My Views on Religion

This stems from a reply I made in this thread www.abovetopsecret.com... but someone pointed out that my post might derail that thread (and I agree) and wished to continue the discussion elsewhere. Here is my take:

Originally posted by UnBreakable
People are entitled to their religious beliefs and I don't belittle them, as long as I don't get attacked for my lack thereof. But here is my take:

1) "faith" is a buzzword used by religions which promotes intellectual laziness for people not to search for a rational meaning for things which currently cannot be explained. For instance, the Catholic church excommunicated Galileo for daring to go against their teachings at the time for saying the earth revolved around the sun instead of promoting the church's saying the known planets and sun at the time revolved around earth. It was a few hundred years later for the church to offer an apology and acknowledge Galileo was right.

2) a lot of my religious friends will pray for a cause. If things work out favorably they say "my prayers have been answered. If things don't work out they say God didn't answer their prayers because "it was his will for reasons we don't yet understand". So instead of saying something was just a result of natural fate, it's God picking and choosing which of billions of prayers to answer. In another words two people maybe praying for two different outcomes of the same event. God then answers prayers, I guess, who he favors. I just don't buy it.

I would be happy for anybody to tell me where I'm off-base.


Mods, please move elsewhere if this is not the proper venue.

Makes sense to me. Carry on.

Fairly simple understanding

In fact so simple it beggars belief.

Faith is the most difficult thing to believe and understand, so is God for that matter. Go read any book written by any of the church fathers.
Also, as would most Catholics admit. Catholicism has had its fair share of controversy's, Galileo was just one of them

Prayer is another aspect of faith so, work that out for yourself.

Lazy people dont try to better themselves or others, true Christians try to do both....as is expected, yes they do fail.

reply to post by borntowatch


Faith is shorthand for "I have little to no logical basis for believing in this idea, but I have plenty of reasons for wanting to. And you know what? I don't see you coming up with anything better."

Literally, that is the full and unedited version of the word we call 'faith'. Or that's what it would be, if there were such a version.

reply to post by UnBreakable


It takes as much faith to deny a god or deity, as it does to embrace one. There is no real difference because as a species, we just don't have all the answers. Even in science, we have to have faith in the method to trust the outcome.

Is God real?
Are you real?

I think I am, therefore I am, I think.

We don't know as much as we like to 'think' we do

Faith is as much a made-up construct as the "get out of jail free" card in Monopoly, it can just be played on a few more boards.

Another thing I don't understand............ I know someone who is a devout Baptist. This person is one of the most hypocritical people I know. They go to church for an hour once a week, but for the rest of the time they are one of the most nastiest people..........rude to others, talking behind peoples backs dpreading unsubstantited gossip, etc. I once questioned them about this.........how do they reconcile their boorish behavior while claiming to be a devout Chritian. They told me no matter what they do, at the end of the day they just ask for the Lord's forgiveness and they are saved and will be raptured and go straight to heaven. My take people use religion to do whatever they want but as long as they believe and attend service they feel they can do no wrong. Complete hypocritical rubbish.

For me, faith is accepting that you don't know the answer, but trusting that you have the right idea. It's as simple as that.

Prayer is a personal thing. The outcome is less important than the act of prayer. One quote that's always spoken to me about this subject is "Live like you're going to live forever, but pray like you're going to die today." Acknowledging that you're not in complete control of your life and destiny is a great step to humility. As for whose prayers God answers, that's less important than whose prayers he doesn't answer. I thank God frequently for the little fortunate circumstances I'm given. But I find myself questioning the unfortunate ones a lot more. I don't use prayer as a means of gaining favor from God, but as a way of coherently translating my emotions into thought and finding balance.

reply to post by UnBreakable

Another thing I don't understand............ I know someone who is a devout Baptist. This person is one of the most hypocritical people I know. They go to church for an hour once a week, but for the rest of the time they are one of the most nastiest people..........rude to others, talking behind peoples backs dpreading unsubstantited gossip, etc. I once questioned them about this.........how do they reconcile their boorish behavior while claiming to be a devout Chritian. They told me no matter what they do, at the end of the day they just ask for the Lord's forgiveness and they are saved and will be raptured and go straight to heaven. My take people use religion to do whatever they want but as long as they believe and attend service they feel they can do no wrong. Complete hypocritical rubbish.

Humans are the hypocritical animal. It's fairly obvious that everyone is a hypocrite. For instance you are talking behind your baptist friend's back.

Originally posted by NiNjABackflip
reply to post by UnBreakable

 

Another thing I don't understand............ I know someone who is a devout Baptist. This person is one of the most hypocritical people I know. They go to church for an hour once a week, but for the rest of the time they are one of the most nastiest people..........rude to others, talking behind peoples backs dpreading unsubstantited gossip, etc. I once questioned them about this.........how do they reconcile their boorish behavior while claiming to be a devout Chritian. They told me no matter what they do, at the end of the day they just ask for the Lord's forgiveness and they are saved and will be raptured and go straight to heaven. My take people use religion to do whatever they want but as long as they believe and attend service they feel they can do no wrong. Complete hypocritical rubbish.

Humans are the hypocritical animal. It's fairly obvious that everyone is a hypocrite. For instance you are talking behind your baptist friend's back.

That's just my point. I know I'm a hypocrite, but I don't pretend I'm holier than thou for an hour a week and hide behind religious dogma.

reply to post by UnBreakable


Very true. Honesty is the best policy.

