U.S. intelligence mining data from nine U.S. Internet companies in broad secret program

Oh do you know where the NSA guy Donilon was during the Boston Bombing? He flew into Moscow the day before and was sitting at the table with his counterparts in Russia as the Boston Bombing took place. Strange right?

en.rian.ru...

US National Security Advisor to Bring Message to Moscow

NEUCHATEL (Switzerland), April 12 (RIA Novosti) - US National Security Advisor Tom Donilon will come to Moscow on Monday and bring a message from President Barack Obama, Foreign Minister Sergei Lavrov said on Friday. It will be a wide-ranging message on the prospects of bilateral US-Russian relations, he said, citing US officials. The Kremlin press service said earlier in the day Russian President Vladimir Putin might join the scheduled talks between Donovan and Russian Security Council chief Nikolai Patrushev at some point, but he will not have a separate meeting with the US official. Donilon, who is also due to meet with presidential Foreign Policy Aide Sergei Ushakov, will discuss preparations for a meeting between Obama and Putin. Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said in early February US President Barack Obama is unlikely to visit Russia until September, when he is due to attend the G20 leaders' summit in St. Petersburg.

And then he resigns a short time later? And then you have a large NSA leak?

Originally posted by bgold1212
Can someone explain how a company such as Google can be tapped into by the NSA and willingly expose all the data? Take Gmail for instance, each account features a password with encrypted emails. Does this override the encryptions?

Fully capable of bypassing the password to gmail accounts...

Originally posted by Gazrok
Only a very, very, very small percentage of communications are flagged for perusal by actual humans, usually only after running through various software programs looking for keywords, patterns, and other factors. They simply don't have the manpower or time required to actually go through it all any other way, and even then, it is highly doubtful everything is run through the programs even for first filtering. It's just too much data....

Just what did you think they were monitoring when they talk about "chatter"?

Well, that's not the point, the point is that the data EXISTS and is stored (for decades) and CAN be accessed by whomever under whatever random reason given and under whatever agenda.

"Manpower" is not needed if you have the $$$ and infrastructure to build super-computers to haul tons of terabytes each day..this goes automatically. I think that's the idea of PRISM, that everything is fully automatized.

There are parallels to similar existing systems the FBI etc. uses for profiling and tracking down serial killers and murderers. There are systems which have crimes and murders stored with all the circumstances and details, an investigator can use the system which will automatically show up similarities and spit out a list of potential suspects, something a person CAN NOT do with manual work. (Or at least not effectively)

PRISM (as I see it) is similar, except that an EXISTING infrastructure (facebook, google searches, email accounts etc.) is used creating a HUUUGE, massive amount of data....which the NSA can now simply tap in and "profile" people (and their friends of course) based on WHATEVER criteria they enter in the system.

As long as the system EXISTS (and the existence alone is already the danger) - you cannot predict what the next legislation will do with that data. What in 10 years? What in 20 years? Imagine a potential government where we HERE on this board would be deemed "enemies" because of some people voicing criticism about the government. All the data exists, it's recorded right this second. One button, one query...they pull up your history spanning back decades and rest assured they will find SOMETHING if they want to find something. This is the problem here. It's only a matter with what intent someone taps into that data..and this intent can not be predicted - there is a huge potential for abuse, if it's not abused already.

NSA could start a great dating site Pretty robust people profiles.

OK, but should I be worried? I’m no terrorist and not even criminal. I have nothing to hide. Will this really affect me?

Yes and no.

The immediate impact on your life is probably zero. These intelligence systems sift through and store huge amounts of data and it is impossible to read every single message. They use automatic filters that trigger on certain secret keywords, and flag these messages for closer examination. A message to or from you may trigger a filter once in a while, but its harmless nature will be apparent in the manual examination. There are of course a lot of private secrets that shouldn’t leak to others, but they are of no interest to authorities. The risk that such secrets leak through PRISM is close to zero. Most ordinary people fly under the radar of these systems and will not really notice them at all. What’s more scary is the stored data. We have no clue about how it will be used in the future and who will have access to it. To cite Snowden: “Even if you are not doing anything wrong, you are being watched and recorded. … You don’t have to have done anything wrong. You just have to eventually fall under suspicion from somebody. Even by a wrong call. And then they can use this system to go back in time and scrutinize every decision you ever made. Every friend you ever discussed something with and attack you on that basis to sort of derive suspicion from an innocent life and paint anyone in the context f a wrongdoer.”

