GAO To Launch Nationwide Investigation into Planned Parenthood

reply to post by ButterCookie


Whatever! Planned Parenthood uses tax payer fund to pay for health screenings. The only abortions that PP assists with the costs of are abortions that are the result of incest and rape.

You can keep your insulting implications that the woman claiming rape or incest are lying about their ordeal to get free abortions to yourself.

Originally posted by seagull
reply to post by neo96

 

Funny how some forget that...

Margaret Sanger/Malthusian Eugenics...

Not exactly a glorious past, and it generally get glossed over...

She was not exactly in the business of providing birth control out of a genuine concern for the welfare of others...now was she?

It's kind of like the NRA, isn't it? Most gun lovers support the NRA, even though we all know that the NRA's real goal is simply to get more money. The gun lovers say it doesn't matter what the NRA's motivations are - the end results of their efforts are good.

Originally posted by kaylaluv

Originally posted by seagull
reply to post by neo96

 

Funny how some forget that...

Margaret Sanger/Malthusian Eugenics...

Not exactly a glorious past, and it generally get glossed over...

She was not exactly in the business of providing birth control out of a genuine concern for the welfare of others...now was she?

It's kind of like the NRA, isn't it? Most gun lovers support the NRA, even though we all know that the NRA's real goal is simply to get more money. The gun lovers say it doesn't matter what the NRA's motivations are - the end results of their efforts are good.

Getting more money for a cause equates with eugenics?
How so?
The NRA actually spends money. They maintain a museum and a ranch out in New Mexico. They fund and operate firearms safety programs.
Sanger wanted to weed out undesirables, and we know who they were.

Originally posted by butcherguy
I take it from your statements here that you believe the government should be involved in a woman's reproductive rights?
I am saying they shouldn't, including paying for it.

I fail to see how handing out contraception to people whom cannot afford it if they want is involvement in a reproductive right. If they were forcing the contraception, or banning them, then that would be involvement.

If you go to a supermarket and they are handing out free samples, the brand is not involving itself in your diet...you are if you decide to pick it up. They are simply facilitating the option.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

Originally posted by butcherguy
I take it from your statements here that you believe the government should be involved in a woman's reproductive rights?
I am saying they shouldn't, including paying for it.

I fail to see how handing out contraception to people whom cannot afford it if they want is involvement in a reproductive right. If they were forcing the contraception, or banning them, then that would be involvement.

If you go to a supermarket and they are handing out free samples, the brand is not involving itself in your diet...you are if you decide to pick it up. They are simply facilitating the option.

Not quite the same, is it?
A manufacturer giving out samples in a supermarket isn't paying for it with taxpayer dollars. You choose if you want to buy that brand and support their policies of giving free samples.

The IRS doesn't give me a choice of whether or not I have to pay my taxes.

Its about damn time!

How this organization has avoided getting smacked until now I will never know.

Errr, scratch that, I know exactly how. Money, money and political contributions ie: MO MONEY.

We dont need organizations like this in our society. I hope they get torn apart. Sadly the only thing that will happen is they will make a payment to somebody, AKA get fined.

Condoms are much cheaper than abortions. And they cause less mental stress. And you don't have to kill anyone.

reply to post by butcherguy


Women of all walks of life, even white, rich and religious women, are willingly lining up for abortions. Women of means are getting them because they can. Poor women are getting them from clinics that offer affordable prices, based on grants and private donations, because they are able to.

This issue isn't about eugenics. It's about choice. "Undesirable" is NOT defined by anyone other than the woman seeking termination of her pregnancy.

reply to post by windword

This issue isn't about eugenics.

It was from Sanger's angle.

Originally posted by butcherguyNot quite the same, is it?
A manufacturer giving out samples in a supermarket isn't paying for it with taxpayer dollars. You choose if you want to buy that brand and support their policies of giving free samples.

The IRS doesn't give me a choice of whether or not I have to pay my taxes.

You appear to be getting lost in the example and missing the point. I was showing how something offered is not something pushed.

As far as the taxes not going for what you want. Well, welcome to the republic. I don't want my taxes going to subsidies for big oil...but it happens anyhow. Something that you may consider looking into

The federal government subsidizes all sorts of things through the tax code. For instance, you may take a tax deduction for interest on your home mortgage. That's a subsidy for homeowners. Similarly, there are many such tax subsidies that benefit corporations. And a few of those benefit oil companies in particular. All told, tax subsidies for corporations cost the Treasury around $180 billion in fiscal 2011

So cool story. Your uber worried about the 10 cent contribution to helping out your neighbor, but no doubt you think its awesome to give up a couple hundred bucks to the poor corporations.

Planned Parenthood reported receiving a record $542 million in taxpayer support in fiscal 2012

do the math, then find the appropriate amount of rage to show for the issue.

reply to post by butcherguy

Margaret Higgins Sanger (September 14, 1879 – September 6, 1966) was an American birth control activist, sex educator, and nurse. Sanger popularized the term birth control, opened the first birth control clinic in the United States, and established organizations that evolved into the Planned Parenthood Federation of America. Sanger's efforts contributed to several judicial cases that helped legalize contraception in the United States.

Ask any woman if she'd prefer to go back to a society where contraception is illegal.

Originally posted by SaturnFX

The whole no such thing false LvR line is absolute nonsense.

I never said there was no such thing, you made that up. I was saying is you were just pushing that idea instead of looking at the actual issue. As a matter of fact that is really all you do, you ignore everything and then just push this left and right crap.

