ECHELON The Real Threat To Our Privacy!

reply to post by talklikeapirat


Ah thanks for that buddy i will watch the rest of that video later tonight.

Great background info but very, very dated I'm afraid. ECHELON in it's original form, as you've described it actually ended around 1987. ECHELON II went into effect around that time and lasted until 9/11.

The actual, classified codeword project cannot be listed publicly so from there we have to use the public, Senate and Congress given term for the 3rd generation - the Total Information Awareness Network or TIAN. If we were still using the Echelon codeword the current generation would be something like ECHELON 4/5.

The original system only monitored international phone calls for keywords and would dump the 30 to 120 second samples for follow up (maximum amount of time allowed to monitor without a warrant by law). Gen II added some Internet traffic monitoring capability.

The current generation monitors all phone, email and internet traffic including wireless. It also has intelligent computer driven analysis capable of finding relations, connecting dots, etc. They found that looking for specific things like which numbers you call, for how long and how often is actually a better predictor than listening for keywords (the bad guys know not to use anyway) and other forms of analysis are similar such as which sites you visit and when, what emails you read or reply to, etc.

The new system is currently integrating real time video from drones and cameras, financial transactions, etc. There is NO privacy anymore, period. You basically go through life with a government agent watching everything you do is the gist of it, regardless if that agent is human or not.

Interesting short interview w/ the architect of ECHELON I - cryptome.org...

reply to post by ecoparity


Interesting information,

I have to say though i would question it, most of my reading would suggest that ECHELON has been about since at least the 1960's so for him to say he finished ECHELON I in 1987 wouldn't really add up.

I don't think he is out right lying either however but is perhaps talking about the expansion of ECHELON that he worked on. This would makes seance as it was a huge expansion of ECHELON that got Duncan Campbell started on his 1988 article.

I have however read the name "ECHELON-II" in other literature on the subject.

on this issue of the name however, my interest in the subject was thanks to a relative of mine who once worked in SKY-Net 5, a few years ago we were having a beer and were talking about stuff and i asked him ECHELON, which i really only know by name. He told me that yes it exists and that's not its real name but in his job he had heard lots of whispers and know guys who claimed to have worked on some of the tech but didn't really know much more than that.

regardless thanks for the info.

reply to post by dreamingawake


thanks dude glad you enjoyed it

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


Thanks for posting this very useful information. Like you I have beleived that all my computer information was being stored for the past several years as well. What is disgusting is that no matter what you tell people, the majority end up being OK with being surveilled, for whatever reason. Best.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


You're right about the dates being a bit fuzzy, one person being credited as "the architect" of a system so large it required the services of multiple defense contractors is also a bit of stretch.

The system in gen 2 was "Project P415", an upgrade that took effect between 1987-1991 or so.

The amount of computer power online and coming online for the current iteration is incredibly massive, just unbelievable amounts of processing power spread across brand new facilities with 3-4 stories above and 10 or more below ground.

This is a pretty decent investigative report but it really only flys over the very high level, surface view of the real system:

video.pbs.org...

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


Echelon is old and has been replaced.

The "latest" system automatically farms for information from the internet, phones, surveillance cams, medical, registration information, credit & sales data, 'phone GPS, faxes & elsewhere. The data is automatically condensed and compiled by AI and sent to DHS "fusion centres" for final analysis and classification.

Multiple governments and agencies. Very big surveillance of the entire planet, not just the US and allies.

Tell taht to the olks that operate the huge recievers...they are aparently still working for no pay.........

Originally posted by stirling
Tell taht to the olks that operate the huge recievers...they are aparently still working for no pay.........

They were never "paid" in cash, but certain upgrades required by increasing data volumes, were implemented without crippling costs.

... or non-compliance with a government order would be considered suspicious and could adversely affect the operators .

reply to post by chr0naut


There are sensors built in to consumer electronic goods tike flat panel TV's now that connect to the internet and 'phone home' all sorts of compressed-encrypted data packets.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin


Thank you for creating this topic, it needs to be addressed in order to put the PRISM story into a better perspective.

