applied?

No, no. It's entirely plausible that all the ingredients existed together and were catalyzed by a meteor impact or a similar event.

FlyersFan

windword
But who designed and created God?

Who said that God had to be created?

Those who believe in evolution believe that creation created itself, right?

That doesn't even make sense. Can you show me a single evolutionist that claims that "creation created itself?" (Whatever the hell that means).

reply to post by Firepac

Now tell me are Dinosaurs mammals or reptiles according to your god?

Oh so now you want consult the only real authority ?

Unavailable for comment if you haven't noticed.

randyvs
reply to post by Firepac

 

Now tell me are Dinosaurs mammals or reptiles according to your god?

Oh so now you want consult the only real authority ?

Unavailable for comment if you haven't noticed.

Oh how clever. Didn't you just "consult the only real authority" by asking the same question to evolutionists?

Your god is unavailable for comments because he doesn't exist. And yes we have noticed.

I'm not giving you a hard time .. I"m just asking ...

AfterInfinity
It's entirely plausible that all the ingredients existed together and were catalyzed by a meteor impact or a similar event.

Then two questions ..

- who/what made the ingredients in the first place?
OR
- couldn't the same thing have happened with a 'god'?? All the ingredients existed together and were catalyzed and then evolution happened?? 'Self creating' via some form of evolution??

If evolution can happen with humans then why can't it happen with a god?

I'm just curious as to what evolutionary believing atheists think with that ...
I'm not taking sides or anything so no one yell at me.

SuperFrog

Blue_Jay33
I like these examples as it shows people that were embedded in the evolution theory, through science come to a different conclusion, and it can't be argued that they are ignorant of science and that's why they believe in creation.

Again 'random' factor in process that is everything but not random?!

How many times we will move back to the same basic misunderstanding of evolution. There is no random what species/organism will survive and evolve.

And as for your quote, origin link would be helpful, as your quote has no name behind it or anything else for further research.

Whole story is fishy at its best.

The process of creating random mutations, and culling the worst performing 10% of the population is a strategy that is known to work - it's known as genetic programming, and has been successfully applied to aerodynamics and engineering.

But when you get down to the evolution of cells, there has to be at some point in time, where genetics switched between blocks of amino acids self-organising into sheets, geodesic shapes and spirals floating free in the oceans and the first simple cell that can reproduce. There are large viruses (known as mimi-viruses that cross this gap).

My own theory is that the early earth was one giant cell - any time something managed to self-assemble, another something else managed to figure out a way of disassembling it and recombining the pieces into it's own form. And that would have gone on time and time again, with longer chains each time round; leading to cell membranes and digestive enzymes, protein assembly enzymes. Eventually cell nucleii, mitochondria, enyzmes, signalling receptors and all the other bits and pieces would have formed.

chr0naut
Do some research to disprove me with actual facts and figures, please.

Wow, someone didn't get their fiber this morning. Please tell me what you think:

Truth In Science

At least in science we can create theories, test them and if need be go back to the drawing board to fix/test new theories. Religion not so much as god creates everything, no need to ask questions.

reply to post by SuperFrog

No apologies necessary.

I am not easily offended, though my lack of patience can sometimes lead me to offer less-than-persuasive arguments. Truthfully, persuading others who disagree with me is not the reason I signed up on ATS.

I don't think you and I disagree completely -- certainly our opinions are not as disparate as mine are from some of the more...vocal members in this thread. Darwin was the first to recognize powerful mechanisms that likely occur throughout the natural world, and these mechanisms alter future generations. That, I am sure we can agree on.

I happen to have gone through a process similar to the one the microbiologist describes in the OP. The main difference is that I began to see evidence of design in nature well before I took any interest in theology. Had I not started to think that certain things appeared to be too perfect (such as the constant force of gravity, which if any lesser or greater would result in solar systems flying apart or collapsing too quickly), I would likely have never delved into the spiritual world. That journey is one that I have only recently begun in earnest, as I grew up with basic Christian values but never joined any organized religion.

reply to post by Firepac

Your god is unavailable for comments because he doesn't exist. And yes we have noticed.