There are very different ideological differences. The politicians that represent the different ideological differences may be flawed, but to suggest that there is no differences and its just pretend division tactics is a sign of someone whom simply refuses to research the actual points.

See all that above? Pure BS rambling. Im refusing to research the actual points? No, im just not getting led off topic by your political BS. You really are a one trick pony.

Are you suggesting then that politicians are showing no difference, or the actual ideals are not different?

No... do you read what you are responding to or do you do you just wake up with nonsensical crap to say?

And anyone whom calls someone a sheep is typically themselves full of wool. shortcut to having to think about an issue..just dismiss everyone whom already did the groundwork.

Says the guy that has to make up crap to argue with... If you idea of "groundwork" is just shouting out the same tired arguments with no regard to their relevance, then i will be happy to say i have done none.

And no, it doesn't surprise me that the discussion about the bigger entities with real corruption having more merit for investigation went over your head and how the attack on a smaller focused ideologically pivotal organization is related to the topic.

You are welcome to start a thread about whatever you want. This one was about planned parenthood and fraud, just showing up and bitching about big oil and the evil right does not make you smarter, it make you look like a tool with nothing to do but push the same old tired political "debates".

reply to post by windword


I never once said that women are lying about rape or incest to get a free abortion. I said that Planned Parenthood is not screening for this information.

reply to post by Superhans


Lets condense:
As far as the topic at hand, there may indeed be valid fraud going on here worthy of a discussion. What my view on it is simple. PP and other such organizations targeted by the right is overrepresented both in congress partisans and then filters through to the tools (such as fox news and the many internet neocon corporate pieces) meanwhile, much bigger fish to fry are protected (jerb protectors should never get an eye). I am not saying there isn't corruption here..I am saying that the very same people flipping out about this tiny fish are either ignoring or supporting the whale of corruption. Their outrage is disingenuous at best and fully agenda driven.

If the argument is about corruption, then great, normally you start with the biggest offenders. This is not however a true discussion about corruption..its a discussion about how to further social conservatism under the guise of corruption.

Personally, I support the investigation into PP...and every other organization, and especially any subsidies receiving corporation or entity. Rarely though do you see people take a universal stance on investigation. Its usually agenda driven, and that is what I am pointing out here.

You go on about this LvR distraction or whatever, then weigh in on a clearly partisan movement designed with no consistency outside of beating on a rather harmless lightweight organization that is being targeted for its perceived "side".

Originally posted by windword
reply to post by butcherguy

 

Margaret Higgins Sanger (September 14, 1879 – September 6, 1966) was an American birth control activist, sex educator, and nurse. Sanger popularized the term birth control, opened the first birth control clinic in the United States, and established organizations that evolved into the Planned Parenthood Federation of America. Sanger's efforts contributed to several judicial cases that helped legalize contraception in the United States.

Ask any woman if she'd prefer to go back to a society where contraception is illegal.

Lame.
I have repeated many times now that I am not opposed to contraception. Sooner or later, you will absorb that, I'm sure.
You forgot the part about her promoting eugenics.
Oh, that's right, selectively killing a race off is okay if you get free birth control... Right?

Originally posted by ButterCookie
reply to post by windword

 

I never once said that women are lying about rape or incest to get a free abortion. I said that Planned Parenthood is not screening for this information.

The point about not screening is the key.

Perhaps that's how they get around the Hyde Amendment issues.

It looks like they use the old "silence is golden" trick to end run the legal issues.

That could be why the investigations are focusing on 'accounting'.

reply to post by SaturnFX

If the argument is about corruption, then great, normally you start with the biggest offenders. This is not however a true discussion about corruption..its a discussion about how to further social conservatism under the guise of corruption.

I will give you points for at least trying to talk about the threads topic before going off again. But it really should not matter who is cleaning it up or why, if there is no corruption and it gets fixed then why would it matter who or why? This just goes hand in hand with the idea that you are so easily distracted by the left and right crap that you would not want positive change just because of the people involved.

Personally, I support the investigation into PP...and every other organization, and especially any subsidies receiving corporation or entity. Rarely though do you see people take a universal stance on investigation. Its usually agenda driven, and that is what I am pointing out here.

lol hypocrisy? You are pretty much doing EXACTLY what you describe here, throughout this thread you have dismissed the looking into of PPH and instead say we should look into the organizations of the side you are against. Man, you are a class act.

You go on about this LvR distraction or whatever, then weigh in on a clearly partisan movement designed with no consistency outside of beating on a rather harmless lightweight organization that is being targeted for its perceived "side".

Just because i weigh in does not mean on any particular side. I want people to look into big oil too but i would rather be shot than have people think im on the same side as someone like you.

reply to post by xuenchen


Oh of course.

That's what I was trying to explain earlier. They are not asking for a copy of the police report of a rape nor are they asking you to list the relative you are impregnated by.

They recieve funding for abortions.

No, 100% of the cost is not absorbed...yet (Obamacare).

But they are getting a portion of the fee funded by the taxpayers.

Originally posted by Superhans
i would rather be shot than have people think im on the same side as someone like you.

Actually, we aren't in disagreement. I am simply saying this is small potatoes compared to the overall problem.
We are TOTALLY on the same side here.
I am just adding to it saying lets focus not on just the partisan little fish and hit all subsidies for investigation.

Surely you agree here.

I won't hold you to your wish..but if you feel it necessary, I recommend the foot.

reply to post by ButterCookie


How do you propose that Planned Parenthood "screen" for "legitimate" rape and incest?