The Unforgiveable Sin

The Unforgiveable sin is simple to know and obvious.
Its associating others in worship with God.
Angels/prophets/saints/idols/self(desires) etc.

46. Surah Al-Ahqaf (The Curved Sand- hills)

1. Ha-Mim.
[These letters are one of the
miracles of the Qur'an, and none
but Allah (Alone) knows their
meanings].
2. The revelation of the Book (this Qur'an) is from Allah, the
All-Mighty, the All-Wise.
3. We created not the heavens and the earth and all that is
between them except with truth,
and for an appointed term. But
those who disbelieve turn away
from that whereof they are
warned.
4. Say (O Muhammad to these pagans): "Think! All that
you invoke besides Allah show
me! What have they created of
the earth? Or have they a share
in (the creation of) the heavens?
Bring me a Book (revealed before this), or some trace of
knowledge (in support of your
claims), if you are truthful!"
5. And who is more astray than one who calls (invokes) besides
Allah, such as will not answer
him till the Day of Resurrection,
and who are (even) unaware of
their calls (invocations) to them?
6. And when mankind are gathered (on the Day of
Resurrection), they (false deities)
will become enemies for them
and will deny their worshipping.
7. And when Our Clear Verses are recited to them, the
disbelievers say of the truth (this
Qur'an), when it reaches them:
"This is plain magic!"
8. Or say they: "He (Muhammad ) has fabricated it." Say: "If I have fabricated it, still you have
no power to support me against
Allah. He knows best of what
you say among yourselves
concerning it (i.e. this Qur'an)!
Sufficient is He for a witness between me and you! And He is
the Oft-Forgiving, the Most
Merciful."
9. Say (O Muhammad ):"I am not a new thing among the
Messengers (of Allah) (i.e. I am
not the first Messenger) nor do I
know what will be done with me
or with you. I only follow that
which is revealed to me, and I am but a plain warner."
10. Say: "Tell me! If this (Qur'an) is from Allah, and you deny it,
and a witness from among the
Children of Israel ('Abdullah bin
Salam/any Jew ) testifies that this Qur'an is
from Allah [like the Taurat
(Torah)], so he believed (embraced Islam) while you are
too proud (to believe)." Verily!
Allah guides not the people who
are Zalimun (oppressors on themselves, polytheists,
disbelievers and wrong-doing).

Islam has an unforgivable sin in it's theology?

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Islam has an unforgivable sin in it's theology?

yes, its called 'shirk' in arabic. Associating anyone/anything in worship with God.
Ofcourse its forgiveable till the person is alive and repents sincerely but should not die with shirk.

reply to post by logical7


I have already denied the Holy Spirit of the Judaic faith. Either way, I've burned my bridges and scattered the ashes. Oh well.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by logical7

 

I have already denied the Holy Spirit of the Judaic faith. Either way, I've burned my bridges and scattered the ashes. Oh well.

25:
43. Have you (O Muhammad ) seen him who has taken as his ilah
(god) his own desire? Would you then
be a Wakil (a disposer of his affairs or
a watcher) over him?
44. Or do you think that most of them hear or understand? They are only like
cattle; nay, they are even farther astray
from the Path. (i.e. even worst than
cattle).

when a person is a slave of desires and denies God, then he/she lives with cognitive dissonance and that diminishes sentinence and slowly the only way to make peace is go on auto-pilot/confirmity just like cattles. Maybe even worst than cattles as they at least can get herded by a shepherd.

reply to post by logical7

when a person is a slave of desires and denies God, then he/she lives with cognitive dissonance and that diminishes sentinence and slowly the only way to make peace is go on auto-pilot/confirmity just like cattles. Maybe even worst than cattles as they at least can get herded by a shepherd.

I am not a slave - that's the point. I embrace my freedom to the point that I am my own shepherd. I require no god, desire no god, seek no god for my happiness. I am the progenitor of my fortune, and I am the architect of my destiny.

In modern psychology, cognitive dissonance is the feeling of discomfort when simultaneously holding two or more conflicting cognitions: ideas, beliefs, values or emotional reactions.

The theory of cognitive dissonance in social psychology proposes that people have a motivational drive to reduce dissonance by altering existing cognitions, adding new ones to create a consistent belief system, or alternatively by reducing the importance of any one of the dissonant elements. It is the distressing mental state that people feel when they "find themselves doing things that don't fit with what they know, or having opinions that do not fit with other opinions they hold." A key assumption is that people want their expectations to meet reality, creating a sense of equilibrium. Likewise, another assumption is that a person will avoid situations or information sources that give rise to feelings of uneasiness, or dissonance.