The facts are this spying dragnet has been going on our entire lives.
Getting mad about it today only reveals one thing : That the MSM is good at manipulating the body politic.

It is displeasing to find how a large majority of ATSers even simply don't question what the MSM tells them nor do they connect the dots about how history relates to today.

So yes this is very much needed historical perspective, a reminder that mass surveillance is nothing new, and that it has been extensive.

The dates and other specifics about ECHELON are iffy because I don't trust covert ops to admit legit facts about their operations publicly. What limited information we do have available now suggests that it's only the tip of a larger iceberg, that remains hidden to this very day from the public's view.

Originally posted by chr0naut
reply to post by chr0naut

 

There are sensors built in to consumer electronic goods tike flat panel TV's now that connect to the internet and 'phone home' all sorts of compressed-encrypted data packets.

Like how the US Govt got Microsoft to create a hidden backdoor for them?
Like how cellphones are all tapped via the hardware installed on them we don't know about yet?

They even have plans to put RFIDs in virtually all products, and already have in a lot of instances.
They want to know exactly when you open your Pepsi, how much of it you drink, and how you throw it away or if you recycle it. This information seems useless but to the folks in Marketing it is invaluable information that gives them the upper hand.

Originally posted by chr0naut
reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin

 

Echelon is old and has been replaced.

The "latest" system automatically farms for information from the internet, phones, surveillance cams, medical, registration information, credit & sales data, 'phone GPS, faxes & elsewhere. The data is automatically condensed and compiled by AI and sent to DHS "fusion centres" for final analysis and classification.

Multiple governments and agencies. Very big surveillance of the entire planet, not just the US and allies.

edit on 11/6/2013 by chr0naut because: (no reason given)

well actually ECHELON is more of a term used to describe the massive SIGINT network that has been created as a result of the 1948 UKUSA agreement.

its not a single computer program but its a term to describe a vast SIGINT network

I know what you mean about the systems and such being way more advanced that they were in the past. If you look at the history of ECHELON it kind of merges in with the history of the 5 core member states and the history of cryptology so it can be very murky.

so yes you are right to say that the systems have been replaced and improved on over they years but the fact that these SIGINT services are all shearing their intell continues seeming to this day through the net work that is commonly called "ECHELON". How extensive this is and what exactly the capabilities are today is unclear but the EU report and some of the other sources i have highlighted in the OP do provide more info.

this thread was to generate discussion it was not a "here is everything i know about ECHELON" thread. I wanted to highlight to topic and then have members discuss it and add to the OP which so far seems to be what his happening so i thank you and the other members for doing so.

reply to post by OtherSideOfTheCoin

Echelon is an outmoded matrix of data mining. User driven smart technology is providing infinitely more information, particularly when in nexus with the Internet. PRISM is no more pernicious than ECHELON, but PRISM is just one known branch of NSA data control.

reply to post by aboveandbelow


take a look at the post above yours.

ECHELON is a intelligence shearing network fundamentally, this network sucks up masses of information on a global scale.

ECHELON is not a computer program or some bit of tech.

There's not much I can comment on here, except for the Total Information Awareness programme and that colossal data centre in Utah - put those together, and you should get a rough idea of what's coming down the pipe.
Some of us also warned people for years about the surreptitious profiling being done by FaceBook, Google, etc.

If only more people cared about their privacy.

You should be happy & grateful for Prism. If not for it's leak, "Your Bigger Point", Echelon, would not be able to get the Attention it probably Deserves like you say. The biggest Lies get exposed when the Lies that the Big lie created started showing their Claws, So to speak.

