Christians need to be more like Jews

unb3k44n7
Nobody needs to be like anybody else but themselves.

If anything.

The only person you should try to be is better than the person you were yesterday.

. One step at a time in the right direction and we will get there.

Today is a step back for me and I am going nuts being placed on this insane dualistic planet. It feels like my soul is literally de-evolving from the constant crap. Time to regroup again and center myself and let go of hate of the greedy and people who hurt others for selfish reasons.

reply to post by Snsoc


Your entire OP and premise is completely wrong and misled and ill advised,

The default for "smart people" is atheism?

All Christians, or most Christians, are dumb?

I have a well-above average IQ and I was a certified Terminal Radar Approach Controller in the United States Air Force, my daily job was to communicate to pilots of multimillion dollar US military jet aircraft what vectors and what altitudes to fly their crafts at, where to go and what to do, do you know anything about Air Traffic Control or the academics one must go through to attain certification to even speak to a live Military Aircraft?

Let me show you something;

here is a TINY, TINY list of Christian Intellectuals who have lived in the past century and/or are currently living,

I could find MILLIONS more examples if you would like, there are HUNDREDS of MILLIONS Currently living, and since Christianity was founded 2,000 years ago, BILLIONS have lived, thank you VERY MUCH and God bless you!

2001–today (21st century)

Interest in the relationship between science and religion has increased in recent decades due to continued controversies and recognition from awards like the Templeton Prize.
Name Reason for inclusion
Sir Robert Boyd (1922–2004) A pioneer in British space science who was Vice President of the Royal Astronomical Society. He lectured on faith being a founder of the "Research Scientists' Christian Fellowship" and an important member of its predecessor Christians in Science. He was connected to the University College London which is shown here in an old drawing.[177]
Richard Smalley
(1943–2005) A Nobel Laureate in Chemistry known for buckyballs. In his last years he renewed an interest in Christianity and supported Intelligent design.[178]
Mariano Artigas
(1938–2006) He had doctorates in both physics and philosophy. He belonged to the European Association for the Study of Science and Theology and also received a Templeton Foundation prize for his work in the area of science and religion.[179] The picture is from the University of Navarra where he taught.
Arthur Peacocke
(1924–2006) Anglican priest and biochemist, his ideas may have influenced Anglican and Lutheran views of evolution. Winner of the 2001 Templeton Prize. He was a Dean at Clare College, Cambridge, which is pictured.[180]
C. F. von Weizsäcker
(1912–2007) German nuclear physicist who is the co-discoverer of the Bethe-Weizsäcker formula. His The Relevance of Science: Creation and Cosmogony concerned Christian and moral impacts of science. He headed the Max Planck Society from 1970 to 1980. After that he retired to be a Christian pacifist.[181]
Stanley Jaki
(1924–2009) Benedictine priest and Distinguished Professor of Physics at Seton Hall University, New Jersey, who won a Templeton Prize and advocated the idea modern science could only have arisen in a Christian society.[182]
Allan Sandage
(1926–2010) An astronomer who did not really study Christianity until after age forty. He wrote the article A Scientist Reflects on Religious Belief and made discoveries concerning the Cigar Galaxy which is pictured.[183]
Ernan McMullin
(1924–2011) Ordained in 1949 as a catholic priest, McMullin was a philosopher of science who taught at the University of Notre Dame. McMullin wrote on the relationship between cosmology and theology, the role of values in understanding science, and the impact of science on Western religious thought, in books such as Newton on Matter and Activity (1978) and The Inference that Makes Science (1992). He was also an expert on the life of Galileo.[184] McMullin also opposed intelligent design and defended theistic evolution.[185]
Joseph Murray
(1919-2012) A Catholic surgeon who pioneered transplant surgery. He won the Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine in 1990.[186]
Living