Cognitive dissonance theory explains human behavior by positing that people have a bias to seek consonance between their expectations and reality. According to Festinger, people engage in a process he termed "dissonance reduction", which can be achieved in one of three ways: lowering the importance of one of the discordant factors, adding consonant elements, or changing one of the dissonant factors. This bias sheds light on otherwise puzzling, irrational, and even destructive behavior.

In accordance with what I posted above that excerpt from the Wikipedia article concerning cognitive dissonance, explain to me how I portray symptoms or lead you to believe that I might be referred to as having or experiencing such a condition.

Originally posted by logical7

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
Islam has an unforgivable sin in it's theology?

yes, its called 'shirk' in arabic. Associating anyone/anything in worship with God.
Ofcourse its forgiveable till the person is alive and repents sincerely but should not die with shirk.

Alright then, thanks.

You should note that so the common member doesn't think you're talking about the unforgivable sin Jesus spoke of.

reply to post by NOTurTypical


What sin would that be?

Originally posted by logical7

when a person believes in a God, then he/she lives with cognitive dissonance and that diminishes sentinence and slowly the only way to make peace is go on auto-pilot/confirmity just like cattles. Maybe even worst than cattles as they at least can get herded by a shepherd.

#

Fixed.....

Originally posted by logical7

when a person is a slave of desires and denies God,

The desire is a part of a person. It is what gives us our preferences/personality. To reject our personality/preferences to be under the command of another being is slavery because one's will is denied and put under another's....

When one is able to do one's will, to whom are they a slave? Themselves in their own personality?

Slavery involves TWO...

I don't know, the only unforgivable sin I see in most people - is being unforgiving.

Peace,
Cirque

reply to post by AfterInfinity

In accordance with what I posted above that excerpt from the Wikipedia article concerning cognitive dissonance, explain to me how I portray symptoms or lead you to believe that I might be referred to as having or experiencing such a condition.

sure, here's what you said
"I am not a slave - that's the point. I
embrace my freedom to the point that
I am my own shepherd. I require no
god, desire no god, seek no god for
my happiness. I am the progenitor of
my fortune, and I am the architect of my destiny."
is what you say a fact or a belief to reduce dissonance?
Do things always happen the way you want? is your destiny in your control? How you react to unpleasant and unexpected events? If the dollar falls to zero in value when you wake up next morning, how will it affect your plan?

Surah 18
32. And put forward to them the example of two men; unto one of
them We had given two gardens of
grapes, and We had surrounded both
with date-palms; and had put between
them green crops (cultivated fields
etc.).
33. Each of those two gardens brought forth its produce, and failed
not in the least therein, and We caused
a river to gush forth in the midst of
them.
34. And he had property (or fruit) and he said to his companion, in the
course of mutual talk: I am more than
you in wealth and stronger in respect
of men."
35. And he went into his garden while in a state (of pride and disbelief)
unjust to himself. He said: "I think not
that this will ever perish.
36. "And I think not the Hour will ever come, and if indeed I am brought back
to my Lord, (on the Day of
Resurrection), I surely shall find better
than this when I return to Him."
37. His companion said to him, during the talk with him: "Do you disbelieve in
Him Who created you out of dust (i.e.
your father Adam), then out of Nutfah
(mixed semen drops of male and
female discharge), then fashioned you
into a man?
38. "But as for my part (I believe) that He is Allah, my Lord and none shall I
associate as partner with my Lord.
39. It was better for you to say, when you entered your garden: 'That which
Allah wills (will come to pass)! There is
no power but with Allah '. If you see
me less than you in wealth, and
children. 40. "It may be that my Lord will give me something better than your
garden, and will send on it Husban
(torment, bolt, etc.) from the sky, then
it will be a slippery earth. 41. "Or the water thereof (of the gardens) becomes deep-sunken
(underground) so that you will never
be able to seek it."
42. So his fruits were encircled (with ruin). And he remained clapping his
hands with sorrow over what he had
spent upon it, while it was all
destroyed on its trellises, he could only
say: "Would I had ascribed no
partners to my Lord!"
43. And he had no group of men to help him against Allah, nor could he
defend or save himself.
44. There (on the Day of Resurrection), Al-Walayah (the protection, power,
authority and kingdom) will be for
Allah (Alone), the True God. He (Allah)
is the Best for reward and the Best for
the final end. (La ilaha ill-Allah none
has the right to be worshipped but Allah).
45. And put forward to them the example of the life of this world, it is
like the water (rain) which We send
down from the sky, and the
vegetation of the earth mingles with it,
and becomes fresh and green. But
(later) it becomes dry and broken pieces, which the winds scatter. And
Allah is Able to do everything.

