To those that think gay marriage is wrong...Moving video

reply to post by LeoStarchild

Originally posted by LeoStarchild
smh.. I guess you can't fix stupid. But in your case I guess there is no way to articulate..

Or else, I have shown you that you are operating under a double standard and you have no intelligent response, so you call me "stupid".

Originally posted by Berzerked
reply to post by kaylaluv

 

Youre confusing morals with superstitions but whatever, there are never any winners in this debate.
This is the last thing ill say in this thread.
Gays need to stop trying to force/shame people into accepting something they dont want to accept.
Stop walking around naked and performing gay sex acts in the Folsom Street Fairs, if heteros did that, they would be arrested and stop labeling everyone that doesnt agree with you, hateful homophobes.
Work on that and you may be earn more peoples respect.

(when i say "you" i dont actually mean you.. just a generalization.)

Remember, there ARE religious gays out there. And there are very immoral heterosexuals out there as well.

Tell the college girls at Mardi Gras to stop showing their naked breasts. How many of them get arrested? I have a friend who also happens to be gay. He is in his fifties, and he has never been to a gay pride parade. It's not his thing. He's very conservative and wouldn't be caught dead in public naked. Where is your respect for him?

Not all blacks can dance. Not all Asians are bad drivers. Not all religious people are homophobes. Not all gays walk around naked performing gay sex acts.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

Just curious, do you think churches should have the legal right to say no to a couple based on other "sins" they may be committing? In other words, if a couple is divorced, can the church say no? What if they have a child out of wedlock?

As someone who is Catholic I can tell you the way it works with us usually, this might vary form parish to parish and priest to priest.

But I know that any priest can refuse to marry someone for a number of reasons one such reason might include not practicing your faith. How it works with sin I am not 100% sure but I would imagine that If you were a axe murderer the Priest might ask to hear your confession before he thinks about letting you get married in the church.

The issue of devoice is interesting, basically in most cases if you have been married in the eyes of the lord you can only do it once. That means that even if you have the legal separation in the eyes of the church you’re a still married in the eyes of the Church and as such you cannot get married a second time in a church although you can for still go down to a registry office and do it again. There are however some exceptions to this if I can’t be proven that the marriage was invalid. These reasons could include one party to the wedding being married to another secretly, or one party was forced into the marriage. If that is the case then the marriage can be annulled.

But marriage (legal marriage) is a state-offered contract, that should be offered to all adult, consenting citizens of that state.

That to me is a civil partnership something that we have just now in the UK and I agree with it entirely, I it could also be described as a legal marriage.

reply to post by Berzerked

Originally posted by Berzerked
I think it should be up to each individual state, the feds need to stay out of it.

I agree that marriage is regulated by the state. However, in every state, when a couple is married, the federal government grants over 1000 benefits and privileges to those couples. Unless they're gay. For example, in Iowa, gay people are permitted to get legally married. But the federal government does not grant those benefits and privileges to gay couples. Do you think that's fair?

The fact is the feds ARE involved. Maybe that should change, but as it is NOW, they are involved.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


I have not conceded, you just wish to twist and spin to fit your commentary..

Gayness is wrong and immoral, but we live in a world where morality is dead. It is better to live promiscuously because its 'cool'.

Furthermore, I wouldn't have such a problem with the gay community if it (gayness) wasn't promoted and vindicated. My example being the comparison between Tim Tebow and gay guy in the NBA. (See random news coverage of both).

Until these people realize that this is a non-issue, meaning there are more pressing matters with the country.. I and many others will continue to point out how wrong it is .. to move this to the front of the line.

reply to post by LeoStarchild

Gayness is wrong and immoral, but we live in a world where morality is dead. It is better to live promiscuously because its 'cool'.

That however is only your personal opinion, mine is the exact opposite.

“Promiscuity”= FUN, really lots and lots of sex is a lot of fun.

No one is ever going to win the “is homosexuality right or wrong debate” just like no one will ever win a “is abortion right or wrong” debate.

reply to post by LeoStarchild

Originally posted by LeoStarchild
Gayness is wrong and immoral,

I don't have a problem with your opinion of homosexuality. It's YOUR opinion and you are entitled to it. I believe in freedom. My point isn't related to morals or opinions. My point is related to equal treatment under the laws of our land.

