Iranian President Hassan Rouhani wants constructive dialogue and to end rivalry with the US

majesticgent
Is this a result of the sanctions working, is it a clever ploy to but more time for their ally Syria, are the world's leaders finally coming to their senses?

1 - Sanctions rarely work. So no, it's not sanctions.

2 - This isn't a 'clever' ploy .. it's just a ploy .. for more time. cease-fires are war tactics over there. So are calls for 'peace talks'. Even if Iran was being up front about it (which history shows is very unlikely) ... Obama would screw it up on this end.

3 - No, the worlds' leaders will never come to their senses.

IMHO

reply to post by Xcathdra


If we are to understand the motivations and drivers of those in power in Iran it is essential to understand Twelver Shi'a beliefs and the differences between the established old guard and the Hojjatieh and even the millenarians.

Twelver Shi'a believe in the divinely ordained twelve Imams and that the twelfth Imam who went into occultation in 941 and whose return will herald some major confrontation and the advent of a new Caliphate.

Whilst most Twelvers believe Muslims should live a devout life in accordance to The Koran until such time that The Mahdi reveals himself followers of The Hojjatieh believe that they should work towards creating an environment of conflict that will hasten The Mahdi's return.
The more millenarian minded like Ahamdinejad seems to have increasingly leant towards believe that the emergence of The Mahdi is imminent and that the power and authority of the old guard are redundant - they seem to have been eliminated as a threat in the recent power struggle.

The Haghani Circle, and by extension The Hojjatieh Society, have long been suspected of infiltrating Iran's military and sercurity services, including the IRG.
The IRG's role and influence within Iran increased during Ahmadinejad's rule to such an extent that some analysts believe their power could directly challenge that of The Supreme Leader and The Guardian Council, the old guard and relatively less extreme.

This is the power struggle that is ongoing at present - on one side the old guard who wish to use Ahamadinejad as a scapegoat and to forge friendlier links to 'The West' and relaxation of the sanctions that are biting hard and hurting the Iranian people - and on the other the more extreme Hojjatieh and like minded groups who believe in creating constant conflict and friction in an effort to delibearely bring about the re-emergence of The Mahdi.

It is impossible to over estimate the power and faith in The Mahdi that many Twelvers, Iranians and all those involved in this power struggle have.

If Obama fails to respond positively to these overtures then it will only strengthen the influence of the more extreme Hojjatieh elements within Iran.

reply to post by majesticgent


This is just a game to Iran that they will win with the current Muslim in the oval office, especially with the inept Kerry running the state department. Iran knows the U.S. wont attack them now and that will only leave Israel hanging in dangerous waters. They are all being told what to do by Putin now that he has decided he will lead the Gog-Magog invasion force against Israel, since he sees Obama's weakness or outright support of AQ and the Muslim Brotherhood.

Israel must be very pissed off that they have such a traitor in the White House. And before you anti-Semites bash Israel, just remember that if Israel ever got in the hands of the Arabs you will never be able to visit there again and will see the destruction of every ancient Jewish and Christian site that dates back thousands of years. Israel protects all these sites and anyone can visit them today, unless you are a terrorist that is!

One of the tenants of islam is to build power in secret until victory is all but assured. In the mean time they bide their time falsely negociateing this and that to keep their enemies off guard. They have every intention of creating an atomic arsenal to use in aggressive posture. Time and again this islamic tenant has proven out in history.

You can not trust muslims. If you are not one, you are slated for death, period....

Quote..... "Israel must be very pissed off that they have such a traitor in the White House."



&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&&
When he has sold them out, they will eliminate him, Mosad will not play games with Obama.

They're only asking for it, because they know the US wont give it!

Iranians are a peaceful rational nation,we do not wish to see war and suffering taking place anywhere around the world.A quick search of Iran's record will prove that we have been peaceful for centuries...We have not invaded,occupied or intervened any foreign country because there is no reason for any sane country to do such a thing...But can you honestly say the same about the US/UK/Israel?...Well you might say they are the masters of the world and they do as they please,who is Iran or anybody else to tell them how to act or do their stinking business around the world!..And I'll say that the times for that kind of nonsense bullying is over,people all around the world are informed and they mostly know about the real intentions of the western powers in the worlds affairs...If you can not talk with respect and with logic,then I am afraid you are going to loose this popularity contest and have to pay the severe consequences....After all the US needs Iran more than Iran need them.