It seems that even self-honesty is lacking in some of these people, with faith in general, as you've pointed out.

reply to post by redoubt

It takes as much faith to deny a god or deity, as it does to embrace one.

I never understood this sentiment, as it could be said about anything. It takes as much faith to deny a unicorn, leprechaun, angel, demon, as it does to embrace one.

reply to post by UnBreakable

That's just my point. I know I'm a hypocrite, but I don't pretend I'm holier than thou for an hour a week and hide behind religious dogma.

You've just revealed more of an understanding of human nature than anything I've found in the religious forum. Humans - we are what are, no more and no less.

Just a quote...."Faith, beleiving what you know, aint so" Mark Twain.

Originally posted by UnBreakable
This stems from a reply I made in this thread www.abovetopsecret.com... but someone pointed out that my post might derail that thread (and I agree) and wished to continue the discussion elsewhere. Here is my take:

Originally posted by UnBreakable
People are entitled to their religious beliefs and I don't belittle them, as long as I don't get attacked for my lack thereof. But here is my take:

1) "faith" is a buzzword used by religions which promotes intellectual laziness for people not to search for a rational meaning for things which currently cannot be explained. For instance, the Catholic church excommunicated Galileo for daring to go against their teachings at the time for saying the earth revolved around the sun instead of promoting the church's saying the known planets and sun at the time revolved around earth. It was a few hundred years later for the church to offer an apology and acknowledge Galileo was right.

2) a lot of my religious friends will pray for a cause. If things work out favorably they say "my prayers have been answered. If things don't work out they say God didn't answer their prayers because "it was his will for reasons we don't yet understand". So instead of saying something was just a result of natural fate, it's God picking and choosing which of billions of prayers to answer. In another words two people maybe praying for two different outcomes of the same event. God then answers prayers, I guess, who he favors. I just don't buy it.

I would be happy for anybody to tell me where I'm off-base.

edit on 10-8-2013 by UnBreakable because: (no reason given)

Mods, please move elsewhere if this is not the proper venue.

edit on 10-8-2013 by UnBreakable because: added mods

..kind post UB

but there is a Failure in your posing the question itself

see, "belief" is automatically assimilated with "religion"
...and then the thoughts go , automatically, to hypocrites....sectes.....small minded ideas....etc
yes, which are useless btw

but "belief" is YOUR own Consciousness - at Present
you beliéve already !

and, deducted from your post, you Believe lock stock barrel in this [fake] Hologram matrix
- since you mentioned Galileo that way

..you see, how the "belief in this holographic reality of [mind] Reason" IS "the belief" you chose ?

- that Belief is certainly not "Valid", by opposing Laughable sectes or smallminded religions against it?

that is Thé False opposition
Mindtrick

...put on you, by that same Awareness, who rúles this present holograph matrix

hope i made sense,

..this is such an incredible Stubborn Mindtrick , to most of us

- we have been placed under a Spell [ the so-called Reasonable Scientific Vieuw we cherish" ]
and then look back,
and feel ourselves most "Evolved" and "Developed"
pointing to the many abberations, the many religions [ and their followers ] cherish

..yet we álso Judge the Other Dimensions like that -
not because we knów them [ because we would shut up in deep silence ]
but like a little Child proudly and ignorantly Rejects the other Lollypop "since it aint pink coloured"

so
i have the Deepest respect for Gods Dimension
...and try , with all i have, to understánd just Hów Spelled "our so called reality" is....

regards,

reply to post by UnBreakable


I believe your definition of faith is considerably off. Faith is not a necessarily a religious word. Faith is "belief without proof". Keep in mind you BELIEVE that there is no God, but you have no PROOF that there is no God. Therefore you have faith that there is no God.

Also, you mention you don't belittle religions.... however you describe faith as a buzzword and imply it promotes laziness, both negative words. I hope this arrogance comes from being "belittled" by the very religious over your lifetime. I suggest whenever the extremely religious (assuming Christian) challenge your atheism, you should remind them that they have the same amount of PROOF that you do, zero.

If they say there are billions of Christians in the world that can back them up....remind them there are billions of people who believe something very different then they do. en.wikipedia.org...

Having a bit of humility, on both sides of the argument, will go a long way in OUR search for truth.

BTW - I'm an agnostic theist.

Originally posted by UnBreakable[/i

1) "faith" is a buzzword used by religions which promotes intellectual laziness for people not to search for a rational meaning for things which currently cannot be explained. .

Is there a rational reason why this is? All the while you seek a 'rational reason' - This IS - life is. All the suffering that individuals have is caused by all the problem solving - believing that life is a problem that has to be solved - what exactly is the problem with life?
Life is alive - how did that happen? No one knows but it seems that one is driven to find out and then make up stories about how, why and when.
The questions arise and there is no real answer except for assumptions, guesses and these assumptions are then argued about.
Life is the great mystery but the mind will not tolerate that - it wants to know. What is there to know? Only what is arising presently can be known - but what it is no one can ever know.

2) a lot of my religious friends will pray for a cause. If things work out favorably they say "my prayers have been answered. If things don't work out they say God didn't answer their prayers because "it was his will for reasons we don't yet understand". So instead of saying something was just a result of natural fate, it's God picking and choosing which of billions of prayers to answer. In another words two people maybe praying for two different outcomes of the same event. God then answers prayers, I guess, who he favors. I just don't buy it.

If people are asking for something when they pray then they do not actually know God at all.
Thank you is all that can be said in real prayer or just listen.