If you believe lobbying and monetary influences are the problem with US policies

I think many if not most people believe that you need to follow the money in order to discover the truth. I simply don't rule that theory out when it comes to politics.

There is way to much money and to large of a grey area between our politicians and lobbying industry. I would like to propose that Democrats, Republicans,Independents,etc come together and unite to tackle this issue and demand the following from the DNC the RNC, and any political candidate or group they belong to.

1. ALL party members demand that lobbying policies and the revolving door policy between gov't and the lobbying industries become issue number 1.

2. Demand that we change how we currently lobby congress and utilize technology in order to give everyone and equal voice.

Instead of having the lobbying industry spend billions to get our politicians ears we can use an electronic database where voters (lobbyist included) can vote on policies being pushed. The higher the voter count, the higher visibility the issue gets from both Washington and the Press.

It doesn't even necessarily have to be an official count.Perhaps each bill will be required to contain a section where the vote count is included and a certain amount of votes will be mandatory by the general public.

At this point we need to just make this AN issue and make it come to the forefront so we can start looking at appropriate solutions.

I'm thinking we should start a petition at petitions.whitehouse.gov... to have the White House address the request as an action item.

Here are some Actions that will need to be performed if anyone cares to be involved.
1. Verify if any similar petitions already exist?

2. If a petition doesn't exist create one with the appropriate language and keep it simple for all parties to come together on.

3. I did a quick search on the DNC and the RNC website and facebook accounts , but found no way to submit any issue that matters to the voter, I only found what they consider to be the issues. So if you know of a way or place to actually submit an issue online to any of the parties please post it. perhaps twitter or even under existing facebook post we could bombard with likes to any link to the petition?


Additions influenced by other ATS Members:
Per an issue identified by Boncho where people vote solely on the name of the bill

I propose that each bill that the voters vote on are to be numerically generated with a short summary or paragraph of the details. In addition to a one paragraph drafted by those who support it and oppose it in addition to the details of the bill.

reply to post by interupt42


I have a simpler solution, outlaw lobbying and make it a federal crime. It's time to clean house and throw the traitors under the buss (legally of course).

1. If they get caught lobbying for a domestic corporation, give them life in prison.
2. If they caught lobbying for a multinational or foreign country, hang the bastards.

This would have to apply to both the lobbyer and lobbyist. Sure would cut down on political crime and potentially add a little "chlorine" to the gene pool at the same time ;-)

ETA - And no more of this dual citizenship crap in political or sensitive positions. A person cannot have two masters. If they want to work and get paid by the government with taxpayer funds, they had better damn well have the taxpayer's interests at heart. If they get caught beholding to anything other than the government that's paying them (hence the citizens) option 2 works well there too.

Cheers - Dave

you would fire the pimps?

without lobbyists most congressmen would not know what their solution or position is.

a parot that can memorize bs and the stupidity of ideology would fit right in in washington.

good luck cleaning that cespool.

Originally posted by bobs_uruncle
reply to post by interupt42

 

I have a simpler solution, outlaw lobbying and make it illegal. If they get caught lobbying for a domestic corporation, give them life in prison. If they caught lobbying for a multinational or foreign country, hang the bastards. This would have to apply to both the lobbyer and lobbyist. Sure would cut down on political crime and potentially add a little "chlorine" to the gene pool at the same time ;-)

Cheers - Dave

Lobbying in reality is not a bad thing , Its a way to get your government to hear you. What makes it bad in today’s society is the amount of money required to be heard. This was done purposely by the large corporate and special interest groups who turned it into a highest bidder business model where the common man can't be heard.



I

Originally posted by interupt42

Originally posted by bobs_uruncle
reply to post by interupt42

 

I have a simpler solution, outlaw lobbying and make it illegal. If they get caught lobbying for a domestic corporation, give them life in prison. If they caught lobbying for a multinational or foreign country, hang the bastards. This would have to apply to both the lobbyer and lobbyist. Sure would cut down on political crime and potentially add a little "chlorine" to the gene pool at the same time ;-)

Cheers - Dave

Lobbying in reality is not a bad thing , Its a way to get your government to hear you. What makes it bad in today’s society is the amount of money required to be heard. This was done purposely by the large corporate and special interest groups who turned it into a highest bidder business model where the common man can't be heard.



I

This is the problem here. Make it like the lobbying of old where Lord sat in a room and listened to all the town villagers voice their woes.

It wasn't the most entertaining experience, but it gives everyone equal footing.

