Is History Doomed to Repeat Itself Forever?

There is world wide evidence of a distant past advanced culture. Odds point to humanity being cyclic. We advance our culture to its breaking point and then succumb to the elements. Most of the world is wiped out and then with time knowledge is lost and mankind starts over. The old "ancient" stories such as the bible are remnants of the previous culture passed by word of mouth due to lack of tech. This has happened at least once to us and possibly we have reached human high points hundreds of times every 12-13,000 years or so.

Dinosaurs are probably some kind of genetic manipulation that was done and people very well used them for fighting, entertainment, zoos, or something. Isn't every dinosaur from an egg? Manipulation of reptile and bird eggs wouldn't be too difficult. And if dinosaurs and sea monsters were a man made spectacle they would not be very inclined to survive a catastrophe considering nature is unfriendly to man made ANYTHING.

Anyways, each time mankind would look pretty much the same but the discoveries and events would be different. Basically the same old predictable corrupt rulers, greedy lords, rare saviors, science denying ancient wisdom, and lots of goats and sheep. We're not special, just foolishly imagining ourselves to be so, and by rejecting the teachings of the ancients we're not trying to be the first culture that actually doesn't cancel itself out at the cyclic end point. He who says "I will make a name for myself!" denies the name of his Father and therefor denies his inheritance, eternal life. Though we embrace the one who comes in his own name and reject the one who comes by his father who sent him.

We have been lucky to get this far without a pandemic killing us off. We have done things to increase our chances of a world wide pandemic though. Moving things all over the world and sharing microbes around the globe is happening. Even mosquitoes with Malaria can hitch a ride on an airplane. I think that we are quite foolish, our reliance on technology has increased too much also. Many things can happen that will severely lower global intellect and populations. Disease can cause blood cells to agglutinate and cause strokes which causes lowering of intellect. Everyone could forget what they know. Think about it, if all our scientists were to die, all the latest stuff is on computers. If this information is not adequately transferred to new technology, some of the reasoning and limitations of the results could get flawed. Then we make the mistakes over.

On top of that, mistakes are very seldom recorded or looked at. The same mistakes seem to be made over and over by different groups. History repeats itself, we rarely learn because people think they are smarter than they actually are. With a life of experience in many trades and and my recent research I still struggle to find an easy way to apply my knowledge to many situations. If I had a dozen itsy bitsy strokes, it would cause problems with application of my knowledge for a while. I try to insure that that doesn't happen by utilizing what I know to control it. Disease increases agglutination of blood cells, that is part of how our immune system works. I feel that is why people loose their ability to evaluate things correctly. Think of what would happen in a big pandemic, a lot of people would have lost intellect and collective intellect can go backwards. I have lost my desire to learn to keep up with the changes in computer science myself. I need to concentrate on other things instead of learning new computer technology. Windows 8 convinced me that the technology is going overboard.

Sorry for the off topic parts of my post. S&F for the thread. It is good perception to know that we keep messing up.

reply to post by 33vibe


The simplest direct answer to your title question is: As long as humans are involved, yes. History will continue to repeat itself.

As a species, we seem to remember something just long enough to believe that we've either moved past it, that it never actually occurred, and then POOF! There we are again.

So essentially, we're doomed by our own hand regardless.

Humans do repeat certain bad behaviors however there is no evidence for but great amounts of evidence against cycles of civilizations. It's a very commonly held fringe meme but has no basis in fact.

For civilization (world-wide and our level of technology to be undetectable would require them to be either non-human, 100,000 of thousands years ago or abnormally intent to avoid detection.

So human stupidity will continue, in the matters of politics, religion, etc.

I am just a copy of a copy of a copy
Everything I say has come before
Assembled into something into something into something
I am never certain anymore
I am just a shadow of a shadow of a shadow
Always trying to catch up with myself
I am just an echo of an echo of an echo
Listening to someone's cry for help

- Nine Inch Nails - Copy of A

I think we're doomed to repeat parts of history.. until we firmly learn from our failings

reply to post by 33vibe


"There is no present nor future... Just the past, repeating itself, over and over."

