Curiosity/MSL: A Stone Ring (?) And Some More Observations at "Shaler"

Some new MastCam100 images were uploaded to the sol 309 archive last night and I thought one of those might be worth taking a closer look at.

Whether it's 'just' an interesting geological formation or something more intriguing, I think the various shapes in the image below do stand out a bit when compared to their surroundings:

Original NASA/JPL image


No shiny white 'sand dollars' this time, but the dust-covered circular formation at the bottom (center) as well as the segment-like arrangement next to it (bottom left) did attract my attention. Might be ventifacts (scroll down for examples from Earth), might be something else ... perhaps we'll get some MAHLI shots of that area later on, but I'm not sure NASA/JPL are going to do us that favor!


Also, there's an interesting circular depression at the bottom of this image:


... which does remind me a bit of the 'bowl' imaged by MSL on sol 122:


As usual, impaired already assembled the complete panorama for sol 309 containing all of the above features (~ at the bottom left section). Again a big thanks for that!

Just thought the above features might be worth posting ...

Great find! Looks like one of the "popped bubbles" Curiosity found in these ancient riverbeds. themeridianijournal.com...

There seems to be the remains of more.....or is it just my eyes?

Mmmm sorry about crap red arrows.

Originally posted by CaptainBeno

 

There seems to be the remains of more.....or is it just my eyes?

Maybe there is, IDK. I think they might be additional distinct shapes or forms that - over time - have been filled in or got covered with gravel, grain/sand. But it's still difficult to really discern them and argue whether it's just a part of the rock layer from the outcrop or something else.

In any case, I thought it might be useful to look at the slightly zoomed version of the more prominent feature in the OP:



Note the clearly visible top rim and the shadows/openings. Are those the remains of a ventifact? An inclusion of some sort (in geological terms) - that broke up?

We would probably only be able to say something conclusive about it via MAHLI close-ups and a ChemCam analysis ... unless, of course, we're dealing with something that's absolutely common for geologists!?

It sort of looks like remnants of ancient lifeforms. It appears that there may have been life on Mars a long time ago. I wonder if that is the fossilized remains of some sort of water microbes or other structured water plant/aquatic life. The probability of there having been some sort of life on another planets of our solar system is actually pretty good. In the billions of years of history things could have come and gone on other planets. I don't think that it is critical to spend a lot of resources to prove this though, although it is nice to have a little evidence to show it is possible. There could be lifeforms that can live in environments that we once thought were impossible to live in. I think science is finally starting to recognize this fact.

Someone ate some BBQ ribs and tossed out the bones four million years ago.

That 2 interesting pictures in a week. Are they warming us up slowly for the big one!!..Mars disclosure round the corner?.. One of the pics does look a bit like a vertebrae type structure. The circular formation looks similar to the one posted last week as well. Thanks for posting these

This sure looks strange to me. I have to agree this looks like fossilised remains to me.

reply to post by jeep3r


You can call it fossilized VERTEBRAE.
And of a big creature...
S&F.

Mmmm, very interesting....almost like a crown or bracelet of some sort....
I'm trying to see if that object has any smooth surfaces, but as of it I see none.
Great find OP

Originally posted by Arken
reply to post by jeep3r

 

You can call it fossilized VERTEBRAE.
And of a big creature...

S&F.

... I take your word for it!

By the way: in the last weeks the usual 'it's just rocks crowd' has been suspiciously quiet. Either they've all been banned or they finally gave up, me thinks ...

Originally posted by jeep3r

Originally posted by Arken
reply to post by jeep3r

 

You can call it fossilized VERTEBRAE.
And of a big creature...

S&F.

... I take your word for it!

By the way: in the last weeks the usual 'it's just rocks crowd' has been suspiciously quiet. Either they've all been banned or they finally gave up, me thinks ...

You left out a third possibility:

They're just tired of telling everyone that their rocks......

Originally posted by Arnie123

 

Mmmm, very interesting....almost like a crown or bracelet of some sort....
I'm trying to see if that object has any smooth surfaces, but as of it I see none.
Great find OP

Thanks, Arnie ... !

As for smooth surfaces: I don't think we would see a lot of those. Wind, grains, mud and erosional FX would have left traces of some sort. From a geological point of view, it would even be a miracle to actually see something like that directly at the surface. Normally, they'd have to 'dig' for anything like that to show up, even on Earth ...

In case they don't look into this more in detail though (including some of the other stuff we found earlier), it's either nothing special - which I doubt - or they deliberately choose to not provide any further analysis, as they did in the case of the 'Hugo' feature ... ...

Let's not forget, they (NASA/JPL) just addressed the above image back then due to the media hype, while quickly throwing a PDF at us declaring it's a ventifact (--> killer-argument). There was no further analysis and it basically ended all discussions ... I could imagine something similar happening in future as well, but let's wait and keep our fingers crossed!

Originally posted by eriktheawful

 

You left out a third possibility:

They're just tired of telling everyone that their rocks......

Good pointer! But remember: they were really relentless and had lots of energy to type those 3 words into a post, again & again ... it's really difficult to imagine they're now tired of doing that!