So you should be very worried on a principal level. Have you ever thrown away something, just to later realize how much you would have needed it? This is what’s happening to privacy today. Many claim that they have nothing to hide and that the loss of privacy is a fair price for security. There are however two fundamental problems with that reasoning. Very few have any idea about what price we really pay, i.e. what impact the loss of privacy may have on our future lives. And nobody knows what security we get in return, if we get any at all.

The price. Today we live in a world where Internet still isn’t fully integrated in our lives. The development is fast but the net is still often seen as an alternative to handling your business in the traditional way. Any privacy issue will naturally be magnified by the day Internet is our mainstream way to communicate with other people and businesses. The intelligence systems of today are also fully capable of collecting data for any purpose, even if the official reason for building them is the fight against crime and terrorism. Today we are building more and more capable systems that tap into something that is becoming the backbone in our society. And all this with a blatant lack of openness and very rudimentary control of the purpose and use of these systems. I call this a recipe for disaster. Future misuse is inevitable, unless we change direction.

Should I be worried about PRISM?

reply to post by CIAGypsy


The government created a lot of laws to prosecute terrorist after 9/11. Except they never brought any here to prosecute. They took them to Gitmo with no charges. So who did they create the laws for? Now think again about Prism. And ask your self should I be worried?

Originally posted by JBA2848
reply to post by CIAGypsy

 

The government created a lot of laws to prosecute terrorist after 9/11. Except they never brought any here to prosecute. They took them to Gitmo with no charges. So who did they create the laws for? Now think again about Prism. And ask your self should I be worried?

edit on 11-6-2013 by JBA2848 because: (no reason given)

JBA,

I believe PRISM to be unconstitutional. This whole discussion has been a hard one for me and I have made many enemies among my colleagues whom this topic has directly affected. While I understand all too painfully the ever-evolving vulnerabilities that we face as a nation from terrorism, both foreign and domestic, I don't believe that "prevention and prosecution" of under the auspices of such gives the government the right to violate the Constitution.

Originally posted by purplemer

Originally posted by bgold1212
Can someone explain how a company such as Google can be tapped into by the NSA and willingly expose all the data? Take Gmail for instance, each account features a password with encrypted emails. Does this override the encryptions?

Fully capable of bypassing the password to gmail accounts...

They don't have to bypass anything, what did you use to set your password? Google?Microsoft Windows?Apple OSx? they have unrestricted access to their servers.
They have your password!

reply to post by Anonbeleiver77


They don't have your password they have the master passwords. Such as NSA.Key in Microsoft. And it is put in during the patent process. Just like when encryption software goes for a patent it must hand over the information to the government and they tell them what must be added for government access.

en.wikipedia.org...

Microsoft's operating systems require all cryptography suites that work with its operating systems to have a digital signature. Since only Microsoft-approved cryptography suites can be installed or used as a component of Windows it is possible to keep export copies of this operating system (and products with Windows installed) in compliance with the Export Administration Regulations (EAR), which are enforced by the US Department of Commerce Bureau of Industry and Security (BIS). It was already known that Microsoft used two keys, a primary and a spare, either of which can create valid signatures. Microsoft had failed to remove the debugging symbols in ADVAPI.DLL, a security and encryption driver, when it released Service Pack 5 for Windows NT 4.0 and Andrew Fernandes, chief scientist with Cryptonym of Morrisville, North Carolina found the primary key stored in the variable _KEY and the second key was labeled _NSAKEY.[1] Fernandes published his discovery, touching off a flurry of speculation and conspiracy theories; such as the second key, owned by the United States National Security Agency (the NSA), could allow the intelligence agency to subvert any Windows user's security.[citation needed] During a presentation at the Computers, Freedom and Privacy 2000 (CFP2000) conference, Duncan Campbell, Senior Research Fellow at the Electronic Privacy Information Center (EPIC), mentioned the _NSAKEY controversy as an example of an outstanding issue related to security and surveillance.[citation needed] In addition Dr. Nicko van Someren found a third key in Windows 2000 which he doubted had a legitimate purpose, and declared that "It looks more fishy".[2]