This section concerns significant Christian thinkers in science who are alive today. Those who lead organizations of Christians in science or who write works concerning how Christians of today respond to science.
Name Reason for inclusion
Charles Hard Townes
(born 1915) In 1964 he won the Nobel Prize in Physics and in 1966 he wrote The Convergence of Science and Religion. The picture is of Townes with Dr. Roderic Pettigrew, Townes is on the right.[187]
Ian Barbour
(born 1923) Physicist who wrote Christianity and the Scientists in 1960, and When Science Meets Religion ISBN 0-06-060381-X in 2000. For years he taught at Carleton College, hence their observatory is pictured.[188]
Freeman Dyson
(born 1923) He has won the Lorentz Medal, the Max Planck Medal, and the Lewis Thomas Prize. He also ranked 25th in The 2005 Global Intellectuals Poll. He has won the Templeton Prize and delivered one of the Gifford Lectures.
Antony Hewish
(born 1924) Antony Hewish is a British Radio Astronomer who won the Nobel Prize for Physics in 1974 (together with Martin Ryle) for his work on the development of radio aperture synthesis and its role in the discovery of pulsars. He was also awarded the Eddington Medal of the Royal Astronomical Society in 1969. Hewish is a Christian.[189] Hewish also wrote in his introduction to John Polkinghorne's 2009 Questions of Truth, "The ghostly presence of virtual particles defies rational common sense and is non-intuitive for those unacquainted with physics. Religious belief in God, and Christian belief ... may seem strange to common-sense thinking. But when the most elementary physical things behave in this way, we should be prepared to accept that the deepest aspects of our existence go beyond our common-sense understanding."[190]
Richard H. Bube
(born 1927) He is an emeritus professor of the material sciences at Stanford University. He is a member of the American Scientific Affiliation.[191]
Werner Arber
(born 1929) Werner Arber is a Swiss microbiologist and geneticist. Along with American researchers Hamilton Smith and Daniel Nathans, Werner Arber shared the 1978 Nobel Prize in Physiology or Medicine for the discovery of restriction endonucleases. In 2011, Pope Benedict XVI appointed Arber as President of the Pontifical Academy—the first Protestant to hold that position.[192]
Antonino Zichichi
(born 1929) Italian nuclear physicist and former President of the Istituto Nazionale di Fisica Nucleare. He has worked with the Vatican on relations between the Church and Science.[193]
John Polkinghorne
(born 1930) British particle physicist and Anglican priest who wrote Science and the Trinity (2004) ISBN 0-300-10445-6. Winner of the 2002 Templeton Prize.[194]
Owen Gingerich
(born 1930) Mennonite astronomer who went to Goshen College and Harvard. An old picture of Goshen is shown. Mr. Gingerich has written about people of faith in science history.[195]
John T. Houghton
(born 1931) He is the co-chair of the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change and won a gold medal from the Royal Astronomical Society. He's also former Vice President of Christians in Science.[196]
Russell Stannard
(born 1931) British particle physicist who has written several books on the relationship between religion and science, such as Science and the Renewal of Belief, Grounds for Reasonable Belief and Doing Away With God?.[197]
George Coyne
(born 1933) George V. Coyne, S.J. is a Jesuit priest, astronomer, and former director of the Vatican Observatory and head of the observatory’s research group which is based at the U

Your entire OP and premise is completely wrong and misled and ill advised, The default for "smart people" is atheism? All Christians, or most Christians, are dumb?

Where in the OP does it say that Atheism is the right idea? For me it says that the bible is not the complete story that Christians believe it is. But I might be projecting since my own idea of the bible, that the bible is a test book that should be avoided until you have the tools to understand the hidden meaning and avoid the traps created in it.

I do believe in something more or in a way something more have proven it exists to me so I cannot go back to platos cave and believe in atheism. To much synchronicity in my life to be able to stay blind.

reply to post by LittleByLittle


my good friend,

Seek and you will find,

Knock and the door will open!

Ask God to reveal Himself and Who He Is,

Ask Him if His Christ and His Word are True,

and if they are, to give you the Knowledge of His Spirit to understand them!

In Jesus Name!

God bless you in your search for Truth and Wisdom!

godlover25
reply to post by LittleByLittle

 

my good friend,

Seek and you will find,

Knock and the door will open!

Ask God to reveal Himself and Who He Is,

Ask Him if His Christ and His Word are True,

and if they are, to give you the Knowledge of His Spirit to understand them!

In Jesus Name!

God bless you in your search for Truth and Wisdom!

Knock and the door will open! (yes this one is on the mark and I can agree with).

I do not really have a problem with Jesus but with someone who came after him that I do not trust at all and from my point of view screwed up everything.

Jesus is cool by my book. Any brother or sister who is doing the love another as yourself is one of my soul brothers/sisters.

reply to post by godlover25


You obviously didn't read my post closely.

I said atheism was the default setting of MANY smart people. Not all of them. And nowhere did I say that Christians were dumb. Having said that, I've never met a stupid atheist, but I've met plenty of dumb believers, because belief doesn't require intellect, so it OFTEN draws people who don't or can't think.