AI, if you believe you are in control all the time, you will be reminded by events in your lifetime that you are not! Its a mercy from God to bring people back.

surah 43
33. And were it not that all mankind would have become of
one community (all disbelievers,
desiring worldly life only), We
would have provided for those
who disbelieve in the Most
Beneficent (Allah), silver roofs for their houses, and elevators
(and stair-ways, etc. of silver)
whereby they ascend,
34. And for their houses, doors (of silver), and thrones (of silver)
on which they could recline,
35. And adornments of gold. Yet all this (i.e. the roofs, doors,
stairs, elevators, thrones etc. of
their houses) would have been
nothing but an enjoyment of this
world. And the Hereafter with
your Lord is only for the Muttaqun(pious/righteous).
36. And whosoever turns away (blinds himself) from the
remembrance of the Most
Beneficent (Allah) (i.e. this
Qur'an and worship of Allah), We
appoint for him Shaitan (Satan -
devil) to be a Qarin (an intimate companion) to him.
37. And verily, they (Satans / devils) hinder them from the
Path (of Allah), but they think
that they are guided aright!
38. Till, when (such a one) comes to Us, he says [to his Qarin
(Satan / devil companion)]
"Would that between me and
you were the distance of the two
easts (or the east and west)" a
worst (type of) companion (indeed)!
39. It will profit you not this Day (O you who turn away from
Allah's remembrance and His
worship, etc.) as you did wrong,
(and) that you will be sharers
(you and your Qarin) in the
punishment.
40. Can you (O Muhammad ) make the deaf to hear, or can
you guide the blind or him who
is in manifest error?
41. And even if We take you (O Muhammad ) away, We shall indeed take vengeance on them.
42. Or (if) We show you that wherewith We threaten them,
then verily, We have perfect
command over them.
43. So hold you (O Muhammad ) fast to that which is inspired in you. Verily, you are
on a Straight Path.
44. And verily, this (the Qur'an) is indeed a Reminder for you (O Muhammad ) and your people (Quraish people, or your
followers), and you will be
questioned (about it).

Originally posted by logical7

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by logical7

 

I have already denied the Holy Spirit of the Judaic faith. Either way, I've burned my bridges and scattered the ashes. Oh well.

25:
43. Have you (O Muhammad ) seen him who has taken as his ilah
(god) his own desire? Would you then
be a Wakil (a disposer of his affairs or
a watcher) over him?
44. Or do you think that most of them hear or understand? They are only like
cattle; nay, they are even farther astray
from the Path. (i.e. even worst than
cattle).

when a person is a slave of desires and denies God, then he/she lives with cognitive dissonance and that diminishes sentinence and slowly the only way to make peace is go on auto-pilot/confirmity just like cattles. Maybe even worst than cattles as they at least can get herded by a shepherd.

I am sorry but if you put god/Allah as a bully who treats me bad, if I do not say exact the right word or wear the right robes or believe in a specific view of god based on what humans have written on spiritual experiances then I will in fact be against god since I would not respect god at all.

But if god give me a experiance that it wants to have an symbiotic loving experiance where we help each other and do things to make this place better and that we take responsability for what we create then I will do anything that follows higher ideal and sacrifice everything I have but my soul.

Please do not tell people that your religion is the only way. You could not be more wrong. God knows how to find the souls that is needed to be activated and that need is both from soul to god, god to soul. God pushes Light thru Blessed ONES->Synchronicity increases 11:11 phenomena->Conciousness increase and more Blessed ONES are activated thru En-Light-Ment. God does not make mistakes. It knows where it has put the souls and when it should say hi. When the student is ready the master appears.

Originally posted by CirqueDeTruth
I don't know, the only unforgivable sin I see in most people - is being unforgiving.

Peace,
Cirque

yes.

