Metal Pollution Absorbed By Flowers Is One Major Cause Of Bumblebee Decline New Research Finds

reply to post by burntheships


When the farmers sue the EPA because the finding that pesticides are one of the cause of bees decline the answer from the government is to spend 3 years and tax payers money doing research that probably will have special interest behind it.

Three years to inundate the public with published propaganda to divert attention from the pesticides to other "possible causes of bee decline like now this "Metal pollution", by the time the three years are over the crap that will be fed to people will be so confusing that those that had no idea how the corporate dictatorship works in the nation will believe anything.

Monsanto is one of the main killers of bees and they have done it in purpose.

Originally posted by burntheships

Originally posted by Bedlam

Right, it isn't found in metallic form in nature. It's always as a salt or oxide.

Right, so then if Aluminum has been around for as long as the bee,
I wonder why the bees were fine up till about the last decade or so?

Varroa mites, fungi, deformed wing virus, neonicotinoid insecticides.

Originally posted by marg6043
reply to post by burntheships

 

Three years to inundate the public with published propaganda to divert attention from the pesticides to other "possible causes of bee decline like now this "Metal pollution",

Yes, this occurs to me too, hence why I posted this in a questioning manner.
Albeit, I must admit the geoengineering comes to mind, and maybe
they have hit on something inadvertantly?

In any case, if aluminum is a culprit as they have indicated, something must be
different for it to be true, as aluminum and the bee came to be at the same time.

So, what is different this last decade?

Originally posted by wujotvowujotvowujotvo
reply to post by Bedlam

 

At least educate yourself on how far back the citations go.

What study is it being cited in your dismissive attack?

As if it ends/ended there and in fact there are tens more that critics have less firepower to dismiss.

Show me the papers. Especially the ones on cell phones in 1964. I really REALLY want to see those. I'll wait.

Meanwhile, mine was here.

Must have been some sort of insightful paper to test cell phones out in 1964.

Originally posted by burntheships

In any case, it aluminum is a culprit as they have indicated, something must be
different for it to be true, as aluminum and the bee came to be at the same time.

Except they never say this is the case. If you read the paper.

Originally posted by Bedlam

Varroa mites, fungi, deformed wing virus, neonicotinoid insecticides.

Yes, all of that, especially the neonics. So, whats your take on the study?

your quick

Yes, they do implicate the aluminum as a culprit in the bees memory loss,
and also fatality.

Originally posted by burntheships

Originally posted by aboutface
They name a new pesticide rich in both nickel and aluminum as well as the exhaust from cars and tractors.

Hi aboutface,

Were you able to find a copy of the entire study?
I searched, could not find a free copy, only the abstract.

What is the name of this new pesticide, now that is really a good find.

Well, there isn't one that's 'rich in both nickel and aluminum', that being a misread on aboutface's part. But the ones they are talking about are mainly imidacloprid and clothianidin.

Originally posted by Danbones
Finding out some thing is wrong involving something as important as bees which may be something that can't be brought back, through hindsight is a hard way to go

True that, isnt that the way they always do it though?
They think they have a better idea...

Look at Fukushima...

reply to post by Bedlam


to quote Wuj:

Volume 74, Issue 1-4, pages 86–94, January/December 1973 ...1969

close enough
did I miss a reference to cell phones in 1964 somewhere...?

Originally posted by burntheships
So, if aluminum in nature is different than say....aluminum oxide,
this could pose a problem for the bees....

Aluminum in nature IS aluminum oxide, aluminum sulfate and aluminum chloride, for the most part, with a lot of other chemicals that incorporate aluminum. Like beryl, cryolite, garnet, spinel and turquoise, for instance.

reply to post by burntheships

That is our industrial problem. We mine ore, refine it and use it is all manner of products. Most of these products are obviously hazardous to our health. Lead, (batteries, paint), Mercury (gold refining), even non metallic, (especially non metallic) products like PCB's, Dioxin, PVC, all this stuff makes the world go round....

We be chokin on civilization...

Before we came along all this stuff was buried deep under mountains in as benign a form as naturally possible. But we come and dig it up and spread it on the surface, burn it and ingest it....mmmm

As prices for minerals and their by products increase the destruction of the ecosystems to procure the less and less thats left will increase the damage to the environment exponentially.

Not just the bees either.