Xcathdra
reply to post by 33vibe

 

"There is no present nor future... Just the past, repeating itself, over and over."

Someone said "the history of man is the history of war". War, rise and fall, war, war, rise and fall war, war, rise and fall, war. Some form or another, some way or another.

reply to post by Logarock


War, yes but all problems arising from competition for resources, pride, politics, religions, etc.

Our evolutionary success has been in part due to that drive to complete AND our ability to override it and co-operate, unfortunately both factors lead to chaos at times.

DP

Yes,

But I would say blessed to repeat cycles.

Blessed because new life is always being created just as its being destroyed.

You say its doomed because your focusing on the destruction of life and the cycles within which is natural.

I say blessed because I focus on the creation of life and the cycles within that also natural state.

reply to post by 33vibe

Odds point to humanity being cyclic

↑


Nailed it. Everything is cyclic in some form or fashion.

Empires rise and fall as the tide, everything comes full circle like the seasons...

Everything is a cycle within a cycle, humanity included.

reply to post by 33vibe

This has happened at least once to us and possibly we have reached human high points hundreds of times every 12-13,000 years or so.

I have sat in enough history classes to understand that history is tricky... the fact that science doesn't agree on who or when the pyramids were built is sufficient evidence for that...!

And then, look at the moon. It's always so close (250,000km) but yet so far away... makes me think that NASA found something up there but they were forbidden to reveal anything about it... because the revelation of what's on the moon would be more mind blowing than one man's small steps on a fuzzy, black & white tv screen.

Another thing to be aware of is the propensity for humanity to deceive itself with regard to it's own natural & scientific history; and to follow courses (political cycles) that systematically obliterates history (religious cycles), reducing it to ruins and then piecing it back together again (spiritual cycles) ... into the shape of a human figure that is impenetrable, indecipherable and inconclusive.

But in the end, it doesn't take a history professor or a doctor of geology to figure this all out, that is another of the "tricks" of history. Who says there is only one approved, orthodox history for humanity? Whomever says that is about to "trick" you.

Hanslune
Humans do repeat certain bad behaviors however there is no evidence for but great amounts of evidence against cycles of civilizations. It's a very commonly held fringe meme but has no basis in fact.

For civilization (world-wide and our level of technology to be undetectable would require them to be either non-human, 100,000 of thousands years ago or abnormally intent to avoid detection.

So human stupidity will continue, in the matters of politics, religion, etc.

Hi Hanslune.

Firstly, you state that there is great amounts of evidence against cycles of civilization.
Next, you indicated a slight bias against what you refer to as a "fringe meme".
Lastly, you offered us three options of how it, cycles, cycles could be a possibility..

I'm afraid I don't follow you. Can you be more specific and set a date for the beginning of civilization?

Hanslune
reply to post by Logarock

 

War, yes but all problems arising from competition for resources, pride, politics, religions, etc.

Our evolutionary success has been in part due to that drive to complete AND our ability to override it and co-operate, unfortunately both factors lead to chaos at times.

Well yea I agree with you. War is just the factors you mention coming to a head.

Hanslune
It's a very commonly held fringe meme but has no basis in fact.

Thank you.

reply to post by aorAki


Howdy Sediments expert haven't seen you around much your expertise is always appreciated!

SayonaraJupiter

Howdy SayonaraJupiter

Firstly, you state that there is great amounts of evidence against cycles of civilization.

Yes specifically against the time frame suggested by the op 12-13,000 years ago

Next, you indicated a slight bias against what you refer to as a "fringe meme".

No not a bias but a reasoned labelling, fringe by my definition are theories which either ignores, creates or deliberate misinterpret evidence. Alternative means all evidence is considered. The idea of a world-wide civilization occuring in the recent pass is a fringe meme for the reason that there is no evidence for it and a great deal against it.

Lastly, you offered us three options of how it, cycles, cycles could be a possibility..