Also, the term, "default setting" was perhaps confusing. What I mean is that atheism is generally what smart people choose for themselves, because its the position that requires proof, which faith, by definition, does not supply. MANY smart people choose atheism because they govern themselves by logic and empirical evidence. Most Christians don't make an intellectual choice about Christ-they are raised that way, or they make an emotional decision.

Some atheists are atheists because they are angry at religion or religious people or God, but some of them choose it for the same reason they choose everything else-faith isn't logical. And therein lies the test. 1 Corinthians 1:26 and 27- "not many of you were wise by human standards....God chose the foolish things of the world to shame the wise."

Pushing man-made zionism politically,financially is not
exactly leaving other people alone,
it just annoys us.

Well, raises a good question. Is zionism man-made or God-made?

Throughout the Old Testament, the Israelites were commanded to lie to, spy on, steal from and kill the non-believers. They weren't allowed to do those things to each other, but any worshiper of other gods was fair game. That's pretty much how Mossad and the IDF act today.

Now that mankind is under the New Covenant, we are supposed to love our enemies, as Christ commanded. Even though the Jews do not accept Jesus as the Messiah, from God's point of view, the Covenant still stands. Yes, one day Israel will enjoy the kingdom of God and all of the blessings promised in prophecy, but they are supposed to wait, and not try to accomplish it by human means. Instead, "the kingdom of Heaven suffers violence and violent men take hold of it." The Jews are still trying to bring about prophetic fulfillment by temporal acts.

Yet, I don't see God punishing Israel for their actions. They get richer and richer, take more and more land. So I can only conclude that He's okay with everything they're doing.

@snoc...........You don't see God punishibg Israel.YET. But don't assume Israel is doing something right. ............................................... Do you really think God would exempt Isrsel for its holding gay parades and running brothels in the holy land? Do you think God is ok with israeli comedians insult Jesus on israeli national tv? ..............................................Israel has not been punished, YET. But something tells me Israel is going to pay severely..

sk0rpi0n
@snoc...........You don't see God punishibg Israel.YET. But don't assume Israel is doing something right. ............................................... Do you really think God would exempt Isrsel for its holding gay parades and running brothels in the holy land? Do you think God is ok with israeli comedians insult Jesus on israeli national tv? ..............................................Israel has not been punished, YET. But something tells me Israel is going to pay severely..

In the Old Testament, Israel's sins piled up, and God sent them plenty of warnings to repent, through the prophets-there are no such people today.There are also no sacrifices anymore-even if the Temple were rebuilt, God no longer accepts that type of offering for sin.

If Christianity has replaced prophets and sacrifices, then we're not doing a good job of telling the Chosen to repent-we're too busy taking their side. I wonder how many Christian visitors to the Holy Land know about the prostitution and homosexuality. Probably the same number who know about the way Palestinians are treated.

sk0rpi0n
@snoc...........You don't see God punishibg Israel.YET. But don't assume Israel is doing something right. ............................................... Do you really think God would exempt Isrsel for its holding gay parades and running brothels in the holy land? Do you think God is ok with israeli comedians insult Jesus on israeli national tv? ..............................................Israel has not been punished, YET. But something tells me Israel is going to pay severely..

God can take a joke from my point of view and if Jesus is what I think he is he probably understand that it is the image humans have made of him that they are joking about not Jesus himself.

The hate the gay thing is frankly misguided from my point of view and Jesus would probably himself use the throw the first stone if you are sinless parable. Those that have sin should not throw stones at all and the sinless know better that to throw a stone for something that is symbiotic in nature.

I am pretty sure everyone will get what they deserve but not for the reasons you are quoting here. Building the biggest concetration camp/ghetto in Palastine is a better reason. But then Saudi Arabia and other middle eastern countries are milking the Israel state being there to get their own people to commit to their rulers will and not ask for more democratic (not religious based) self rule (direct democracy not the corrupt politician crap).

Snsoc

sk0rpi0n
@snoc...........You don't see God punishibg Israel.YET. But don't assume Israel is doing something right. ............................................... Do you really think God would exempt Isrsel for its holding gay parades and running brothels in the holy land? Do you think God is ok with israeli comedians insult Jesus on israeli national tv? ..............................................Israel has not been punished, YET. But something tells me Israel is going to pay severely..

In the Old Testament, Israel's sins piled up, and God sent them plenty of warnings to repent, through the prophets-there are no such people today.There are also no sacrifices anymore-even if the Temple were rebuilt, God no longer accepts that type of offering for sin.

If Christianity has replaced prophets and sacrifices, then we're not doing a good job of telling the Chosen to repent-we're too busy taking their side. I wonder how many Christian visitors to the Holy Land know about the prostitution and homosexuality. Probably the same number who know about the way Palestinians are treated.

