how reagan ruined the economy with reagan-nomics, or greed unleashed

reply to post by LoneGunMan


I figured I wouldn't get love for my personal respect and appreciation for what President Reagan managed to accomplish. That's a bit harsh tho, isn't it?

Has to be something in the airwaves that make smart people not understand things that at one time EVERYONE understood.

..Anyway.. Tis the day for agreeing to disagree I suppose, so why not add another topic and thread line to it. Yeah.. I do think well of Reagan. Was he perfect? lol.... In some ways he was one of the coldest and most ruthless Presidents we've ever had. Director Casey helped beyond measure with that aspect of his 8 years, but I will say this... Few, if any nations mocked us and those who did....well, we could ask Qadaffi about that, but even Reagan didn't have him hunted down, raped in the street and executed in the dirt. He had a bit more class, I believe. (It took recent Western leadership to do that 2 decades later..)

Don't get me started about Iran, Nicaragua and El Salvador during Reagan's years. I did note he was ruthless and that wasn't a good thing in every case.

What he did though, was help greatly in ending the cold war. I'm rather happy to not need to worry about teaching my kid where the Civil Defense shelter is ...what fallout is...or what weather patterns are locally for expected target areas of a nuclear strike. All things I learned both from family and the system of the 80's I was a product of.

Whatever else Reagan did, he had a great influence on seeing that end how it did, shortly after he left office. He also had real nerve and courage on things like the ATC Strike ....and another thing I just know I'll get hate for saying...but he did the right thing and if we had leaders with courage to act on their convictions (even when wrong), we'd be in MUCH better shape now than we are, IMO.

FlyersFan
reply to post by stormson

 

You just want to rape those who are successful and loot from their efforts.
And you want to disguise it as 'the right thing to do for the poor'.
That's not exactly 'moral'. It's parasitic.
And again ... no .... you haven't 'won' anything. Keep dreaming.

Everything America has is by the blood of young men. Always been that way and in the US history more so than pretty much any other. And today, those that give the most do so and in the past were drafted. There is NOONE that deserve more than veterans.

I think that unless you had the courage to serve, you deserve back of the line privs for life.

What baffles me is this.
I have always wondered, if people on forums, talk shows, etc., who always seem so worried about the taxes of rich people, whether they themselves are rich.

If not, then what is the mentality of people who worry about the taxes the rich pay?

Do you look back in history and grieve over the taxes paid by Caesar and Marie Antoinette?

Just wondering…

reply to post by Willtell


We don't live under Julius Caesar and it's been a bit since he was anyone's concern I believe.

Marie Antoinette is synonymous with the 'Let them eat cake' remark and, as I recall, lost her head over that whole tax and spend concept. That's an interesting example to use. lol....

I personally am not rich and don’t have any grudges against rich people. I am in-fact hopeful that they are happy and glad for their success.

But never feel inclined to worry about their tax rates.

I can understand people who are rich worrying about it, but lower and middle class people, why?

Is it some weird form of altruism?

Or is it that you yourself one day wish to be rich and you don’t want to be paying these high taxes.

That makes sense too.

But for the poor and near poor to care about the taxes of the rich to me....

IS INSANE!

reply to post by stormson


Time to move on my friend. There have been a lot of people and events that have caused the train to go off the rails since then. Try looking at Clinton's presidency and see how the banks were "unleashed" to play with our money and then once they lost it, the government gave them more of OUR MONEY!

Willtell
What baffles me is this.
I have always wondered, if people on forums, talk shows, etc., who always seem so worried about the taxes of rich people, whether they themselves are rich.

If not, then what is the mentality of people who worry about the taxes the rich pay?

Do you look back in history and grieve over the taxes paid by Caesar and Marie Antoinette?

Just wondering…

because we do NOT have a free market. The rich, I mean the REAL rich, have designed the system where all MUST put into thru tax, yet they have loopholes, off shore accts, tax shelters, capital gains HALF what a man's wages are taxed, and then thru CRONYISM and POLITICAL FAVORS, certain companies ----> the ones the rich own

reply to post by FlyersFan


Ambition is not bad, although where are the lines? We could basically even imply that drug dealer or some other criminal, like human trafficker is ambitious. Should a runner win by eliminating opponents or by being the fastest? Is exploiting others for personal gain justified now as ambition? I ambitious, so should I go to Asia find out the most desperate people and let them make products at minimal salary, so I could go where I live and sell these at 100x the cost of what it cost to make these?

