Out-of-print UFO books and obtaining copyright permission to share?

Yes this is a great idea. However it could well be a complex and time consuming one.

There is also the same question to be asked of the many defunct magazines issued on the subject down the decades which I think we have discussed on another thread.

There are a number of good resources available online, and Isaac has highlighted these in other threads.

There are many other UFO publications that have died a death and possibly only exist in private collections these days. Google have a number of other magazine archives but as far as I know there are no UFO specific ones there.

reply to post by IsaacKoi

Im sure not trying to derail your efforts. I'd like to see you pull this off...its a really great idea.

From the other side of the coin...and I have to be careful not to imply anything illegal here, especially since I am a copyright owner myself (and both sides of the coin in this case are HEADS-both positive in favor-of themselves)....you might just try and go ahead and put up a few of the oldest ones. You may or may not get any flack from the owners.

Im surmising you prob wont get any, because they just aren't there, or wont know. The recourse for you if they do come out of the woodwork...is for them to 1st give you a "cease-and-desist-remove-this-immediately-or-else" notification. And that's the absolute worst thing that will happen. Lawsuits are the last recourse, and the violator will always be requested to remove it 1st. I don't see you having any real lasting issues.

My band had 11 hit-Top 10 records world-wide in the 1960's, and each day there is someone, somewhere releasing them on blogs, websites and share sites without our permission, the copyrights in renewal-effect. Youtube and the like, I try to shut down, and have a good relationship with them in removals, which they do immediately. Most of them around the world, I don't catch, don't bother or don't care.....violation or not. It can be really expensive to legally chase them down. Not to say we don't.

In closing, realize this. As long as you are not SELLING...legally you should be ok. Again, the worst case scenario would be to hear from owners telling you to remove them And on the contrary, they could just say "Fine!" You most likely... since they are out of print...wont ever hear anything from any-one of them.

Good luck with this. You can always U2U me and we can speak in private, MS

reply to post by mysterioustranger


What's your band? I understand if you don't want to say on these boards, but if you wouldn't mind telling one person you could U2U me.

Just curious, I was a big fan of many bands back in the '60s.

Originally posted by SummerLightning
Copyright (in the UK at least) is almost invariably held by the author or his/heir estate, and that applies to books from the 1940s and 50s just as it does to contemporary titles. Generally, original publication will have been covered by a contract which gave the publisher total rights or, more usually, first British rights (ie those covering the first publication in Britain), first British and Commonwealth. first world etc. Rights revert to the author once those first editions go out of print. I think most other countries are likely to have had similar arrangements - a possible exception being the USA, which did not ratify the Berne Convention on Copyright until 1989.

Many thanks for that summary of the general situation, at least here in Britain.

Anyone in the USA able to comment on whether that summarises the general practical situation in the USA as well?

In our own case, the publisher happily reverted rights to my wife in relation to two novels published in 2001 and 2002. It required no arm-twisting or complications at all.

Interesting. VERY interesting.

I hadn't expected publishers to be so ready to revert rights in relation to such recent publications (and feared that they may generally have been reluctant to give up any rights they had even in relation to much older books).

I had been toying with the idea of contacting a few authors (or, at least at first, the family of a long deceased author) to ask their permission and then contacting myself the publisher. Your post has made me think about it a bit differently. I'd now still contact the author (or his family) and, if they are interested in seeing an old book put online, give THEM a draft letter for THEM to send to their publisher seeking to clarify the position or have rights reverted to THEM.

Thinking about the matter in the light of your post, I'd expect the author (or his family) to be more likely to get a constructive answer than some third party.

Mmm. So what would the draft letter look like?? Something like the rough draft below??

FIRST DRAFT OF POTENTIAL LETTER TO PUBLISHERS FROM AUTHORS OR THEIR FAMILIES

Back in (insert year), your company kindly published my book about Unidentified Flying Objects, (insert book title).

My book has not been republished since then. Presumably my book will not be republished commercially in the future.

However, that book examined issues regarding UFOs which continue to be discussed online. I think that making my book available online would make a contribution to that debate and possibly help reduce the amount of nonsense that appears on the Internet in relation to UFO sightings.

I'm not sure whether your company continues to have any rights in relation to my book. Rather than spending time (and possibly money) looking into the legal position, I thought I'd simply ask if your company would agree that any rights in relation to my book now revert to me so that I can self-publish my book (probably online, free of charge).

Your assistance with this matter would be appreciated.

Incidentally, I remain an active author in this field. If your company has any interest in publishing further books about UFOs, I would be happy to submit a relevant book proposal.

