Did they find Atlantis today?

reply to post by ajmusicmedia


Ajmusicmedia what was the name of the Greek play that you said took place on the moon?

reply to post by Harte


Well, what if the eqyptian equivalent name ended up being...oh...what's the name of the island of fire in the underworld of their mythology? What if it ended up being exactly that name? Then it would explain how the myth of Atlantis began i.e. the Sais priest was talking about the 10 god kings and a bunch of other supernatural things and Solon made the mistake of thinking it was about an actual island in the real world. It would certainly explain the similarity in details between the story of Atlantis and this 'island of fire': Ten kings, island to the west, etcetera. Then Plato adds all the other details later on to argue for his idea of a perfect society and, as with any great story, it finds a kind of immortality that is immune to logic or facts.

Seriously, researching such might be the 'last nail in the coffin' on all of the Atlantis debate. I find it weird that you seem so against such an endeavor. Really all I was trying to say is that 'reverting' the Atlantis story back into it's supposed ancient Egypt original form might lead to a definitive answer one way or the other.

And, YES, I know that the OP was about granite but I couldn't help but answer what I've always viewed as a fundamentally flawed counter-argument from the 'Atlantis isn't real' side.

Originally posted by Mad Simian
Well, what if the eqyptian equivalent name ended up being...oh...what's the name of the island of fire in the underworld of their mythology? What if it ended up being exactly that name? Then it would explain how the myth of Atlantis began i.e. the Sais priest was talking about the 10 god kings and a bunch of other supernatural things and Solon made the mistake of thinking it was about an actual island in the real world. It would certainly explain the similarity in details between the story of Atlantis and this 'island of fire': Ten kings, island to the west, etcetera. Then Plato adds all the other details later on to argue for his idea of a perfect society and, as with any great story, it finds a kind of immortality that is immune to logic or facts.

Do you believe such a similarity exists?

Why don't you link to and quote from the Egyptian myth you reference here? Parta has already done so several times. I didn't see any similarity at all.

You're relying on Solon making a specific string of "mistakes." Solon was no historian, as Plato was no historian. If Solon ever even mentioned such a story, as Plato's allegory suggests, why would we necessarily believe that he was not fictionalizing?

Also, there is simply no "myth" of Atlantis. There are only two mentions of the place, both from Plato. No myth about Atlantis exists in either culture.

Originally posted by Mad Simian
Seriously, researching such might be the 'last nail in the coffin' on all of the Atlantis debate. I find it weird that you seem so against such an endeavor. Really all I was trying to say is that 'reverting' the Atlantis story back into it's supposed ancient Egypt original form might lead to a definitive answer one way or the other.

I'm not against it, I've been looking into the story of Atlantis since 1980 or so. I'm just telling you what I've found.

I long ago thought of the approach you mention of looking into Egyptian myths. I would applaud any effort on your part to do the same. However, I already know what you will find.

Originally posted by Mad Simian
And, YES, I know that the OP was about granite but I couldn't help but answer what I've always viewed as a fundamentally flawed counter-argument from the 'Atlantis isn't real' side.

I took that for granite.

If you consider the argument fundamentally flawed, then it's not enough to just sit back and say "Maybe if somebody would look into Egyptian myths, we might settle this problem." You have to do that yourself, if, as it appears, you are unwilling to believe the reports of people (such as myself) who have already done so.

I'd like nothing more than for a place like Atlantis to be found, btw. It's just that I have been convinced it won't. I could be wrong, but there is simply no evidence whatsoever that would indicate such a place ever existed, which relegates the Atlantians to the realm of fiction/speculation, to my mind.

Harte

Originally posted by ajmusicmedia

Originally posted by Harte

Originally posted by ajmusicmedia
The Gauls believed Belanos and Toutatis had planted life on Earth then left for other planets to do the same.

I'd say you would have a very difficult time backing that one up, since little is known about either figure, and what we do know comes from later association with the Greco-Roman pantheon.

You seem to believe that there are libraries of ancient Celt lore laying around somewhere, when they wrote almost nothing at all of their beliefs and myths.

Harte

Actually, French contains less than 120 words that come from the Gaul language and most of these are translated from Latin (which had adopted some Gaul words). Of course there are no libraries lying around. Yet they were the greatest metal workers of their time and had the most advanced agriculture of their time. Not quite illiterate idiots hiding in the woods. Quite a lot is known about them actually.

And you can infer from their metallurgy and agriculture that a couple of their gods were aliens that "seeded" Earth and then left us, to do the same on other planets?

Wow, are you perceptive!

