Pentagon unit held 'phony' ceremonies for MIAs, using planes that can't fly

HONOLULU — A unit of the U.S. Department of Defense has been holding so-called "arrival ceremonies" for seven years, with an honor guard carrying flag-draped coffins off of a cargo plane as though they held the remains of missing American service men and women returning that day from old battlefields.
After NBC News raised questions about the arrival ceremonies, the Pentagon acknowledged Wednesday that no honored dead were in fact arriving, and that the planes used in the ceremonies often couldn't even fly but were towed into position.
The solemn ceremonies at a military base in Hawaii are a sign of the nation's commitment to returning and identifying its fallen warriors. The ceremonies have been attended by veterans and families of MIAs, led to believe that they were witnessing the return of Americans killed in World War II, Vietnam and Korea.
The ceremonies also have been known, at least among some of the military and civilian staff here, as The Big Lie.

As the parent of a veteran who thankfully came home alive, this conspiring to dupe grieving families is.....disgusting.

Jesse Baker, an 81-year-old Air Force veteran of World War II and Korea living in Honolulu, said he has been to more than 50 of these ceremonies. He told NBC News that he's always been under the impression that the plane had just arrived carrying recovered remains.
"If I have been fooled, I am going to be a very pissed-off citizen, because I've been going for years," Baker said. "And I know a lot of guys who are going to be pissed off. ... They're out there honoring warriors."
Baker tried to make sense of why America's Department of Defense would work so hard to trick him and other veterans. "That's disturbing. I don't know when they stopped being honest and switched over to this Mickey Mouse, but whoever did it, I hope they find him a new job somewhere."
One leading figure in the MIA/POW field said she has known for years about the charade. The head of the largest group of families of missing service men and women, Ann Mills-Griffiths, is a staunch defender of JPAC, but she told NBC that she has warned Pentagon officials and JPAC repeatedly that they should stop holding "those phony arrival ceremonies."
But Mills-Griffiths, the chairman of the National League of POW/MIA Families, said she had never told any family members that the ceremonies were phony, because she supported JPAC's mission, if not the way it was carrying it out.

Is anything real anymore? How is perpetuating a hoax on military veterans and families in any way honoring them?

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One leading figure in the MIA/POW field said she has known for years about the charade. The head of the largest group of families of missing service men and women, Ann Mills-Griffiths, is a staunch defender of JPAC, but she told NBC that she has warned Pentagon officials and JPAC repeatedly that they should stop holding "those phony arrival ceremonies."

Another leader of a group going along with a cover up. Why didn't she tell others so the charade could be stopped and made real. I suppose fake returns stops the need to actual find the missing. Just another case of the gov pretending to being doing something to appease the masses.

reply to post by DancedWithWolves


i wonder if they were listing them as unknown soldiers or actually putting a name to these empty coffins.
i'm nor supporting the lie by saying this, i hope their listed as unknown? as i can't imagine the grief, and anger at thinking a loved one was found, only to find out that my government had lied to me about my family member.

it's all all about the money, i bet they took the money saved and put it into black projects, or it made it's way into someones personal accounts.

and they wonder why people don't trust the government.

reply to post by DancedWithWolves


This is absolutely disgusting and totally unfair on the bereaved families. This must really feel like a punch in the face for these families, shameful.

I do have one question though concerning the article you posted:-

Jesse Baker, an 81-year-old Air Force veteran of World War II and Korea living in Honolulu, said he has been to more than 50 of these ceremonies. He told NBC News that he's always been under the impression that the plane had just arrived carrying recovered remains.

How old is this article? WWII finished in 1945, which would have made Jesse Baker 13/14 when it finished. Maybe it's a mistake, but it does make you question the validity.

I have been on some of these JPAC missions.

Many times we will know that we have found the location of where a service member died, like the wreckage of aircraft, and we will find a bone or organic material burned into pieces of metal and we will send it back to the US for analysis. But sometimes we can't find any of their physical remains even if we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that our guys had died in that location.

In those cases you have these ceremonies with no actual remains, there is nothing nefarious about it. It is to give closure to the families.

reply to post by watchitburn


I applaud the mission, but they are recycling remains. These are not newly arrived remains. They are remains that have been sitting in the lab, are borrowed for the dog and pony show and then returned to the lab as if they were newly discovered. How is that not nefarious treatment of already discovered remains?

The Pentagon statement did not explain why the rituals were called "arrival ceremonies" if no one was arriving, or why the public had been told that remains removed that morning from the lab were about to go to the lab to "begin the identification process."

I do appreciate your recovery efforts, as do many.

reply to post by DancedWithWolves


I can't speak to what happens at those ceremonies, my experience was only on the searching and sending back what we could find portion.

Edit:

I think it was just misguided, probably by politicians. I don't think it had any intention other than to give the families peace.

So basically, even the handling of American war dead is such great entertainment for some people's thinking, it's worth setting up 100% and purely as a show for the audience while letting the shmucks think they are seeing the real thing.

I am SURE people would be happier with nothing to watch, giving the idea that no one died for that days 'entertainment' show.

How friggin sick. I'm just outraged and sick with this garbage. Some people know absolutely NO shame and damn sure NO Honor.

nothing suprises me anymore about america and the politicians that run it .

this is but 1 more nail in the coffin so to speak

DancedWithWolves

Is anything real anymore? How is perpetuating a hoax on military veterans and families in any way honoring them?

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edit on 10-10-2013 by DancedWithWolves because: fix link

Is that motion blur i see, from a funeral scene??

Is this even a kosher photo? Is anything real anymore, indeed!

reply to post by UpEndedWorld


With a good camera, that can be done with very slow movement. It's a trick using depth of field with camera config to get that effect. It stands out doesn't it? It's one of the first things my photography class taught us to do.

If the depth of field is short then the area not in it is not in sharp focus. The amount out of focus can vary.

They've been holding these ceremonies longer than 7 years. It's been that long since I left there, and these were going on for years before I left. I went to a number of them. I can't speak about now, but the ones that I went to NEVER used a non-flyable plane. As much as 90% of them the plane landed and taxied straight to the parking spot, and the ceremony was held (it may have been more than that, but my memory isn't always the greatest, sue me, it's crowded in there).

I can think of one or two that the plane (the same one they arrived on) was towed to the parking spot, because when they arrived a VIP was parked there (the parking spot used was in front of Base Ops, and was where we parked VIP planes. As soon as they left, or the aircraft was moved to another parking spot, the plane that brought the remains in was moved into position and the ceremony held.

Now, me personally, I don't have a problem with it, because they weren't out to dupe anyone. The determination was made that it would be better to get to work on the remains, and get them identified that much sooner, rather than let them sit for 24+ hours on the plane, waiting for the spot to open for the ceremony.

Very very rarely was there family there, for the simple reason that these were old remains, and they weren't sure who they were. They would go to multiple families if it was an aircraft with multiple crew members, and take DNA swabs to compare the DNA from the remains to, but wouldn't tell anyone who it was, until they were 100% certain.