Until these people realize that this is a non-issue, meaning there are more pressing matters with the country..

This is true. There are more pressing issues. But this one speaks to the VERY foundation of our nation. Equal treatment of all US citizens, regardless of their beliefs.

reply to post by Benevolent Heretic


They have equal protection. The have the exact same marriage rights as any heterosexual.

Originally posted by OtherSideOfTheCoin
I do not think it is right for homosexuals to argue that they should be allowed to marry say in a Catholic church or have a legal right to do so as to do so infringes on the rights of religious groups.

I agree. Religious institutions can not be forced to go against their religion by 'marrying' gay couples. That would infringe upon the religious rights of those who attend those churches.

Marriage equality means that homosexual couples can be married in the eyes of the law ... and/or in any church that believes in homosexual marriage.

If a church doesn't believe in it .... then that gay couple wouldn't share that church's beliefs and wouldn't want to be members of that church anyways, right?

reply to post by 200Plus

Originally posted by 200Plus
They have equal protection. The have the exact same marriage rights as any heterosexual.

Actually, they don't. Iowa offers marriage licenses to straight and gay couples. By LAW, the federal government grants over 1000 benefits and privileges to ONLY the straight married couples of Iowa. Gay couples who are LEGALLY married are denied equal treatment under federal law.

Federal Rights and Protections Granted to Married Couples (Except for gay couples)

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
It's "normal" to be able to procreate. I am not normal. .

Yep .. I'm a member of that club as well.

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
do you think churches should have the legal right to say no to a couple based on other "sins" they may be committing? In other words, if a couple is divorced, can the church say no? What if they have a child out of wedlock? )

Churches can say and do whatever they want with their faith. They can decide if they'll marry people within their faith or not. Those people who get 'rejected' for marriage in that church .. well .. they know where the door is. They can walk out and take themselves to a church that believes the same way that they believe.

(and they can take their donation money with them! )

Originally posted by Benevolent Heretic
"Should people who cannot reproduce be denied the right to marry"?

Legal marriage .. no.
Marriage in a church .. it's up to the church if they want to do the ceremony or not.

Side note - any church that would not marry a couple just because they can't have
children isn't a church that I'd want to worship in. I'd avoid it like it was death ....

Originally posted by LeoStarchild
Gayness is wrong and immoral,

You are welcome to that opinion .. but it reminds me a lot of people who go around saying that there should be sharia law in the world, or Christian rule of law in the land, so that there won't be any (of what they consider to be) 'blasphemy' or 'ungodliness'. What is one persons version of 'wrong and immoral' ... isn't necessarily God's version of 'wrong and immoral'. Ya' know??

Originally posted by Hopechest
Your not the first person to post that video on a forum you know.

And regardless of the video content my point is still relevant. Its hard to give sympathy to a group that does not extend it to others.

Ok I have to admit that from all the posts that I read from you and that you are a busy little bee with an agenda... I do have to agree with you on this one actually I think its the first time I do agree with you right off the bat

Well where are my human/civil rights? What if I don't want to get married, yet I want the benefits of marriage? What if I'm perfectly happy with my partner and I want the same tax breaks married couples get? Always discriminating against single people WTF is up with that?!?!?!?

We should all worry about more important things then to discuss how other's should live theirs life's. It is a waste of time and life it self. We no longer teach our self's how to live but always find reasons to teach other's how we think they should live, and what laws and benefits apply or not. Agriculture, the root of all this trouble.

On to the subject and most reply's i have read, why do you all care so much what other's do? you can't do it for them, can't change their mind in a thousand years, who cares if they wanna be accepted and treated fairly?
I don't wanna sound rude, or inconsiderate, but the issue of gay marriage is just ridiculous.

The Church is a Public Servant, so are Lawyers, Police officers, Government officials and the list goes on. When in the world did Public Servants start making policies and regulations? They are there to server the population, that is their only function, the fact that were arguing about gay marriage just says that we gave them that power to domesticate us.

It's not up to the church who gets married or not, it is the people's choice (the one's getting married of course)
Let it be gays, or anyone else. It is not up to the Lawyers and courts to determine what is legal or not, but US, why do we let them make decisions for us? Gay's or even the rest of the population doesn't have any rights no matter what angle you look at, were pets, and as long as we continue to unrecognized that, no one will have rights.

