The Citizen Hearing on UFO Disclosure (complete video series within)

Originally posted by lambros56
reply to post by ForteanOrg

 

Sorry but I wasn't duped at all.

If you were merely expecting entertainment, you weren't. If you had not heard anything of this before, you might even see it as valuable education and you weren't duped either.

Again: I'm not against entertainment, nor against congresses, conventions, courses - as long as they are presented as such.

I didn't pay my four bucks to see disclosure. This hearing wasn't about proof of disclosure.

Of course not. As there has been no disclosure there can't be proof of it either. I know.

No, It was about trying to bring about disclosure.

And.. did it succeed, in your opinion? If so, how? I'm at a loss to see it.

I'm not a lover of Greer but I think Stephen Basset brought more reliable witnesses to these hearings than you get at some of these Exopolitics events.

Reliable witnesses??

Like, say, that old guy that said to be a former CIA agent - and that stumbled into an interview with an alien "incidentally" whilst being on a mission on behalf of Eisenhower/Nixon? The DOD crypto guy with a DOE(!) Q-clearance? The one that magically used magnet stripe cards TWO WHOLE YEARS before they were invented in 1960..?
Maybe Mitchell? Hellyer? Listen to them carefully, you will notice that both say they have no personal experience on the matter at hand, they refer to other people that have. Hellyer once saw an UFO - that's nothing special, the discussion never has been if UFO's exist, of course they do. But all other opinions of Hellyers are based on Corso's books and on what he heard from other 'high ranking officials' or other self-proclaimed witnesses.

Having a panel of ex congress men and women I thought was a good idea.

Had it been ACTIVE members of Congress I might have believed they might have been able to make a difference (though history has proven that even involvement of presidents did not help much). Nobody gives a hoot about EX congress men. And the bunch they selected weren't all part of the 'fine fleur' of America either...

Money. That's what this is all about, alas.

Did you know that, according to The Examiner Bassett succeeded in raising over a million dollars to fund his Citizen Hearing? Still not convinced there is Big Money involved..??

Did you watch any of the hearings ?

Of course I did. They were conveniently posted in here.

Because to be honest, you don't seem to be talking about the same thing I watched last week.
Don't get me wrong. I know only too well of those who are out to earn money from hearsay etc but in my opinion most of those who gave evidence were very reliable and the comments from the panel seemed very impressive.

Impressive.. well, I've been to many plays in many theatre's and it is quite common to be touched and moved by what you see in front of you. But it's not real. This was simply theatre.

You strike me as a nice person that really has an interest in the subject, but simply hasn't been around as long as I have. I also happen to know a bit about tricksters, fraud, magicians and role-playing. Believe me, this will never lead to disclosure - even the ASSUMPTION there is something to disclose is just that, an assumption.

Originally posted by torsion
Time is time.

reply to post by torsion


In a perfect world, time is time, but its not a perfect world, not yet anyway.

The hours you have spent on time contributing to ATS have most likely been done in your own spare time from the comfort of your own home, so no, you do not get paid for that.

I just think your argument about the whole " but they made money so it can't be true" is pretty weak, Its a job. These people are working hard and putting in hours and hours of paperwork no doubt. Do you think they should do that for free?

reply to post by ForteanOrg



What makes you think I watched the hearings to see disclosure ?
Because that's what you implied in your earlier post to me.

As I say. The hearings were about trying to bring disclosure.
Maybe wasting our time asking governments but we have to start somewhere because it IS a reality and the more hearings, the better, in my opinion.

Obviously the money side of it is a problem to you and you believe it's a scam.
That's your opinion but wether Basset got a million from someone honestly makes no difference to me because as I said. I don't think me or the public have been duped because I enjoyed the hearings.
It may take another four or five hearings before anyone....if anyone takes notice but someone has to do something because whoever is keeping this thing suppressed from the public has no right.

I don't have a problem with your opinions.
It's just that it doesn't bother me if these people make money from sponsors or mr Rothschild.
All events have sponsors and charge the public but the public in this case was charged pennies........that's what I don't get about people complaining.