Harte

reply to post by Hopechest


Hellanicus of Lesbos, a Greek writer born 63 years before Plato, wrote a work called "Atlantis". In it he mentions Poseidon, the founder of Atlantis, Poseidon's firstborn son Atlas, the first king of Atlantis, and his seven daughters.

Before Plato was born, Herodotus, the "father of history," mentions Atlantis by name, saying the waters beyond the Straits of Gibraltar were said to be known as the Atlantis Sea. He does this in his book “Clio ~ The Histories, book 1”, which was begun in 450BC.

"But one of the mouths of the Araxes flows with clarity into the Caspian Sea. Now the Caspian Sea is by itself, not connected to the other sea; but the sea navigated by all the Greeks and the one outside the Pillars called the Atlantis Sea and Erythaean are one and the same."

Plato gave a very detailed layout of how big Atlantis was and what it was comprised of. None of this detail is necessary if all he wanted to do was tell a moral story.

His writing also states that all the Athenian armies were drowned at the time, so no reason to think the original Athens would have survived either, as the whole area from Istanbul to Crete at that time was above water.

Plato’s grandfather Solon herd the tale from a group of Egyptian Priests at Sais, around 560 BC, which they knew from ancient tablets and writings on columns within Egypt.

Plato says Atlantis was ruled by ten kings before it disappeared. Egyptian mythology states there was originally 10 god-kings, who ruled in a foreign country. They were called Auriteans. Sanchuniathon in 1193 BC calls the same kings "Aleteans". This was 600 years before Plato was born.

Ancient texts in Egypt, Greece and Mesopotamia refer to the 10 god-kings, and also list their replacements, which occurred at around 9850 BC. Some Egyptian texts were also said to have had maps of Atlantis, including its round capital city. Athanasius Kircher’s 1665 map is based upon an older Egyptian version of the map, and it may show only the southern most island of Atlantis, as the two landmasses north of it should also have been above water with it. One of those is circular in shape.

Manetho translated the Egyptian king lists in 250 BC. There is also the king-list at Abydos, the Palermo Stone and the Turin Papyrus. Manetho tells us that the first kings did not rule Egypt, but a foreign country in the west. Egypt was originally either a colony or a conquered nation.

• PTAH . . . . Hephaestus
• RA . . . . . . .Helius
• SU . . . . . . . Agathodaemon
• SEB. . . . . . Cronus
• OSIRIS . . .Osiris
• SET. . . . . . Typhon
• HORUS. . . . . .
• THOTH. . . . . .
• MA . . . . . . . . .
• HORUS. . . Horus

The old Egyptian word for Cronos is Seb, which later became called Repha. In the Old Testament the Hebrew word for giants/titans is Repha-im. In Greek myths, the Titans are the sons of Cronos. Zeus fought against Cronos and defeated the titans by throwing a ball of fire out of the sky. It burnt the land and boiled the sea. Zeus imprisoned Cronos at the bottom of the Ocean in Tartaros.

There is a reason Homer says Tartaros was located west of Gibraltar, under the Atlantic Ocean

I have provided you a copy of a map found in Egypt by the Romans around 30 BC. It seems to show a large island that is now underwater and right where Plato said Atlantis was. So how could it be mapped if it was always underwater?


www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by spiritualarchitect


Hellanicus of Lesbos, a Greek writer born 63 years before Plato, wrote a work called "Atlantis". In it he mentions Poseidon, the founder of Atlantis, Poseidon's firstborn son Atlas, the first king of Atlantis, and his seven daughters.

The actual quote is

“Poseidon mated with Celaeno, and their son Lycus was settled by his father in the Isles of the Blest and made immortal.”

Are you saying that the Isles of Blest are Atlantis??

Plato gave a very detailed layout of how big Atlantis was and what it was comprised of. None of this detail is necessary if all he wanted to do was tell a moral story.

Er why? What parameters was he forced to follow to tell a story? Why is the extensive back story of the American civil war needed to tell the tale of 'Gone with the wind'? For what is this tale actually about?

I'll stop there for now I also noted that

Your material has been lifted without citation from this website, unless of course it is you who wrote it?

Website

They are not a creditable source

reply to post by Harte


Well, if you know someplace online that could FULLY teach me both greek and ancient Egyptian for free, I'd love to take a crack at the thing. As it is, I'm relegated to limited sources such as Wikipedia and the like in any translation attempt I might make.

**edit**Also, I'd have to find a copy of the T&Cs in greek to begin with. So far, I've only found bits and pieces of it this way online. If you don't mind me drawing on your experience in this area, have you found a copy of them in Greek online? Preferably as a free download and not from some professional site where you have to be a paying member of either the website itself or an archaeological-type organization.