Yes it is possible that a very small civilization could have arisen and been wiped out and remains undetected, ie a city state or small nation, it is also possible - the farther you go back in time for the signs of civ to be missed, there is also a tiny (IMHO) chance of a non-human civ too far back in time.

I'm afraid I don't follow you. Can you be more specific and set a date for the beginning of civilization?

That's a tough one as the classical definition of civilization requires writing (that we can read) so that sets us back to around 3,250 BCE, however other symbols existed from earlier periods but we cannot read them at present. Writing aside I'd suggest a tentative date for the formation of near-civilizations around 9-12,000 BCE in the fertile crescent area but I'm standing by to be corrected by new research at any time!

SayonaraJupiter
reply to post by 33vibe

 

This has happened at least once to us and possibly we have reached human high points hundreds of times every 12-13,000 years or so.

I have sat in enough history classes to understand that history is tricky... the fact that science doesn't agree on who or when the pyramids were built is sufficient evidence for that...!

Actually, science does agree on when and who built the pyramids (4th dynasty, Egypt.) It's everyone else (people who haven't studied Egypt in depth for decades and who haven't done field work there and who can't read inscriptions) who disagree.

History can be tricky because the winners control the documentation, but the winners can't prevent other evidence from coming to light. In either case, there's little evidence for history being cyclic.

Cities, towns, villages, nations, empires -- they're all born and they all die and other civilizations feed off their remains (Roman Empire breaks apart into two empires and one of them dies off, leaving small nations that are formed out of the remains... as an example.) But there's no cycle of "everyone hits the Bronze Age at the exact same time and then goes into a huge collapse at the exact same time and then goes into the Iron Age at the exact same time."

So, while Egypt fell, Rome was rising, the Persians were in disarray, but China was doing well. In North America, the Olmecs were a robust civilization and the Maya were entering a new period.

And then, look at the moon. It's always so close (250,000km) but yet so far away... makes me think that NASA found something up there but they were forbidden to reveal anything about it... because the revelation of what's on the moon would be more mind blowing than one man's small steps on a fuzzy, black & white tv screen.

What they found was "Congress cut the budget for space travel." NASA is not the world. While our space program is falling apart, China's is starting to boom and the European space agency and Russian space agencies are fairly healthy.

Another thing to be aware of is the propensity for humanity to deceive itself with regard to it's own natural & scientific history; and to follow courses (political cycles) that systematically obliterates history (religious cycles), reducing it to ruins and then piecing it back together again (spiritual cycles) ... into the shape of a human figure that is impenetrable, indecipherable and inconclusive.

We are not one civilization but many. While the Dark Ages ran rampant in Europe, the arts and sciences flourished in the Middle East, in China, and elsewhere. We never have to piece it back together... we simply acquire it from those who never lost it.

reply to post by Byrd

History can be tricky because the winners control the documentation, but the winners can't prevent other evidence from coming to light. In either case, there's little evidence for history being cyclic.

Cities, towns, villages, nations, empires -- they're all born and they all die

This just does not make sense to me. No offense.

May I ask you what schools of thought do you follow? I am not familiar with the outright denial of cyclic history... for example the earth moves around the sun once per year. It is a cycle - of history.

And being that, if I kept a diary for 30 days of what I did, then the cycles would be obvious to me.

Richard Nixon had a diary. It was the Secret Service Daily Diary consisting of mostly his appointments, his phone calls, where he was travelling, with who he was travelling, and his leisure time.

You would be surprised at how much leisure time Nixon had during the Apollo program and the height of the Vietnam War... and how he managed to fit in screening over 500+ movies during his presidency is a wonder to behold.

I'll ask you specific question now. What schools of thought do you follow? I need to know.

reply to post by SayonaraJupiter


The cycles the op is talking are the repeated destruction and restarting of civilization, ie macro-cycles that are lost to history, what you seem to be talking about are micro-cycles that are not.

There is world wide evidence of a distant past advanced culture. Odds point to humanity being cyclic. We advance our culture to its breaking point and then succumb to the elements. Most of the world is wiped out and then with time knowledge is lost and mankind starts overt