I'm not so new to this as I had my first sighting in December 68 and have been studying the subject since I left school in 71.

reply to post by NarcolepticBuddha


Made the mistake of watching this meeting yesterday, 3 hours later and I was still watching, haven't started the lectures yet

I've been in the field of Ufology for at least 5 years and I am familiar with all the well known cases put forward here so there's nothing very new for me, however I must applaud the efforts of Linda Moulton Howe and Richard Dolan in their presentations, also Stephen Basset for putting this on. There was also some tit-bits of information that I wasn't aware of, specifically the current White House set-up involving those who appear to be pro-disclosure.

All in all this meeting may not change a thing in regards to disclosure but it isn't the organizers fault, it's the fault of the military industrial complex for refusing to acknowledge the information here, which I believe the bulk of to be true.

Very interesting O.P wished it was before a real hearing S&F

Originally posted by Tikitiboo

I just think your argument about the whole " but they made money so it can't be true" is pretty weak,

Those are your words. That isn't part of my argument. Go back and re-read!

Originally posted by lambros56
reply to post by ForteanOrg

 

What makes you think I watched the hearings to see disclosure ?
Because that's what you implied in your earlier post to me.

Simple logic. Why else would you watch them - unless, as I suggested, for mere fun and entertainment, or to be taught something you did not yet know? Assuming the latter, DID you learn something you did not know yet?

As I say. The hearings were about trying to bring disclosure.
Maybe wasting our time asking governments but we have to start somewhere because it IS a reality and the more hearings, the better, in my opinion.

Indeed, why ask for disclosure at all?

Either the government can be trusted - or they can't. If you believe they can be trusted then there is no reason to ask for disclosure, because you trust them to do what is right. If you do not trust them, there is no reason to ask for disclosure either as whatever they say can't be trusted anyway. So, why ask "the government" to disclose anything?

Obviously the money side of it is a problem to you and you believe it's a scam.

Indeed.

That's your opinion but wether Basset got a million from someone honestly makes no difference to me because as I said. I don't think me or the public have been duped because I enjoyed the hearings.

Can you tell me WHY you enjoyed these hearings? I did not hear anything new. About disclosure: see my previous remarks. Why ask for it at all..

It may take another four or five hearings before anyone....if anyone takes notice but someone has to do something because whoever is keeping this thing suppressed from the public has no right.

Again, you are ASSUMING there is something being suppressed and kept from the public. The 'hearings' did not give any proof of that. There were a lot of stories told, but no proof. But even then: see my previous remarks about the trustworthyness of government and the need to ask for 'disclosure'.

I don't have a problem with your opinions.

Even if you had, I would live with it. I mean no disrespect, but we are in here because we share an interest in ufology, not necessarily the same opinion.

It's just that it doesn't bother me if these people make money from sponsors or mr Rothschild.
All events have sponsors and charge the public but the public in this case was charged pennies........that's what I don't get about people complaining.

.

I would not say that we are (all) complaining. I do. Not because I was tricked or fooled - I wasn't. I am "complaining" about the fact that a series of showmen can pull of this charade without labeling it as such. I also don't like it when people earn loads of money because they lie. These clowns prey on the gullible. I find that disgusting.

I'm not so new to this as I had my first sighting in December 68 and have been studying the subject since I left school in 71.

That's good to hear. Hence, you know all about Adamski, Meijer, Santilli, SERPO, Jonathan Reed, UMMO etc. - so you know that making money and/or trickstering people is quite normal in the field of ufology. I find it quite remarkable that you think this obvious scam does not fall into one of these categories - or do you - and that you are fine with it. By Jove, man, these pranksters and showmen make a mockery of something that should be SERIOUSLY investigated.

BTW: what did you see, way back in 1968?

Originally posted by Lysergic
Greer can't sit still while Sheehan talks lol.

Wonder what explanation for his jitteryness he'll give once he reviews the footage.

He'll weave a story around it no doubt. "I was being targeted by a government agent's Tesla death ray. They were trying to silence me but thankfully invisible ETs were in the room protecting me with transdimensional refraction absorption. If you look closely you can just see the power beam as I twitch for the 17th time. Eventually the assassin put down the ray gun and started to play an air guitar. From that point on you'll notice I remain still. Please donate all you can as I need to develop a Tesla deflection suit for protection against future assassination attempts. Donate now."