I do support ambition which has at least certain lines in it. What is happening right now around the world (not in all but too many companies) , is simply legal way of exploiting people for personal gain, nothing else. A company can not fully function without any of its members in the collective. Any tech company is just as dependent on its engineers and design teams rather than the CEO, yet salaries do not reflect reality at all. Stronger engineers are definitely not easy to find, just a strong CEO, yet the salary difference amounts to hundreds of times in top companies.

FlyersFan

buster2010
The constant cutting of taxes is what screwed this country.

No. The constant irresponsible spending of the US Government is what screwed this country.

Zombieland indeed. Your opinion not fact - state it as such or provide valid proof.

GOOD! The lower the taxes, the better. The government has NO RIGHT to steal money from Americans. We are already over taxed. There is no reason for the taxes to be as high as they are. If the government would spend more wisely, we wouldnt' be paying the taxes that we do today.

Then what? Hoard all that money? Sadly the desire to hoard well is only natual, just like the desire to overeat is. Money that is kept outside of the economy is just paper and does no good at all. A strong economy runs of money running through its veins, and not on money that is hoarded offshore, necessitating printing presses to replace money that has been exiltrated from the system, but can still be reintroduced into the system by the owner.

High Taxes on high earnings encourage spending and spending moves money around and drives the economy. If the players buy themselves some referees then you get the mess we are in now, where poverty is rampant and company profits and the profits for the 1% at record levels.

Also taxes on fixed incomes and other means to take from the little people could be severally reduced if those with the power and wealth to influence politics wouldnt use their influence to take the money they made with the American and European customer away from the country, by hiding it or by influencing how it is taxed.

And when less money comes from the rich, then it has to come from someplace else, you and if you cant pay that money either, because you already are underwater as it is, then services get cancelled teachers canned and one day you wake up and the country that is home to most of the companies that had a very good decade is in foreclosure.

reply to post by Merinda


Some people will never get it.

www2.ucsc.edu...

In the United States, wealth is highly concentrated in a relatively few hands. As of 2010, the top 1% of households (the upper class) owned 35.4% of all privately held wealth, and the next 19% (the managerial, professional, and small business stratum) had 53.5%, which means that just 20% of the people owned a remarkable 89%, leaving only 11% of the wealth for the bottom 80% (wage and salary workers).

80% of American's account for only 11% of the wealth in this country.
That 80% is living pay check to pay check so they are all tapped out.
The Government can't take anymore from them because the wealth they have would do nothing to fix the status quo.
It would also only be cutting the throats of the elite since it would be cutting the purchasing power of this 80%

The fight going on in Washington is not between the 80% and the Government, that have no political nor monetary power, but between the top 20% consisting of the Financial Industry, Corporations and Politicians.

It does not matter who wins or looses in these fights because the majority of Americans will loose either way we these parasites at the helm.

FyreByrd
Zombieland indeed. Your opinion not fact - state it as such or provide valid proof.

My god. Did you really just say that?
You people actually have to be spoon fed facts about gov't waste?
Really? WOW. It's a well known FACT that the government wastes money.
(and yes, obviously those who are ignorant about the waste ARE zombies)

Business Insider - Exmaples of 16 Billion in Government Waste

Wastebook 2012 - 18 Billion in Waste Spending

Heritage Foundation - 50 Examples of Government Waste

Here's a good one .... Washington will spend $2.6 million training Chinese prostitutes to drink more responsibly on the job. And there is this - The refusal of many federal employees to fly coach costs taxpayers $146 million annually in flight upgrades. Oh ... and this .... Washington has spent $3 billion re-sanding beaches -- even as this new sand washes back into the ocean. etc etc etc

20 Examples of Government Waste

More Examples of Outrageous Government Waste of money
Included in this list are the facts that the Pentagon and Central Intelligence Agency channeled some $11 million to psychics who might provide special insights about various foreign threats as well as the Department of Education spent $34 million supposedly helping Americans become better shoppers and homemakers. etc etc

reply to post by FlyersFan


There is no disputing that Government waste is huge and that the taxes are too high on the people who actually do the work in this country - but to defend those banksters and CEO's making 300 x what the average worker makes is crazy. They truly are the problem and our politicians are in their pocket, of course.

toolgal462
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

There is no disputing that Government waste is huge and that the taxes are too high on the people who actually do the work in this country - but to defend those banksters and CEO's making 300 x what the average worker makes is crazy. They truly are the problem and our politicians are in their pocket, of course.