*Woman, around 70. "Well sir, you sees, I was walking my pooch I was and he's an old fella like me he is. And I's just thinks there ought be some sidewalks ya see, cause god darned truck travelling near the speed of a locomotive damn near ran over poor Charlie it did."

There will be a big earthquake in Washington DC shortly. Presently it is experiencing a monitary sink hole problem but that is just a predecessor to what is to come. We have already had the warning quake which reduced a little stress on both sides of the fault. We are about to have the biggest quake in US history, far bigger than the great depression.

There is no fixing this mess. You cannot patch a dryrotted tire for long and the tube they inflated to fix the economy can't work if the structure of the tire are so corrupt that they can't support the weight of the debt.

Originally posted by citizen6511
you would fire the pimps?

without lobbyists most congressmen would not know what their solution or position is.

a parot that can memorize bs and the stupidity of ideology would fit right in in washington.

good luck cleaning that cespool.

LOL and very true. However, you wouldn't have to fire the pimps , the technology would make us equal pimps. Our forefathers intended for we the people to be in charge of our street walkers in DC.

Originally posted by citizen6511
you would fire the pimps?

without lobbyists most congressmen would not know what their solution or position is.

a parot that can memorize bs and the stupidity of ideology would fit right in in washington.

good luck cleaning that cespool.

If I had my way, they wouldn't just be fired. Of course the military always said my solutions were too permanent, but there is generally no sensible negotiation with fanatics, traitors and/or terrorists.

Cheers - Dave

reply to post by boncho


Don't need to, we have technology to allow everyone equal voting online. If everyone cared about the old Pooch and the side walk issue, then that subject should be moved to the forefront.

Think of it like ATS, where the subjects that get the most attention and are moved to the forefront are the ones with the most flags and stars.

Originally posted by interupt42
reply to post by boncho

 

Don't need to, we have technology to allow everyone equal voting online. If we everyone cared about the old Pooch and the side walk issue, then that subject should be moved to the forefront.

Think of it like ATS, where the subjects that get the most attention or are moved to the forefront are the ones with the most flags and stars.

There is no equal voting, the criminals that perform the count have control over the outcomes. In a perfect world, we would need an independent voting system controlled by people above reproach. Unfortunately, this is not a perfect world and in my experience literally anyone can be bought and sold for the right price.

Removing lobbying and introducing some form of country-wide voting/referendum process might be a step in the right direction, however, you'd need watchdogs for the counters, watchdogs for the watchdogs and watchdogs for those watchdogs at minimum.

Cheers - Dave

Originally posted by rickymouse
There will be a big earthquake in Washington DC shortly. Presently it is experiencing a monitary sink hole problem but that is just a predecessor to what is to come. We have already had the warning quake which reduced a little stress on both sides of the fault. We are about to have the biggest quake in US history, far bigger than the great depression.

There is no fixing this mess. You cannot patch a dryrotted tire for long and the tube they inflated to fix the economy can't work if the structure of the tire are so corrupt that they can't support the weight of the debt.

edit on 31-5-2013 by rickymouse because: (no reason given)

Don't disagree with how its all been secretly manipulated , but the truth of the matter is political cheerleaders will continue to support their party and blame the other party for our woes. We are in a ping pong match between the Republicans and the Democrats in an endless match. BTW that ping pong match if not designed by the lobbyist they are sure using it as method of distraction and keeping us all fighting among ourselves.

So the only way I see getting back control of our gov't is one step at a time. IMO the first step is separating the monetary influences over our politicians. This should be a no brainer and wanted by all sides.

Originally posted by bobs_uruncle

Originally posted by interupt42
Removing lobbying and introducing some form of country-wide voting/referendum process might be a step in the right direction

Cheers - Dave

Thats all I'm trying to do and hopefully see.

reply to post by interupt42


But how, the congress makes the laws that govern them. They aren't going to do anything to jeopardize campaign contributions.

Originally posted by interupt42
reply to post by boncho

 

Don't need to, we have technology to allow everyone equal voting online. If everyone cared about the old Pooch and the side walk issue, then that subject should be moved to the forefront.

Think of it like ATS, where the subjects that get the most attention and are moved to the forefront are the ones with the most flags and stars.

edit on 31-5-2013 by interupt42 because: (no reason given)

If the flag and star system is reflective of how this would work it would be an utter failure. Non issues flagged ad infinitum when they have been shown to be complete tripe, or its some out there theory that was debunked on page 2 but no one read further than the OP.

You know what, I just realized people are idiots. I don't really want them making decisions.

They are after all the same people that fall for the two party system and support anything that says "Save the children."