Any comments (particularly from you SummerLightning since you've been through this process already)?

All the best,

Isaac

Originally posted by mysterioustranger
reply to post by IsaacKoi

 

I have to be careful not to imply anything illegal here, especially since I am a copyright owner myself (and both sides of the coin in this case are HEADS-both positive in favor-of themselves)....you might just try and go ahead and put up a few of the oldest ones. You may or may not get any flack from the owners.

Thanks MS. Let's see how far I can get with express permissions in advance.

I think a few websites already do make books available on the basis that you suggest, but then many researchers do not link to those websites (presumably at least in part because of a fear of condoning a breach of copyright).

Originally posted by Wonderer77
I've found one of the best ways to begin building a database of this sort is to try a Google search - "ufo books public domain." This returned several million hits and the first several had a variety of books and other UFO-related materials available as free PDFs or e-books, all either in the public domain or free of copyright.

It seems to me that some websites simply say that books are in the public domain as an excuse for putting them online without any permission from the copyright holder. Insufficient time has passed for many of those books to legally be in the public domain.

Only a very small number of UFO books actually seem to legally be in the public domain. It would probably be worth making a list of them, but it would probably only be a handful of books.

There are probably many more UFO books where there is no-one that cares whether it is treated AS IF it is legally in the public domain.

reply to post by wtbengineer

I assure you, you will know us right away then. I guard that as much as possible for obvious reasons. I will say that when you google just my own professional name, the entire 1st page of "hits" will be me. Search my group, and the 1st 15 or so pages will be mostly about and regarding us. So let me explain.

If I wanted to have everyone be in awe of us and myself, I would've just made it more public and sat back in the accolades. But, its not want I want or need any longer. And critics and people these days pass judgment way too quickly...and at ATS...so I just keep it where it is.

To be in Billboard Magazines Top 100 Rock and Roll groups of all time is enough for me. Im getting so it doesn't matter much any longer...so let me ponder this a few days, and I most likely will drop you the requested info U2U.

I have a bio at the publishers in London , and 2 screenplays for it in LA...so I do have to consider current confidentiality as Im sure you can appreciate.

reply to post by IsaacKoi

The bottom line is...if you do copy and make them available on-line without seeking any profit from them, or membership "fees" to say a site to access them...you should be ok.

The only real issue is failing to give the owners the "opportunity" to decide for themselves-about their works...and what to do with them.

Some US Presidential campaigns...and recently too...have used some rock tunes as their theme songs...without getting permission, only to find those groups saying "Hey! We don't support you. We don't agree with your platforms, you didnt pay us...and you didn't get our permission to use it so stop immediately or we'll sue you!"

As just an analogy here, its just the common courtesy of at least asking the owners if they cared or not...Good luck....
MS

reply to post by mysterioustranger


Understood, pretty much what I figured anyway.

All I find when I google mysterioustranger is reference to Twain...

reply to post by wtbengineer

Its just a screen name. I'd rather be known and regarded for my thoughts, feelings, experience and opinions. Nothing else. Im considering your request. Perhaps later this week? Thank you for trying to understand.

That small level of respect for my privacy goes a long way.

reply to post by mysterioustranger

Of course I understand your desire to anonymously interact with others here and know that it is not biased by anyone's perceptions of you based on what you've done or anything like that. That's cool, and I'm just curious. I am a musician and songwriter as well and I also have music copywrited, though that was back in the early '80s. Now I just play with some of the old guys as a hobby.

I have a little interconnection with one big name act, some radio play, but no "hits" under my belt. But all that was a long time ago and I live a completely different life now. My point is I'm not going to look at your posts any differently just because I know your name. I just would like to know, but if you don't want to tell me I understand.

I admit my opinion is not the normal one here. If something is still copyrighted but nobody is re-publishing it and it is hard to find then I feel it is a persons duty to copy it themselves and spread it around. Frankly once an author has died or his/her materials hit the web it should be free reign. I just don't see what the whole stigma is with copyrights of books that are 50-60 years old.

How else are you going to affordably get certain things if they are rare and no longer published but won't be released into the public domain?

Originally posted by johnthejedi24
Frankly once an author has died or his/her materials hit the web it should be free reign. I just don't see what the whole stigma is with copyrights of books that are 50-60 years old.

I suppose that happens so the family of the author can still get money from the author's work.

Charles Chaplin had to remake his first movies because, at the time, the copyright expired some (I don't remember how many) years after being published, so he was still alive (and still making movies) when that happened to the first things he made.

And, regardless of our opinions, if that's the law then it should be followed, as being accused of "pirating" other people's work is not the best way of spreading knowledge.