Originally posted by torsion
He'll weave a story around it no doubt. "I was being targeted by a government agent's Tesla death ray. They were trying to silence me but thankfully invisible ETs were in the room protecting me with transdimensional refraction absorption. If you look closely you can just see the power beam as I twitch for the 17th time. Eventually the assassin put down the ray gun and started to play an air guitar. From that point on you'll notice I remain still. Please donate all you can as I need to develop a Tesla deflection suit for protection against future assassination attempts. Donate now."

I could be way off base here, but my understanding is that ad hominem attacks generally work better if they are grounded in actual character traits, not spurious fancy.

Now look what you've made me done, defend the Moth-Man, Steven Greer, of all people! Really, I am mildly annoyed with you.

I found the testimonies of retired military personnel very interesting and FAR more important than petty discusions about the organisation of the event...
I think we are failing at prioritizing stuff here..
I am SURE that there are those who use this events for their own economical interests, but isn't the subject of UFO's a little more important than that? And if there is legitimate information, shouldn't we focus on that?

After all, those gullible enough to buy into the more "hocus-pocus" aspect are the (louder) minority.
Most of us want real information about a subject that (in our opinion) seems to be real.


In an event where you have first hand witnesses on unidentified incursions over nuclear facilities, we are discussing FREAKING GREER!?????
Are you kidding me? Who f**ing cares about Greer?

Oh, and BTW, another false and petty argument made here:
NO ONE SAID THIS WOULD BE AN OFFICIAL DISCLOSURE EVENT you puffy balls of cheese!!
Of course this is not an official disclosure, THAT'S WHY WE NEED events like this, even if it means having Greer and Howe and Friedman there, it's the lesser of two evils...

So, my question is, my dear co-internauts, why are you focusing SO MUCH on the least important part of this?

reply to post by drakus


Haven't digested the entire event yet, but so far I think Howe actually has made a valid point regarding the cattle mutilations and Friedman provides good testimony regarding his research into the MJ12 documents as well as pointing out important issues regarding debunking the subject.
I reserve my opinion regarding Greer still, but so far and surprisingly enough, I thought he behaved himself rather well during his first testimony.

But, like I said; I'll wait until I have watched the entire event before reviewing Greer.

Has it ever occurred to some of you that there's nothing to disclose? That the reason there's secrecy behind some UFO sightings, is because they are sightings of experimental man-made military craft that need to be classified to maintain an edge on the global stage, when it comes to advanced weaponry? That while only a very few people left believe we are alone in this huge universe, that evidence of actual contact from an alien race simply does not exist?

Originally posted by ABeing
reply to post by drakus

 

Haven't digested the entire event yet, but so far I think Howe actually has made a valid point regarding the cattle mutilations and Friedman provides good testimony regarding his research into the MJ12 documents as well as pointing out important issues regarding debunking the subject.
I reserve my opinion regarding Greer still, but so far and surprisingly enough, I thought he behaved himself rather well during his first testimony.

But, like I said; I'll wait until I have watched the entire event before reviewing Greer.

edit on 8-5-2013 by ABeing because: (no reason given)

What I mean is that they are not first-hand witnesses.
I'm not trashing the work of investigators, I'm saying that, to me, the testimony of actual military personnel is WAY more important. And, in my view, should be the main focus of this hearing.
And I agree about Greer, his incursions on his more "fluffy" side was rather limited, which I'm thankful for, It'd have totally ruined the presentation...

welp, already gone..why youtube why!!

reply to post by ForteanOrg





Well. We'll have to accept our disagreements.

First one I witnessed with another 15-20 people.
It was disc shaped with white and green lights. It hovered at about two hundred feet above our heads and hung there for over twenty minutes.
A bright flash and it shifted slightly then shot off...no noise at all....just seemed to vanish.

I was told a few weeks later that someone had taken a picture of it but I never got to see the photo or who took it.

reply to post by ZeroPropulsion



The web site ' citizenshearing' probably took them down because I know they are still streaming the archives of the hearings for at least another few weeks.

reply to post by ZeroPropulsion

Originally posted by ZeroPropulsion
welp, already gone..why youtube why!!

Money.

reply to post by ZeroPropulsion



Try this