The same bankers that nearly destroyed the world econemy and have destroyed thousands of lives.

This is what I dont get with some.

With power and wealth should come responsibility. Thats the price of success. You cant expect something for nothing.

These teaparty fools ect preach personal responsibilty for the poor yet when it comes to the rich that somehow doesnt apply.

Sorry if your rich and powerfull and your every descion and action can affcet thousands or millions of people you should DAMED well be held responsible for your sucesses and mistakes.

Dont want that responsiblity ? Then dont become rich and powerfull.


It the lack of holding the rich and powerfull acountble that has lead to many of the worst events the last 100 years.

buster2010
reply to post by FlyersFan

 

We are already over taxed.

If you think we are overtaxed now you know nothing about paying taxes. The constant cutting of taxes is what screwed this country.

For some reason the Right only thinks its ok to tax the wealthy and their profit bloated
corporations if the person asking is A. white 2. Republcan and 3. Named General Dwight D Eisenhower.
Then it's for the good of the country & then it's ok to have powerful Unions.

reply to post by stormson


First of all Reagan was never president..GHW Bush was.

Its always the the vp that has all the power...Secretly i should say.

jacobe001
reply to post by Merinda

 

Some people will never get it.

www2.ucsc.edu...

In the United States, wealth is highly concentrated in a relatively few hands. As of 2010, the top 1% of households (the upper class) owned 35.4% of all privately held wealth, and the next 19% (the managerial, professional, and small business stratum) had 53.5%, which means that just 20% of the people owned a remarkable 89%, leaving only 11% of the wealth for the bottom 80% (wage and salary workers).

80% of American's account for only 11% of the wealth in this country.
That 80% is living pay check to pay check so they are all tapped out.
The Government can't take anymore from them because the wealth they have would do nothing to fix the status quo.
It would also only be cutting the throats of the elite since it would be cutting the purchasing power of this 80%

The fight going on in Washington is not between the 80% and the Government, that have no political nor monetary power, but between the top 20% consisting of the Financial Industry, Corporations and Politicians.

It does not matter who wins or looses in these fights because the majority of Americans will loose either way we these parasites at the helm.

out of that 11% left over, the bottom 50% only control 2.5%. the figures are bleak when you break it all the way down.

the walmart heirs, all 6 of them, control more wealth than 93,000,000 americans combined.

reply to post by stormson


At least Walmart sells products at good prices so the masses do benefit from their corporation.

What product or service does a Wall Street broker or Investment banker or a Larry Summers, Timothy Geitners, etc...actually provide? And to whom?

If we had a government that cared about the people and not just plelasing their overlords, those few people mentioned above would be in shackles - yet instead they hold political positions and power.

This is just SICK....

I actually am in shock.... The title of this thread is calling someone else greedy.... Yet taxing someone or a business however u want to slice it... 91 percent... Wouldn't that be the definition of greed? I really am in shock here.

Willtell
What baffles me is this.
I have always wondered, if people on forums, talk shows, etc., who always seem so worried about the taxes of rich people, whether they themselves are rich.

If not, then what is the mentality of people who worry about the taxes the rich pay?

Do you look back in history and grieve over the taxes paid by Caesar and Marie Antoinette?

Just wondering…

Simple. Because the "tax the undeserving rich" is simply a smoke and mirrors excuse to raise taxes and increase control over everyone. TPTB need the class warfare angle to get the sheep to agree with an ever expanding and more controlling government under the guise of "fairness." It works because, no matter who you are (Bill Gates aside) there is always going to be someone "richer" than you and that's the guy they want you to envy and "stick it to" because it is "unfair."

A logical person understands that true economic freedom only exists when everyone is economically free. When we defend "the EVIL one percent," we are not "defending the rich" but rather everyone's economic freedom. And no, economic freedom does not mean handouts or artificially mandated "living wages" but true freedom to pursue your economic dreams and to keep the products of your labor, innovation, and talent.