Originally posted by burntheships

Originally posted by Bedlam

Varroa mites, fungi, deformed wing virus, neonicotinoid insecticides.

Yes, all of that, especially the neonics. So, whats your take on the study?

your quick

Yes, they do implicate the aluminum as a culprit in the bees memory loss,
and also fatality.

edit on 11-4-2013 by burntheships because: belam being quicker than I

It's interesting, but it would be more interesting if they'd had some quantitative indication that anything is different than it's always been. They tap dance around it.

We lost most of our hives to varroa. It's a real issue. After they started spraying neonics the rest of our family bees just died. I think Dad's going to try recolonizing, if he can find enough bees for sale. You don't find a lot of swarms in the wild like you once did.

reply to post by Bedlam


Ok, well aluminum is toxic and does not degrade.

Toxic metals can replace nutrient minerals in enzyme binding...
and as this happens the metals inhibit, can overstimulate and or o
therwise alter thousands of enzymes.

Toxic metals can also replace other substances in tissues.

And, the study does implicate aluminum as fatal to the bumblebees,
and causes them to lose memory etc...

ETA I did notice they are a bit vague....
from the abstract...

I had an interesting conversation at a meeting tonight.
A bunch of these guys out of the blue started talking about not getting any cantaloupes last year..
One started a beehive and several had planted sunflowers to attract more bees.
I ask them what they thought was the cause,and no one had a really good answer.
I mentioned a few things that I have read,and I got the you are crazy look,so I let it be.

I have been reading all this stuff,but tonight was the first time I had seen the implications of it.

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by burntheships

 

That is our industrial problem. We mine ore, refine it and use it is all manner of products. Most of these products are obviously hazardous to our health. Lead, (batteries, paint), Mercury (gold refining), even non metallic, (especially non metallic) products like PCB's, Dioxin, PVC, all this stuff makes the world go round....

We be chokin on civilization...

You have a good point intrptr,

The only question I have, we have been doing all of that
stuff for decades, half a centruy or more....this would have had the same
effect long ago it seems....

maybe the study is a red herring...

or a new apsect of use we are not privy too.....

Originally posted by burntheships
reply to post by Bedlam

 

Ok, well aluminum is toxic and does not degrade.

Well, it can't exactly degrade, it's an element. Other than, I suppose, Al-26.

Toxic metals can replace nutrient minerals in enzyme binding...
and as this happens the metals inhibit, can overstimulate and or o
therwise alter thousands of enzymes.

Toxic metals can also replace other substances in tissues.

And, the study does implicate aluminum as fatal to the bumblebees,
and causes them to lose memory etc...

Aluminum, being ubiquitous, is the sort of thing you and every other living thing has evolved to deal with, at least in reasonable quantities. It's not hideously toxic, or we'd all be dead. The study involved flowers that were growing by roadsides that had known higher levels of aluminum and nickel. It discusses flowers that have been contaminated by car exhaust, machinery and farming equipment.

And the study indicates that the bees ignore aluminum content and avoid nickel, but only after they taste the first flower in the batch. After that they avoid the area.

It's only about $36, buy it.

getting baack to the electric charge which developes when a conductor is moved across magnetic lines of force..it generates current flow in the conductor

you have a bee with some aluminium in its face, it flies through the magnetic lines of force generated by the electrical lines and transmission towers...

alumium is a great conductor

shock treatment causes memory loss

don't taze me bro....

Originally posted by Danbones

alumium is a great conductor

METALLIC aluminum is. Aluminum oxide is a great insulator.

reply to post by kdog1982


Kdog,

Hi and here is what I heard around my area....
hand pollinating is the thing...otherwise no eggplant, no cantaloupe.

I hand pollinated last year, it works but its not a lot of fun....
I had more bees last year around my beds than before early on,
I let the clover grow....but after about July, the bees were greatly dimished.

All of my neighbors spray....round up...

reply to post by Bedlam


aluminum oxide is an insulator but its only a few molecules thick on any Al particle or surface.
like wire in an electric motor ( which AL sometimes is, as well as copper, ) magnetic lines of force go right through the oxide coating and charge the Al

and some times the insulation causes the particles to act as a CAPACITOR which of course makes the shock treatment hypothosis even more possible because it ups the voltage and causes it to arc at much higher levels

digestive acid and physical contact can also breach the oxide coating