The prophets are still here and frankly there are probably more now days than there have ever been on earth. People are just not paying attention to them and they have better ways to reach everyone on this planet and act in plain sight but still be hidden. I am pretty sure this is the time of revelation. It is just that most people do not understand the real meaning of revelation. Having faith in something most humans do not even understand the meaning of. What does the sevenfold spirit mean?

This thread hits reality.

I mean, Jesus came from a line of prophets and chosen people by God to set a path in history. Even the beliefs of Islam was inspired by the same original people.

So the way to make them all right, is to convert all of Islam and Christianity into Jews. They can still kepp all of their different practices, but they are all called Jews.

greyer


So the way to make them all right, is to convert all of Islam and Christianity into Jews. They can still kepp all of their different practices, but they are all called Jews.

There is a major misconception by a lot of people
who assume Jesus was about judiasm , this is way off.
Why Don’t Jews Believe In Jesus? :
judiasm will never accept Jesus, and the rest of the
world needs to wake-up and realize this.
At least be informed before Bethlehem is taken by israel too.
At least Palestinians believe in Jesus.

________________________

ToneDeaf

greyer


So the way to make them all right, is to convert all of Islam and Christianity into Jews. They can still kepp all of their different practices, but they are all called Jews.

There is a major misconception by a lot of people
who assume Jesus was about judiasm , this is way off.
Why Don’t Jews Believe In Jesus? :
judiasm will never accept Jesus, and the rest of the
world needs to wake-up and realize this.
At least be informed before Bethlehem is taken by israel too.

At least Palestinians believe in Jesus.

________________________

edit on 18/10/13 by ToneDeaf because: (no reason given)

I looked over that website. It's pretty pathetic for people who are usually very scholarly. The writer keeps saying "but Jewish sources show..." but never tells us who these sources are or exactly what they show.

He makes claims like, "Prophecy can only exist in Israel when the land is inhabited by a majority of world Jewry" without citing any Torah reference for this.

I could go on, but it is a waste of time. They clearly don't want to accept their Messiah.

reply to post by Snsoc


I suspect the ordinary Jew at the time of Jesus didn't get much of a chance to accept their 'Messiah' simply because he differed in his opinions to the different groups of Jewish Rabbi's.

The Rabbi's liked their prestigious positions and the two groups seem to have not trodden on each other's toes so there was plenty of room for both to exist unquestioned till Jesus spoke up. I suspect the key to their displike of Jesus is more to do with his words about ensuring the Jews kept to the Law. Here I think the problem lies in that many Rabbi's rather liked, at different times in history to write bits of their own laws, which were added to the main Law as given by Yahweh and this was the problem for Jesus and his 'mission' faced.

There was also the possibility that through marriage or some mechanism he was their King and if one thinks that he was not prepared to risk his subjects assured defeat and destruction by the Romans, he let the fanatics of the day down by not getting up an army to fight an enemy, who had far better and more resources at his disposal than their "Messiah' had at his. We don't know if they still had the supposed battle resource of the Ark of the Covernant and Yahweh had been 'absent from view' for some considerable time. But if one thinks of the decision of a Messiah looking at his 'forces' Jesus probably made the right decision at the time for his people.

Regarding whether the Christian should act like the Jews Oh please!

reply to post by Snsoc


I see,

I apologize for being quick to judge,

God bless

ToneDeaf
There is a major misconception by a lot of people
who assume Jesus was about judiasm , this is way off.
Why Don’t Jews Believe In Jesus? :
judiasm will never accept Jesus, and the rest of the
world needs to wake-up and realize this.
At least be informed before Bethlehem is taken by israel too.

At least Palestinians believe in Jesus.

That is very opinionated, I believe it is wrong from what I have learned.

When the Lord was saying that to Isaiah, the Lord was speaking in terms of heaven. Jesus was always fulfilling the OT.

godlover25
reply to post by Snsoc

 

I see,

I apologize for being quick to judge,

God bless

No problem, brother.

Thank you.

Snsoc
There's an interesting phenomenon at work on the ATS boards when it comes to discussing theology; if someone wants to criticize ignorance in religion, they almost always turn their guns on Christians. I'm not saying that its not deserved in some-okay,many-cases, but as others have already pointed out, we get numerous threads questioning the existence or divinity of Jesus, the scientific impossibility of Biblical stories and the shortage of supporting archaeological evidence for Biblical characters, events and places...but we never get anyone questioning whether or not Buddha really existed or if Krishna was really the incarnation of Brahma. 95% of the time, it's Christians in the hot seat. (The other 5% of the time, it's people pointing out something really shocking about Islam, maybe hoping we'll support the War on Terror or something.)