People are sick and tired of war in america and europe.

People want a job, but they cant find one easily enough.

Everyone wants a little peace and prosperity for a change.

Of course if you have millions of MIC shares and are hungry for dividends and splits, then everyone is the enemy. Shoot first and ask questions later. Its pathetic and evil!

reply to post by shapur


Its true iran has a much better track record than NATO but when you constantly badmouth israel then you should expect some backlash. Middle eastern leaders talk about israel for domestic distraction. If you cant fix your own problems then look at other peoples fault.

Israel simply wants a jewish state and to be left alone. Sure they have made mistakes but no one is perfect.

reply to post by Xcathdra


From your link it may help if you read it before saying someone is wrong.

Though a Taliban leader said the regime might surrender bin Laden if the Bush administration halted the bombing and provided evidence linking the Saudi exile to the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon, the president repeated his longstanding position: "There is no negotiation. Period."

Patriotsrevenge
reply to post by majesticgent

 

This is just a game to Iran that they will win with the current Muslim in the oval office, especially with the inept Kerry running the state department. Iran knows the U.S. wont attack them now and that will only leave Israel hanging in dangerous waters. They are all being told what to do by Putin now that he has decided he will lead the Gog-Magog invasion force against Israel, since he sees Obama's weakness or outright support of AQ and the Muslim Brotherhood.

Israel must be very pissed off that they have such a traitor in the White House. And before you anti-Semites bash Israel, just remember that if Israel ever got in the hands of the Arabs you will never be able to visit there again and will see the destruction of every ancient Jewish and Christian site that dates back thousands of years. Israel protects all these sites and anyone can visit them today, unless you are a terrorist that is!

Israel isn't part of America so they have no traitor in the White house. Why would I want to visit a racist apartheid state like Israel? And the anyone can visit these sites are BS most of these sites you have to get permission to visit when the Muslims were in Charge you didn't have to get permission. And Israel has been condemned for destroying sites that are holy to Muslims and now have set their sights on the Al Aqsa Mosque. Btw the old if you bash Israel then you are anti semitic is really getting old. Criticizing the policies of Israel has nothing to do with Anti-semitism because Israel isn't really a Jewish state because they are not following the ideals of Judaism. Because if they were then they wouldn't be killing the Palestinians and they wouldn't be stealing their land.

EarthCitizen07
reply to post by shapur

 

Its true iran has a much better track record than NATO but when you constantly badmouth israel then you should expect some backlash. Middle eastern leaders talk about israel for domestic distraction. If you cant fix your own problems then look at other peoples fault.

Israel simply wants a jewish state and to be left alone. Sure they have made mistakes but no one is perfect.

Yes after doing nothing but attacking their neighbors for six decades they just want to be left alone.

Of course the USA are the aggressors.

Just in the past 10 years, They have Illegally invaded Iraq, illegally invaded Afghanistan, interfered with Lybia, Killed Saddam Hussein, Killed Col. Gaddafi, killed 100s of 1000s of innocent people, destroyed cities, attacked friendly countries like Pakistan without permission (except Americas right!!), was about to have no problems attacking Syria, in which they were'nt even invited let alone allowed to....and people wonder why the World is angry at the Americans.

I can just imagine Little Ill Kim..." Ha Ha You giv in to America, ha ha , we will blow them out of water, our missiles will flatten them, our people will......ah whats that, ohh time for brunch, ok everybludy, back in 1 our.....now dont forget you promised me MacDonald Happy meals all I can eat right?, you know the ones from Seoul, dont want any of that local rubbish Ok!!, is Rodman here yet?..."

buster2010
reply to post by Xcathdra

 

From your link it may help if you read it before saying someone is wrong.

Though a Taliban leader said the regime might surrender bin Laden if the Bush administration halted the bombing and provided evidence linking the Saudi exile to the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks on the World Trade Center and Pentagon, the president repeated his longstanding position: "There is no negotiation. Period."

You are still wrong in your claim... The Taliban stated they would turn Bin Laden over to a neutral 3rd party, NOT the US.

The Taliban opted to stand with Bin Laden.
You opted to ignore what the Taliban's response was when the US demanded they turn him over.