Some of this is not. or cant be, as advanced as everyone is thinking. For instance YouTube is quite obvious, that it's up to no good, when it asks you to fill in your cell phone number so that it can protect your password lol...Google is the same when it asks you to sign in whilst you surf the net...I mean those are bright red flags that they are trying to keep tabs on you, sure perhaps for targeted marketing but I think not, because they already target adds to your internet usage without knowing your name or personal details.
I use one email account in my own name for regular usage but listed a fake address with yahoo from the beginning and that was back in 1994 or 93, it was never the Internets business where I live or what my birthday was..For visiting sites most web sites I use a BS email account...I assumed everyone did the same thing...of course they could still track me through the IP address, but as I said I have no great secrets to hide, I just dont like being tracked and traced, especially when i did nothing to incur it. I am just a suspicious and private person by nature as I always though most people were until i seen society fall like lemmings into Facebook ..hook line and sinker.
I only started using a cell phone 5 years ago and its a cheap pre paid one, which I haven't updated..I knew full well the so called "smart phones" were full of tracking devices...and I dint need one anyhow, all I use a phone for is to make phone calls...not look like a poser on Facebook or twitter.
But the bottom line is if I want to get out of this surveillance society, then the only real way to go is to go off grid and quit using electronic devices altogether..I have heard of some old guys who still live by candle light and coal fires..and water from the well..it might not be for everyone but I reckon it might well be for me.

Originally posted by ImagineAlldaPeople
You should be happy & grateful for Prism. If not for it's leak, "Your Bigger Point", Echelon, would not be able to get the Attention it probably Deserves like you say.

This is true because some of us here have been mentioning Echelon for months now with little to no response, but now people are actually more inclined to believe it sadly, now that the MSM is dishing on PRISM.

Has anyone asked if they WANT us to know about PRISM?

I mean, they seem to be doing their best to anger Americans...

Originally posted by yourmaker

Originally posted by ImagineAlldaPeople
You should be happy & grateful for Prism. If not for it's leak, "Your Bigger Point", Echelon, would not be able to get the Attention it probably Deserves like you say.

This is true because some of us here have been mentioning Echelon for months now with little to no response, but now people are actually more inclined to believe it sadly, now that the MSM is dishing on PRISM.

Has anyone asked if they WANT us to know about PRISM?

I mean, they seem to be doing their best to anger Americans...

Yes we have asked that question...As I believe this "leak" isn't a leak. If PRISM is as top secret as we are led to believe then a security contractor surely wouldn't have had such easy access to it..etc...
I think this is a deliberate step to inform the public that we are being spied on...

I already predicted a mute response from the public at large, because most people these days freely give up all their personal information on Facebook..so most of them just couldn't care less if they are being monitored...And this is the crux of the disclosure. It's acceptable to be an idiot who washes their laundry in public...the masses have been successful turned from "private citizens" into "public morons" through the successful marketing and peer pressure of Facebook.

It's a police state by social programming...much easier than using jack boots and secret police..Now we have public morons who do all the spying for TPTB, they even record minor events and plaster them on YouTube...Epic Beard Man anyone.... I mean how many times have we now heard of people being fired for Facebook postings or getting arrested for twitter postings...or...for having other "citizens" film them in compromising positions, think John Galliano making a drunken anti Semitic statement in a restaurant and it ending up all over YouTube, leading to him getting sacked from his prestigious position...it goes on and on...for all the deliberately leaked celebrity sex tapes..think how many thousands more are plastered on the net of ordinary unsuspecting individuals, who may never even know they are a pornhub hit.

This is the real surveillance society and everyone is in on it...they just don't get how complicit they all are in their own downfall...because the public at large are idiots. The technology is out of the bottle, but society is not responsible enough to use it and all this is gonna bite everyone on the 455 before too long.

The government disclosure AKA leak...was made IMO because they have already conditioned society to be participants in the war on terror and in falling for Facebook etc...So this leak has just confirmed and legitimized surveillance..I say that because instead of denying it Obama admitted its existence, a president would never admit to such a program unless he knew the public would no object to it..and look..just as I predicted..no objection..at least no significant one. that proves it for me..this is no leak..its a set up for the next step.

This surveillance can now be "discussed" in public and legitimized...it already has been...so when the next level of surveillance comes people will have to be made aware of it because it will be that intrusive. Probably a mass micro chipping program. that's my guess. I mean on you tube there is a clip from some US TV network news show promoting 2017 for micro chipping everyone..Like its inevitable and normal. This stuff doesn't make MSM unless its already been planned..I mean micro chipping everyone would be considered tin foil hat business normally...not anymore.....

Facebook roll out and conditioning...PRISM disclosure and acceptance...microchipping....

www.youtube.com...