I'm not here to complain about the unfairness of that; I understand that the majority of ATS is in America, where Christianity is the dominant religion, and that atheism (and the religion-bashing that often accompanies it) is the default setting setting of many smart people. BTW, I do think it's foolish for Christians to try to intellectually prove God and the Bible, as it can't be done. There's nothing wrong with disproving faulty research that people sometimes use to discredit Christianity, but the bottom line is that belief is exactly that-faith. If it were scientifically provable, everyone would accept it, and it would be worthless.

Yes, Christianity has a lot of beliefs that seem ridiculous:

* the idea that the Earth is only 6,000 years old and was made in six days.
*the idea that all races of people sprang from one family.
* the idea that two members of every species on Earth could fit in a boat the size of a WW2 destroyer.
* the idea that humans were going to build a tower to Heaven and that God was concerned that it would work, so he invented all the languages.
* the idea that homosexuality and witchcraft are evil.


What a retarded collection of beliefs, right? You know who else has those beliefs? Jews. In fact, we got all those ideas from them. And yet, you never hear anybody saying, "Those Jews are so ignorant!" No, instead it's "Those Christians are so ignorant!"

Part of why this happens is because criticizing Jewish people in this day and age is about as socially acceptable as cannibalism or pedophilia, but part of it has to do with the fact that people leave the Jews alone (at least when it comes to their faith), because they leave other people alone. They're not pushing their morality on people.

The main reason why people get uptight about Christianity is that we try to impose our morality on society as a whole. Jesus never mandated this, and he never asked us to do it either. We're supposed to spread the Gospel, and love people. That's it.

If you press Christian activists on it this issue, they will reply that it is important that a nation obey the laws of God so that the entire nation will be financially blessed and kept from harm. Well, guess where this idea came from. Yup. the Old Testament, also known as the Jewish Torah. The New Testament tells us to obey the laws of the land. It doesn't say anything about changing them. The New Testament tells us not to love money-so why are we seeking financial blessings by (selectively) keeping a mixture of Old and New Testament Law?

So I propose that if Christians are so hot to pretend to be Jewish, then we should behave like the Jews and stop annoying people. This would be good PR, and it can help us attract more people to the faith.

You can't possibly fathom that Christianity is always targeted because Christianity is true and the enemy of this world and the Kingdom of God?

By the way, the beliefs you ascribed Christians, are actually Jewish Rabbinical beliefs such as the Earth being 6,000 years old. Noah's ark never held every species of animal on earth, the Bible doesn't say that. The tower of Babel represented man's pride in unison, not our ability to really reach Heaven.

And homosexuality is a sin, like many other sins, I don't know where you get witchcraft from tho....

You can't possibly fathom that Christianity is always targeted because Christianity is true and the enemy of this world and the Kingdom of God?

Of course. From the spiritual realm, that is what is going on. It's good that you mention it, because maybe it will make people stop and think about which is the true path. But I'm talking about not giving people reasons to reject us based on our un-Biblical behavior.

1 Peter 4:14 "If you are reviled for the name of Christ, you are blessed, because the Spirit of glory and of God rests upon you. 15 By no means let any of you suffer as a murderer, or thief, or evildoer, or a troublesome meddler."

I think people fall in the "troublesome meddler" category too many times, trying to legislate morality, etc.

By the way, the beliefs you ascribed Christians, are actually Jewish Rabbinical beliefs such as the Earth being 6,000 years old. Noah's ark never held every species of animal on earth, the Bible doesn't say that. The tower of Babel represented man's pride in unison, not our ability to really reach Heaven.

Ummm...most Protestants believe in the young Earth theory, following James Usser's tracing of Biblical genealogies back to 4004 BC. It's at the heart of Creationism/Intelligent Design, which they are trying to push in schools, much to the detriment of our purpose.

The Bible quite clearly says that about Noah. Genesis 6:20 says two of every kind. Genesis 7:18-22 reports that the entire surface of the Earth was covered and that every animal was killed. So unless it was on the ark, it stopped existing.

And story of the Tower of Babel does not mention "pride." It quite clearly says "And the Lord said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do." (Genesis 11:6)

And homosexuality is a sin, like many other sins, I don't know where you get witchcraft from tho....

Exodus 22 :18.