Bush gave them an option - turn Osama over to the US.
The Taliban response was to try and negotiate by trying to stop bombing us and we will look into the matter but only if Osama is turned over to a 3rd party country.

Try and spin it how you will.. You are wrong on this one.

buster2010

Israel isn't part of America so they have no traitor in the White house. Why would I want to visit a racist apartheid state like Israel? And the anyone can visit these sites are BS most of these sites you have to get permission to visit when the Muslims were in Charge you didn't have to get permission. And Israel has been condemned for destroying sites that are holy to Muslims and now have set their sights on the Al Aqsa Mosque. Btw the old if you bash Israel then you are anti semitic is really getting old. Criticizing the policies of Israel has nothing to do with Anti-semitism because Israel isn't really a Jewish state because they are not following the ideals of Judaism. Because if they were then they wouldn't be killing the Palestinians and they wouldn't be stealing their land.

But you are going BEYOND CRITICISING israel when you overlook the constant arab aggression towards that state and blame israel FOR EVERYTHING! Israel is not stealing anything from judea. Palestine came after judea. Sure some people got displaced and ended up in refugee camps. But jews have every right to live there just like muslims and christians do. BOTH SIDES are fanatical and both sides prefer to keep the land for themselves. I dont think they can tolerate each other at all, which is why the two state solution came to existance and has remained to this day.

That place should be one country. They can call it israel or palestine, as it makes no difference to me and is arguing semantics anyway. Make everyone who wants to be a citizen a citizen and deport the fanatics away. The only real issue should be jerusalem which is holly to all three major abrahamic religions.

Are you arab btw? Strong bias in all your posts! Before you criticise me of being jewish, I am an orthodox christian and a non-practicing one as well. I am sick and tired of mainstream religions. I believe the ancient astronaut hypothesis which makes more sense.

shapur
Iranians are a peaceful rational nation,we do not wish to see war and suffering taking place anywhere around the world.

This is the distinction people need to make.. I agree the Iranian people are peaceful and do not want war.. The Iranian government on the other hand has a track record that does not support the goal of the Iranian people. Just as the argument can be made in the reverse for the US people and the US government.

shapur
A quick search of Iran's record will prove that we have been peaceful for centuries...

Define "Iran's record"? Are we looking at a timeline starting with the Iranian coup in the late 70's to present? Or are we looking back further? Depending on which record you are referring to, you are right while at the same time wrong.

shapur
We have not invaded,occupied or intervened any foreign country because there is no reason for any sane country to do such a thing...

So Iran has not intervened in Israel by supporting Hamas / Hezzbullah?
Iran has not intervened in Syria?
Iran has not intervened in Saudi Affairs?
Iran has not intervened in Quatar / UAE / Bahrain / etc affairs?
Iran has not interfered in Iraq during the 2003 invasion?
Iran has not interfered in Afghanistan ?

While I get the argument you are trying to make against the US... Doing so while trying to claim Iran is innocent just undermines your entire argument.

shapur
But can you honestly say the same about the US/UK/Israel?...Well you might say they are the masters of the world and they do as they please,who is Iran or anybody else to tell them how to act or do their stinking business around the world!..

So what's the real issue then? western hegemony or the fact western countries are more able to project influence and power and Iran is just jealous?

I would wager that if the west withdrew from the Middle East in order to bring "stability", that "stability" would be shattered when certain Arab countries try to "wipe Israel off the map".

Maybe if some Arab countries spent less time denouncing the great Satan and more time and energy spent on education and technology they could move beyond the 9th century and join the rest of the world in the 21st century?

You want the US out of the ME... No Problem... I have no desire to live under Islamic rule.. So when the zealots stop preaching that the world will be better when its united under Islam, I will stop supporting an interventionist policy when the national security of the free world is threatened by those zealots.

shapur
And I'll say that the times for that kind of nonsense bullying is over,people all around the world are informed and they mostly know about the real intentions of the western powers in the worlds affairs...If you can not talk with respect and with logic,then I am afraid you are going to loose this popularity contest and have to pay the severe consequences....After all the US needs Iran more than Iran need them.

Out of curiosity do you see just how hypocritical your statement is when Iran has constantly threatened Israel with destruction?

here is some homework -

Lets compare the number of times Iran threatens Israel with the number of time Israel threatens Iran.