The NSA signs into any software as the software maker and has complete access. A second key is made just for them to use.

CNN is now reporting that Snowden revealed that the U.S. has been hacking computer systems in other countries all over the world for years.

U.S. hacks computer systems of countries all over the world

Snowden says that when the U.S. claimed that China was hacking our systems, they were not. We were hacking theirs.

reply to post by ButterCookie


Check out this thread where I brought this up a while ago.

Why is DHS Protecting other countries infrastructure?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

They hacked China and then told China what they did and said you need to fix this list of things. Hire these American companies and they will do it for you.

Anonymous is our government doing hacking. They hire contractors to do hacking through DHS. One such company you can check out is Jaded Security. Boris who worked for them hacked the Florida voters database and posted it on line. Then he got in trouble and burned his Cissp certificate. But he still carried on with his UN version of the certificate for hacking. The UN certificate said he did nothing wrong his US CISSP certificate said he broke the law. Then he was rehired and sent out to hack the rest of the states voter systems and did it to several other states. And he is a ISraeli who moved to the US in 2001 as a hacker. He is now a dual citizen. I forget what year he got his US citizenship. But CISSP got together just last year and a large portion of the CISSP holders who were allowed to vote wanted him as the new boss.

Somebody even had the power to have this information removed from ATS. Not just the things ATS did not allow but almost everything about this. Just look at the thread about it.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

And that is what made me dig even harder on it.

This thread shows a lot of information in it. And most people think it was liberal crap but it was directed at the government BS not a party.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by JBA2848


That is some serious stuff. Bout to check into that thread and that link...

reply to post by ButterCookie


People still don't know George Zimmerman was tied into all this BS also. He worked for a company that spies for the US government. Digital Risk LLC. And his boss traveled to the White House for a meeting and the next day the media threw all the questions at him about the case because they knew about that meeting and who he was but did not tell the American people.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by JBA2848
reply to post by ButterCookie

 

People still don't know George Zimmerman was tied into all this BS also. He worked for a company that spies for the US government. Digital Risk LLC. And his boss traveled to the White House for a meeting and the next day the media threw all the questions at him about the case because they knew about that meeting and who he was but did not tell the American people.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

edit on 12-6-2013 by JBA2848 because: (no reason given)

Interesting thread!! Starred and flagged.

So it looks like they are getting rid of all the 'whistleblowers' or even possible ones, and replacing them with their own folks....

This broad secret NSA program has some additional critical areas that few are discussing and in that regard, I want to add an area of discussion, that in my opinion, needs to be considered along with all the intelligence data mining that has been ongoing for some years now.

While the NSA disclosure is beginning to allow many others to see and think in different ways regarding how this data mining could be used against political party enemies and those not considered supportive of the Obama administration, what few consider is that this type of surveillance can be used against our own federal agencies attempting to do their jobs.

For instance, if a major terrorist event took place, it would be the FBI, DHS and others that would be involved in the active investigation of that crime. It is this type of criminal investigation that such NSA surveillance abuses could be used to impede an investigation or to inform those abusing the NSA technology in advance of what evidence has been declared, discovered or that will be used in the active court case. In such a way, the systemic abuses of NSA technology to surveillance our own federal agencies, could be used to undermine, impede and obstruct justice by those attempting to do their federal investigative jobs.
.
Those that are currently abusing the NSA technologies are using the data for many things, but it is my suspicion that if they can target political enemies and those that threaten the future of the Obama regime, then it also stands to reason that any major national investigation could be impeded or obstructed in advance, by many who should not even have access to such classified data.

