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Originally posted by babybunnies
Thanks - never heard of this before.
1580 - 1590? There are lots of things on this map that they shouldn't have known about at that time, such as an accurate depiction of antarctica.
The notion of Terra Australis was introduced by Aristotle.[3] His ideas were later expanded by Ptolemy (1st century AD), who believed that the Indian Ocean was enclosed on the south by land, and that the lands of the Northern Hemisphere should be balanced by land in the south.[1] Marcus Tullius Cicero used the term cingulus australis ("southern zone") in referring to the Antipodes in Somnium Scipionis ("Dream of Scipio").[4] The land (terra in Latin) in this zone was the Terra Australis.[5]
Legends of Terra Australis Incognita—an "unknown land of the South"—date back to Roman times and before, and were commonplace in medieval geography, although not based on any documented knowledge of the continent. Ptolemy's maps, which became well known in Europe during the Renaissance, did not actually depict such a continent, but they did show an Africa which had no southern oceanic boundary (and which therefore might extend all the way to the South Pole), and also raised the possibility that the Indian Ocean was entirely enclosed by land. Christian thinkers did not discount the idea that there might be land beyond the southern seas, but the issue of whether it could be inhabited was controversial.
The first depiction of Terra Australis on a globe was probably on Johannes Schöner's lost 1523 globe on which Oronce Fine is thought to have based his 1531 double cordiform (heart-shaped) map of the world.[6][7] On this landmass he wrote "recently discovered but not yet completely explored".[8] The body of water beyond the tip of South America is called the “Mare Magellanicum,” one of the first uses of navigator Ferdinand Magellan’s name in such a context.[9]
Originally posted by babybunnies
Given the power of the Catholic Church at the time (that still believed the Earth was flat) maybe this map was a direct challenge to that authority, one of the first "round Earth" maps, and this could explain why the origin of the map is so ambiguous. It's likely that if the Catholic Church got hold of the author, they would have probably have been burned at the stake by the Inquisition.
Originally posted by Mugen
Ok on the OP map, look far left of America, left of supposed Hawaii, "Nova Gui" - is that Australia?
Originally posted by jude11
I caught the Antarctica piece as well. So what is inferred is that Antarctica has only been iced over for a very short time. Hard to believe.
Originally posted by EnoughAlready10
After looking at the map below and reading the comments people made one thing hit me like a brick to the head. If sailors made this, or it was made for navigational purposes, it was made really poorly; mainly because its not even close to how the earth has looked for the last thousand years. There are 3 major parts of the Fool's Cap Map that stand out as a wtf moment.
1) Look at the rivers in America. The Mississippi River and all of the Great Lakes are MISSING. The St. Lawrence river shows another river originating way up north near the arctic circle connecting to it. This northern branch is not on any current map that i know of.
2) There is a river in Africa that isn't currently in existence.
3) There are way to many islands scattered across the ocean.
Why are the Great Lakes missing? Why are there extra islands in the ocean? Where is the Mississippi River?
Then it dawned on me. The Great Lakes aren't on the map because they are covered by a mile of ice. There are more islands because the ocean is 400 feet lower.
This map is of the Last Glacial Maximum ... 18,000 years ago.
Look at whats in Africa... that river that isn't there now, but is on the Fool's Cap Map. This map matches the Fool's Cap Map much more closely then our current map does. That would mean this map is somewhere in the ballpark of 18,000 to 10,000 years old, when the last ice age was melting.
you decide.edit on 22-6-2013 by EnoughAlready10 because: silly mistake
Originally posted by Harte
Originally posted by babybunnies
Given the power of the Catholic Church at the time (that still believed the Earth was flat) maybe this map was a direct challenge to that authority, one of the first "round Earth" maps, and this could explain why the origin of the map is so ambiguous. It's likely that if the Catholic Church got hold of the author, they would have probably have been burned at the stake by the Inquisition.
Sorry, but no.
The Catholic Church, and the rest of the educated world, was aware that the Earth is a sphere. This has been the case since the Ancient Greeks proved it was so. The idea that "everyone thought the Earth was flat" is a myth: link
Harte
Zacharia Lilio, a canon of the Basilica of St. John Lateran in Rome in 1496. In a section entitled "That the earth is not round" he argues that "when they assert that the earth is round, Ptolemy and Pliny do not add to the evidence, collected on the spot, they simply make a conjecture based solely on reasoning".[131] It is notable that Copernicus, writing only twenty years after Columbus in 1514, dismisses the idea of a flat Earth in two sentences and has to go back to the early Greeks to find a supporter, though he expends more effort on showing that other current ideas were fallacious and demonstrating the sphericity of the earth.[1] en.wikipedia.org...
Since Copernicus places the earth among the movable heavenly bodies, making it a globe like a planet, we may well begin our discussion by examining the Peripatetic steps in arguing the impossibility of that hypothesis; what they are, and how great is their force and effect. For this it is necessary to introduce into nature two substances which differ essentially. www.webexhibits.org...
Originally posted by burntheships
Originally posted by Harte
Originally posted by babybunnies
Given the power of the Catholic Church at the time (that still believed the Earth was flat) maybe this map was a direct challenge to that authority, one of the first "round Earth" maps, and this could explain why the origin of the map is so ambiguous. It's likely that if the Catholic Church got hold of the author, they would have probably have been burned at the stake by the Inquisition.
Sorry, but no.
The Catholic Church, and the rest of the educated world, was aware that the Earth is a sphere. This has been the case since the Ancient Greeks proved it was so. The idea that "everyone thought the Earth was flat" is a myth: link
Harte
Not everyone was educated, there were still some that held (ignorantly) to the flat earth theory:
And while The Church may not have as an institution held to that belief, they still held
to basic Heliocentrism, as Geocentrism had little attention until Galileo.
Given the power of the Catholic Church at the time (that still believed the Earth was flat) maybe this map was a direct challenge to that authority...
Originally posted by evc1shop
Originally posted by QuietSpeech
S&F for sharing this great map.
Call me captain obvious because I have nothing really insightful to say. So instead I will just point out that I can spot only three images in the waters, one looks like a ship off the West Coast of Africa. Another image is off the East Coast of Africa, however I am unable to make out what it is, it looks like a chicken head. The final image I noticed is off of coast of North America, I can't make out what it is but it certainly looks peculiar.
1. Why place the ship in that location vs anywhere else?
2. What is that creature off the coast of North America?
3. What is the one to the East of Africa?
As the map was based off of another possibly more functional version, are these little images used to delight, add hidden meaning, or were they obvious to any known sailor at that time? Say, where the ship is, designating the only known passage from Pacific to the Atlantic?
I think you have confused Africa with the America's. I see a ship to the West of S. America, a swimming chicken thing off the west coast of what is now Mexico and a swimming pit-bull like head with a beak East of South America's tip. Are these what you are referencing?
I do not have any theories yet but wanted to make sure we are all on the same track.
Let me know if I am seeing something other than what you have stated.
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