Well now there's an absolutel6y unscientific unsubstantiated unproven opnion
that doesn't make a regurgitated pimple on a nats ass. Abscence is not evidence.

But I suppose you find warmth in spouting that tripe without stating anything
that takes it's place. Good show for you. I'm convinced.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


There is one obvious problem with your argument. To even discuss the idea of a deity creating the universe, one has to assume there are processes involved of which we know nothing about.
We don't even understand the relationships between dark matter, matter, and energy.

How could anyone possibly speculate as to the technical aspects of creation, much less creation of a deity? It is an entirely speculative exercise, and the inability to explain it hardly implies that a deity cannot exist.

RedShirt73

chr0naut
Do some research to disprove me with actual facts and figures, please.

Wow, someone didn't get their fiber this morning. Please tell me what you think:

Truth In Science

At least in science we can create theories, test them and if need be go back to the drawing board to fix/test new theories. Religion not so much as god creates everything, no need to ask questions.

I was just wanting some real science, not an opinion piece.

Thanks!

(and I did have my fibre this morning. I just reserve the right to be a cranky old dude at my stage of life).

Would someone please tell me 1..... just 1 thing evolution has done to benifit mankind? I'm not talking about micro evolution either! That's just variation! No new information is ever added, just a scrambling of existing DNA code. So don't give me that nonsense. I want specifics! Don't just spout out all the fields of study without examples. Evolution has never done a damn thing for mankind other than stifle progress. It hasn't given us the micro chip, computer, electricity, or put man on the moon! When your having surgery the doctor doesn't give a lick about it. He just better know the organs, the bones, and how things work and not a fairytale about how we evolved from a rock to a crock in billions of years! It's useless and dangerous! If it's true than you aren't worth a thing, just a piece of protoplasm that washed up on shore! Get real. You've been lied to, brainwashed, indoctrinated and deceived. Read your Bible people. Stop running from God and repent for you ignorance and denial of the One who made you.

Duskangels
Would someone please tell me 1..... just 1 thing evolution has done to benifit mankind? I'm not talking about micro evolution either! That's just variation! No new information is ever added, just a scrambling of existing DNA code. So don't give me that nonsense. I want specifics! Don't just spout out all the fields of study without examples. Evolution has never done a damn thing for mankind other than stifle progress. It hasn't given us the micro chip, computer, electricity, or put man on the moon! When your having surgery the doctor doesn't give a lick about it. He just better know the organs, the bones, and how things work and not a fairytale about how we evolved from a rock to a crock in billions of years! It's useless and dangerous! If it's true than you aren't worth a thing, just a piece of protoplasm that washed up on shore! Get real. You've been lied to, brainwashed, indoctrinated and deceived. Read your Bible people. Stop running from God and repent for you ignorance and denial of the One who made you.

That's as real as logic is going to get. RIGHT HERE ON ATS!.

They won't stop running. They're all to spoiled and being wrong means nothing to them in this forum.
That's also very real.

reply to post by SuperFrog

Only small thing you forgot - Neanderthals. There were 2 superior species, and one went extinct not that long ago... Guess where you can find some of their genetic code. ;

Ohhh my superfrog scientific friend!!! Yes, we do find traces of neanderthal DNA in "some" humans DNA, but is it all??? I would attribute that gene to certain people I see walking around morseso than others, but if I'm not mistaken it's not in all humans. errrr.... Or If it is would it tend to be more dormant in some? DNA is a wild building block to look at...

Looking at what I just typed, it would be evolution at the Genetic level and would agree 100% but as for the mutation... I'm still leary.

Not saying that there is a "God" (Though hint: I do believe in the Divine, take that however you want and I'm non-denominational, religions are too screwy) But if we were created and placed in "Time and Space" and we have Universal laws and Earth bound laws at the same time, one being Evolution, I would be more apt to believe.

I just could never buy the fish growning feet on land.... Until I saw a "Snake Fish".... They are scary...