The US needs Iran as much as we need the Federated States of Micronesia.. Iran needs to stop claiming its Persian contribution to the world as its own. Persia and Iran are completely separate entities in this area, and that is confirmed by history.

If we need Iran more than they need us, then there would have been no reason for sanctions to be imposed on Iran now would there?

I think you and others often time confuse the greatness of Persia with the lackluster performance of Iran. By trying to claim Persian influence and contributions as its own, Iran does nothing but disrespects the Persian culture and influence on the world.

I long for the day when the Iranian people get a government that represents their will instead of that of the Top Turbans coupled with a perverted spin on a religion which is used to suppress the people.

Just my 2 cents... Ironically enough I can say this and criticize the US government without fear of retribution or execution where as if I were in Iran, I would be publicly executed for simply speaking the truth and voicing an opinion that runs counter to the Iranian government and the Ayatollah.

That might be why in Iran's 35+ years of existence they have never invaded another country. They are to busy killing their own people in order to remain in power. The only ting missing from the Iranian airports is a big metal sign that reads "Arbeit macht frei ".

reply to post by EarthCitizen07

Every one would have been more than pleased if Zionists just wanted to be left alone and agreed to quit fighting,bribing,terrorizing,propaganda spreading,intervening,brainwashing and orchestrating a devilish new world order scenario that involves even their own people's destruction!....And believe me we have been more than patient and tolerant about this during the past decades....We have solid evidence of direct Israeli involvements in a few of our scientists terrors,plus many many other issues involving CIA,MOSSAD and MI6...There are many documented facts and evidences which entitles us to file a very fat law suit against all of these organizations and their supporting governments...Our best lawyers are working on it as we speak with helps from various international fields and communities....It is finally about time people officially know the truth.

The Iranian Foreign minister is set to meet with US negotiators this week at the UN meetings. And there's even word that Obama may meet with Rohani on the sidelines and have an informal chat with him. The negotiations between the Foreign Minister and the US would be the highest level talks between the two since 1979.

Very interesting responses.

I don't see any harm in the US and Iran coming to the table and talking. Especially if it means that the 'attack Iran' war rhetoric goes away because that's the last thing the US needs right now. Bonus if it also leads to a break in the Syrian situation.

Just have to wonder what the political gain from such a change of attitudes.

Here's a comical spin on the situation it also is asking for a signatures for a letter for world leaders to stand for peace: givepeaceadance.org...

Is anyone going to sign?

Another conflict in the Middle East may sound crazy. But for the past year, policy makers in Washington DC and Tel Aviv have been seriously considering military strikes on Iran over their nuclear program.

shapur
reply to post by EarthCitizen07

 

Every one would have been more than pleased if Zionists just wanted to be left alone and agreed to quit fighting,bribing,terrorizing,propaganda spreading,intervening,brainwashing and orchestrating a devilish new world order scenario that involves even their own people's destruction!....And believe me we have been more than patient and tolerant about this during the past decades....We have solid evidence of direct Israeli involvements in a few of our scientists terrors,plus many many other issues involving CIA,MOSSAD and MI6...There are many documented facts and evidences which entitles us to file a very fat law suit against all of these organizations and their supporting governments...Our best lawyers are working on it as we speak with helps from various international fields and communities....It is finally about time people officially know the truth.

Anyone that sides with uk and usa gets dirty in the process. The people who run zionism have been backstabbing the hell out of it now for 50 years and counting. It wasnt really that messed up as they make people think it to be.

Its one thinking blaming governments and another thing blaming jews or muslims.

It annoys me somewhat(maybe a lot) to see so many people polarised either pro or anti israel.

Of course if you push the two state solution as the best way to "solve" this problem, its the best way to guarntee perpetual conflict or at least perpetual bad feelings. The israeli government could have given everyone within the palestinian enclave citizenship and foiled their pathetic whinning attempt to keep hallucinating for a free palestine. Just like europeans conquered the new land and gave natives the choice of a)citizenship b)tribal land.

Israel was attacked during the seven day conflict many years ago. Even this most people forget. Saddam targeted israel as well with scuds during operation desert storm eventhough it was american hardware bombing baghdad.

Israel is the perfect scapegoat for the ptb. I am well aware of the mural van during 9-11 found in brooklyn as well. Mossad agents. Or the jews that didnt show up for work that day. Or the stock market irregularities. Mossad and CIA represent ptb, not their population.