Hey jeeper,

Interesting thread with some intriguing pics. One of my favorite theories to explain what you have pointed-out is probably that of a technologically advanced civilization that was largely destroyed by a cataclysm. The strange debris and artifacts we see of the surface of Mars - according to the theory - are smashed or otherwise de-constructed pieces of technology or mechanization caused by (a) an initial cataclysm that included heat, possible ejection (as in following a meteorite/asteroid strike, or volcanic), then (b) flooding (which ties-in with the possibility of sub-surface ice being melted due to sudden heating - due to aforementioned 'strike'), (c) coating of debris in mud and other debris, then (d) a very slow and long-term natural destruction of the composition of the technologies thus destroyed to the point that they are often unrecognizable and in pieces. Often the artifact is completely lost to natural decay (similar to how iron rusting will destroy the iron piece) and visible identification.

There is however a vital and probably simpler theory that may (it is a big 'may') explain some of the items we look at and ask questions. For instance, the effect of heat upon soil can cause remarkable transformative changes.

Some Earth-based examples can be found at: geo-sites.zoomshare.com...


Maybe of like-size to the circlet you have shown us, but possible less weathered...

Can this explain the small round hole we see of the surface of Mars? Not saying it is Trinitite, but maybe heat is the culprit...

Whatever theory you subscribe to I'm not worried about. I like the first (that of what I call Technological Naturacide, where nature has destroyed a technological culture), but always suspect the latter.

reply to post by jeep3r


Lol you know what. I was thinking the exact same. Awaits rock brigade!!!!!!!!.....Agree with an above poster to. Remains of what was destroyed

Originally posted by jeep3r

Originally posted by eriktheawful

 

You left out a third possibility:

They're just tired of telling everyone that their rocks......

Good pointer! But remember: they were really relentless and had lots of energy to type those 3 words into a post, again & again ... it's really difficult to imagine they're now tired of doing that!

Might have been their day off?

I will say it is very interesting to look at! And it does remind me of something.

Ever seen something like molten metal or glass that has been dropped into a medium, like water or sand? Allowed to cool and then remove the medium, you get some very interesting shapes.

Originally posted by eriktheawful

 

I will say it is very interesting to look at! And it does remind me of something.

Ever seen something like molten metal or glass that has been dropped into a medium, like water or sand? Allowed to cool and then remove the medium, you get some very interesting shapes.

Sounds like watercasting ... and it surely does look interesting:



That's a nice contribution to the list of possible natural causes for some of the things we see. I'm not sure whether it applies to the features in the OP (I actually doubt it), but it's always good to keep an open mind regarding alternative explanations ... thanks for your thoughts on this!

Originally posted by Blister

 

Can this explain the small round hole we see of the surface of Mars? Not saying it is Trinitite, but maybe heat is the culprit...

Thanks for your extensive reply, Blister ... and good to see you around again!

What you researched and stated above could indeed be a legit explanation for this image from sol 309 (see hole at bottom, center) which is the first external image link in the OP. I could imagine the bowl-like feature also being the result of the same geological process ...

The first two elements in the OP (circlet, segment-like arrangement), however, probably require a different explanation. But your theory on how erosional effects could have come about to shape the landscape that we see does sound very interesting, to say the least!

I'll certainly spend some more time on that, because it might shed some light on my earlier observations as well ... I'll definitely get back to you with a more detailed opinion later on (either in this thread, via U2U or in one of your next topics)!

Originally posted by TheDoctor46

 

That 2 interesting pictures in a week. Are they warming us up slowly for the big one!!..Mars disclosure round the corner?.. One of the pics does look a bit like a vertebrae type structure. The circular formation looks similar to the one posted last week as well. Thanks for posting these

Well, I actually wish they would 'warm us up' for the big one, but I'm not sure they actually intend to do so - even IF biological traces (past or present) had been found. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I really have my doubts about that ...

I could imagine a few reasons why they'd prefer not to make something like that public (yet) ... but that would probably be worth a thread of its own!

Originally posted by jeep3r

Originally posted by eriktheawful

 

I will say it is very interesting to look at! And it does remind me of something.

Ever seen something like molten metal or glass that has been dropped into a medium, like water or sand? Allowed to cool and then remove the medium, you get some very interesting shapes.

Sounds like watercasting ... and it surely does look interesting:



That's a nice contribution to the list of possible natural causes for some of the features we see. I'm not sure whether it applies to the features in the OP (I actually doubt it), but it's always good to keep an open mind regarding alternative explanations ... thanks for your thoughts on this!

Actually I thinking more along the lines of like a plaster cast of something. Take plaster, pour it on some dirt that has uneven terrain areas on it. Once the plaster dries, use a water hose to wash away the loose dirt (sand would work great for this), the dirt washes away leaving the harder plaster behind with interesting shapes, some flowing, and curved, but some with rough edges too.

If you had lava that was viscous enough, you might get the same results, producing very strange shaped lava when the medium is eroded away by water and wind.

Of course getting a ring shape like in the OP would be wild....but not unheard of.