The many recent Obama scandals that have recently plagued the Obama administration, all began historically with Eric Holder lying about Fast and Furious, but after a lull in media attention, it was the Benghazi, Ambassador Stevens affair that stirred the nation. It is the Benghazi affair we should return to, for therein lies the reason for so many distractions and contradictions since Benghazi, for it has generated so many allegations of incompetence and or complicity to allow such an event to occur in such a way, that we cannot obtain answers from anyone about the truth of Benghazi incident for all the blatant lies that have been put forth by the administration, all the while Obama is stating he was unaware of anything that happened.

Who ordered the rescue assets for Benghazi to stand down needs to be addressed and while the NSA is today getting all the media attention, it is the other not mentioned NSA abuses that I suspect are a key part of the Benghazi incident that occurred on 09-11-12.

The NSA abuses are serious, but I suspect that such data and such surveillance capability has been abused to ensure that those in power know in advance, who knows what before the public knows it and in such a way, accidents happen and witnesses end up dead or suicided if their testimony could name names and or actually get someone convicted of the crimes they are accused of.

The sitting administration is today clearly showing the nation complete arrogance to the rule of law, because Obama will do what he wants and anyone who objects or opposes him becomes a target of the state for doing so.
Surveillance abuses and privacy issues are valid concerns, but so are clandestine and covert efforts to obstruct justice and that is what is not being discussed as much as it needs to be, as it relates to this NSA surveillance program.

Thanks for the thread.

Originally posted by JBA2848
reply to post by Anonbeleiver77

 

They don't have your password they have the master passwords. Such as NSA.Key in Microsoft. And it is put in during the patent process. Just like when encryption software goes for a patent it must hand over the information to the government and they tell them what must be added for government access.

en.wikipedia.org...

Microsoft's operating systems require all cryptography suites that work with its operating systems to have a digital signature. Since only Microsoft-approved cryptography suites can be installed or used as a component of Windows it is possible to keep export copies of this operating system (and products with Windows installed) in compliance with the Export Administration Regulations (EAR), which are enforced by the US Department of Commerce Bureau of Industry and Security (BIS). It was already known that Microsoft used two keys, a primary and a spare, either of which can create valid signatures. Microsoft had failed to remove the debugging symbols in ADVAPI.DLL, a security and encryption driver, when it released Service Pack 5 for Windows NT 4.0 and Andrew Fernandes, chief scientist with Cryptonym of Morrisville, North Carolina found the primary key stored in the variable _KEY and the second key was labeled _NSAKEY.[1] Fernandes published his discovery, touching off a flurry of speculation and conspiracy theories; such as the second key, owned by the United States National Security Agency (the NSA), could allow the intelligence agency to subvert any Windows user's security.[citation needed] During a presentation at the Computers, Freedom and Privacy 2000 (CFP2000) conference, Duncan Campbell, Senior Research Fellow at the Electronic Privacy Information Center (EPIC), mentioned the _NSAKEY controversy as an example of an outstanding issue related to security and surveillance.[citation needed] In addition Dr. Nicko van Someren found a third key in Windows 2000 which he doubted had a legitimate purpose, and declared that "It looks more fishy".[2]

The NSA signs into any software as the software maker and has complete access. A second key is made just for them to use.

edit on 12-6-2013 by JBA2848 because: (no reason given)

Yes of course and as such they have access to all your passwords as well as the passwords are stored in the servers.......my point exactly

reply to post by MaxBlack


Did you forget that the NSA did not tell Obama until after he had won reelection? And remember that Paula worked for the NSA. And the NSA guy who did not tell Obama also just got fired. Tom Donilon. And his wife and his brother all who held jobs that controlled the information that Obama, Biden and Biden's wife were allowed to know.

So who is the Donilon family and why do they have so much control of the White House?
www.abovetopsecret.com...