New spying bill submitted entitled: 'Save the children from online predators that want to rape your kids act'

Votes: 50,000,000/1

Text of the Bill:

This bill ensures police powers can randomly check all dwellings to make sure no children are being raped inside. These powers offer police the ability to, but not limited to: Entering any residential dwelling, strip search inhabitants, seize computer equipment.




Yup.

I'd stick with the current system to be honest...

Originally posted by rickymouse
reply to post by interupt42

 

But how, the congress makes the laws that govern them. They aren't going to do anything to jeopardize campaign contributions.

We have to crawl before we run. At this point I don't care about the specifics or details of how to implement it. The first step is just make this an issue so people are start talking about it and thinking about it.

You do it by small grass movements and forcing them to address the issue.
As I suggested, we can open a formal petition request that the White house has to answer after so many votes. Facebook, texting,twitter bombardments are other means of spreading the word.

Heck even Star and flagging here on ATS will give it more attention . BTW Not a shameful attempt to get S&F but that is how most topics get to the forefront. I would be even willing to have this thread closed and someone else open it and star an flag theirs in order to give the subject matter more attention.

Originally posted by bobs_uruncle
reply to post by interupt42

 

I have a simpler solution, outlaw lobbying and make it a federal crime. It's time to clean house and throw the traitors under the buss (legally of course).

1. If they get caught lobbying for a domestic corporation, give them life in prison.
2. If they caught lobbying for a multinational or foreign country, hang the bastards.

This would have to apply to both the lobbyer and lobbyist. Sure would cut down on political crime and potentially add a little "chlorine" to the gene pool at the same time ;-)

ETA - And no more of this dual citizenship crap in political or sensitive positions. A person cannot have two masters. If they want to work and get paid by the government with taxpayer funds, they had better damn well have the taxpayer's interests at heart. If they get caught beholding to anything other than the government that's paying them (hence the citizens) option 2 works well there too.

Cheers - Dave

edit on 5/31.2013 by bobs_uruncle because: the ETA

Outlawing lobbying would be worse than having it.

Could you imagine our political leadership if the people had no access to them. They would simply rule from their ivory tower.

We certainly could look at lobbying practices and make them tighter or re-define the process to give the common man more access but even Madison wrote that preventing people access to their representatives was worse than the problems that comes with it.

We could do something like having taxpayers pay for every single campaign and limit the amount they can spend. No outside donations whatsoever. Sure the price gets dumped on us but it would eliminate the problem of contributions having a say in elections.

Although we've seen with the recent elections that campaign contributions do not guarantee you anything. Romney far outspent Obama and it didn't mean anything.

We could also give politicians a set salary that they keep for the rest of their life on the guarantee that they will never work in the private sector again. This would eliminate the need for politicians to seek favorable legislation for companies they wish to work for after they leave office.

Of course, neither of these ideas would be taken seriously but you get the point that there are things we can do to limit lobbyist influence. Simply getting rid of lobbyists is not a good idea at all.

Follow the money is good advice, but dont stop at the lobbyists.

Connect the corporate dots. When you follow that rabbit hole, you'll be amazed at the small handful of corporations/people that are really pulling the strings.

reply to post by boncho


I agree with most of what you said and you bring up an excellent point of people voting solely on the name of the bill.

I propose that each bill that the voters vote on are to be numerically generated with a short summary or paragraph of the details. In addition to a one paragraph drafted by those who support it and oppose it in addition to the details of the bill.

Once the bill gets a lot of attention then it moves to the fore front where it will be covered by the Press and politician and more details will come forward.

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
Follow the money is good advice, but dont stop at the lobbyists.

Connect the corporate dots. When you follow that rabbit hole, you'll be amazed at the small handful of corporations/people that are really pulling the strings.

There are plenty of very very powerful lobby groups that are not profit driven. AARP and NRA come to mind right off the bat.

They sway politicians with threats of voter turnout, not campaign contributions per se. Be careful lumping all the blame on corporations because you will be missing a very powerful lobby sector.

Originally posted by Hopechest

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
Follow the money is good advice, but dont stop at the lobbyists.

Connect the corporate dots. When you follow that rabbit hole, you'll be amazed at the small handful of corporations/people that are really pulling the strings.

There are plenty of very very powerful lobby groups that are not profit driven. AARP and NRA come to mind right off the bat.

They sway politicians with threats of voter turnout, not campaign contributions per se. Be careful lumping all the blame on corporations because you will be missing a very powerful lobby sector.

Which is why I did not say that all corporations were to blame, but rather to follow the trail. Like I said, when you follow things far enough, you find that it is a fairly small group that is the problem.

I feel like you may have misinterpreted what I was saying.