Originally posted by LeoStarchild
reply to post by Benevolent Heretic

 

Gayness is wrong and immoral, but we live in a world where morality is dead. It is better to live promiscuously because its 'cool'.

Tell heterosexual college students that. Tell my conservative, 50-something gay male friend that, he's only had sex with 2 people his entire life, including his partner of over 20 years. I'm heterosexual, and the same age, and I've had sex with more people than that. Is his "gayness" still immoral?

Until these people realize that this is a non-issue, meaning there are more pressing matters with the country.. I and many others will continue to point out how wrong it is .. to move this to the front of the line.

You're right about one thing... this should be a non-issue. Everyone having equal rights shouldn't be an issue.

Originally posted by LeoStarchild
Once again.. Gayness DOES NOT PERPETUATE THE HUMAN RACE ...no .. it is NOT normal to be gay. It is NOT the new norm.

and lastly .. STOP trying to shove gayness down everyones thoat, Frankly Im sick of hearing the argument really..

Its a non issue.. move on.

Oh, it is so not a non-issue :-)

We are all human. There is nothing that perpetuates the human race like making it safe to be human

Cranking out more people is not the definition of normal. The ability to accept people unconditionally - even when you don't want to - that's not normal either

But, this has been what humanity has been working towards all these many years - and we're getting there

If you think it's biology that determines what's normal, then you should consider that that means any living thing is normal - baby makers and non-baby makers alike. It's the people that contribute to society, care for each other, work for the good of all of us - these are the people that perpetuate the human race

Worms can make babies

I mean no disrespect towards human parents. Or babies. Or worms

:-)

reply to post by jheated5

Originally posted by jheated5
Well where are my human/civil rights? What if I don't want to get married, yet I want the benefits of marriage?

If you want the benefits of driving a car, get a license.
If you want the benefits of having an education, get an education.
If you want VA benefits, join the military.
If you want the benefits of marriage, get married.

What if I'm perfectly happy with my partner and I want the same tax breaks married couples get?

See above.

reply to post by charles1952

The arguments are not logical, they are all emotional.

Where is the logic in the opposing view? It is all emotion - and: we want we want we want...

What's more, we insist - nay - we demand - you live your life by our laws - our way

Now that people are deciding differently it really stings - doesn't it?

Well, this isn't revenge my friend - it's just a change in the way we see the world, our lives - and our rights

This isn't just a gay movement Charles - this is a lot of people deciding enough is enough. It's not about biology, or immorality - it's about the right of any human being to love. Yes - love, not (ahem) fool around. Unless you mean to say that only a heterosexual couple can love and also make love?

Sorry about all the sugar - but T&Cs you know :-)

This is about sex - and not about sex. This is what many who oppose gay marriage don't see. They seem to believe that a gay person is not capable of true love or commitment. Seems it's only about sex - and benefits. It has nothing to do with being accepted for who and what they are as a person - same as anybody else. It has nothing to do with civil rights. It has nothing to do with humanity

It's seems to me - that some people want to deny certain groups are human

What do you care who marries who? Their lives don't affect you at all. How do their choices even touch your life?

Open your eyes Charles and see - people are people. Love your neighbor as yourself

Also - would love a link to that study on gay couples and their kids - as long as you brought it up

P.S. Charles - even if it were just about sex - and money: still nobody's business but theirs. They want to get married - that's up to them

Originally posted by thePharaoh
i dont get it

no such thing as a gay marriage...its a partnership

marriage is a religous requirement...are gays religious??????????????

what church is meant to offer ceremonies...and if it does..is it still a church


i just think there isnt that many gays wanting a marriage...i think its exaggerated
i think its more about destroying culture

they are being irresponsible by plugging gay lifestyles as a lifestyle choice and not a deeper issue


i say...being gay isnt a thing...not being gay isnt a thing either
so whats with all this noise

you want to stand in a church??? than start your own

peace

Christianety have no sole right of the sanctity of marriage no matter what the followers of that faith believes. Two people who are destined by god to be together should be together not matter what idol humans create of it. If you want to belong to a church that does not allow it then do that but you are showing god by your behaviour what you are.

From my point of view:
All people who are bullying the gays have totally missed the point and will pay the price for it since they are proving where they belong and where they should not be allowed to go. Getting to the next stage is not a popularity contest and following dogma is not a wise choice.