24:22. And let not those among you who are blessed with graces and
wealth swear not to give (any
sort of help) to their kinsmen, Al-
Masakin (the poor), and those
who left their homes for Allah's
Cause. Let them pardon and forgive. Do you not love that
Allah should forgive you? And
Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most
Merciful.

Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by logical7

when a person is a slave of desires and denies God,

The desire is a part of a person. It is what gives us our preferences/personality. To reject our personality/preferences to be under the command of another being is slavery because one's will is denied and put under another's....

When one is able to do one's will, to whom are they a slave? Themselves in their own personality?

Slavery involves TWO...

not true!!, a drug addict is a slave of his addiction/desire.
A liar is a slave of his desire to be comfortable and take shortcuts.
A student who cheats is a slave to the desire to pass.
Letting desires run amok is a sure way to do every wrong that can be done.

reply to post by LittleByLittle

Please do not tell people that your religion is the only way. You could not be more wrong. God knows how to find the souls that is needed to be activated

i never said that,
in Islamic teachings there are 3 types of 'guidance'
1) guidance/nature of all living beings, to seek food etc, a spider knowing how to spin a web etc
2)guidance by revealation/holy books
3) one on one Guidance from God directly to a person(enlightenment)

but once there is 3 then there is also a need to at least know the do's and dont's to live a life and that is where Qur'an comes in to help, take what makes sense and follow it.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

What sin would that be?

Blasphemy of the Holy Spirit. In the Bible account the Pharisees had just witnessed Jesus performing miracles that only God could perform and they attributed them to Beelzebub and not God.

Originally posted by CirqueDeTruth
I don't know, the only unforgivable sin I see in most people - is being unforgiving.

Peace,
Cirque

Well, being unforgiving is a sin but it's certainly not unforgivable. If that were the case no one could be saved.

Originally posted by logical7

Originally posted by arpgme

Originally posted by logical7

when a person is a slave of desires and denies God,

The desire is a part of a person. It is what gives us our preferences/personality. To reject our personality/preferences to be under the command of another being is slavery because one's will is denied and put under another's....

When one is able to do one's will, to whom are they a slave? Themselves in their own personality?

Slavery involves TWO...

not true!!, a drug addict is a slave of his addiction/desire.
A liar is a slave of his desire to be comfortable and take shortcuts.
A student who cheats is a slave to the desire to pass.
Letting desires run amok is a sure way to do every wrong that can be done.

actually drug addiction is a disease.

reply to post by logical7

is what you say a fact or a belief to reduce dissonance?

I could ask you the very same thing. I believe my kind of faith is more of a constructive realism, something everyone seems to be ignoring in their disastrous quest for the perfect illusion. We're so close to being able to recreate reality. What if they've developed a drug chemically tailored to induce a mass hallucination? What if they give us exactly what we want? Will we betray our nature for a dream of what we think we should be? Should we ignore what we've always fought for and surrender to the loss of freedom? These are the questions you must ask yourself. Instead of asking how you can serve, you should ask yourself, "What's the price?" Before you sell your soul, consider every angle. I don't think you have. And you think you know what you want, but you don't. You don't know what you're asking for.

I think I have much more reason to hold my beliefs than you have to hold yours. Prove me wrong. Show me what I'm missing here.

Do things always happen the way you want? is your destiny in your control? How you react to unpleasant and unexpected events? If the dollar falls to zero in value when you wake up next morning, how will it affect your plan?

“Life is 10% what happens to you and 90% how you react to it”

Charles R. Swindoll, American Writer and Clergyman

Have you ever heard of the Law of Attraction? It's not some spell or magic trick like everyone says...it's just a psychological trick. Focus on anything with enough energy, and everything you do will be directed toward that purpose. When you believe something has already happened, your mind will program itself to fulfill that. When you believe in an idea strongly enough, you live it. Your interactions with the world will reflect that idea, and you will steer yourself towards that goal. You feel, you think, you act, you succeed. We create our reality through that process. Or you lose focus, you slow down, and you fail. There's a very special formula for success, but a great deal of it is your commitment. But that's where it gets interesting.

You are committed to an idea, not indebted to a god. That's the magic. You believe in becoming this idea, you believe in enacting it, and you believe you can do it. And if you take inspiration from the idea of what a particular deity stood for, that's wonderful. You focus on the idea and not the form, the physicality. True ideals are never physical, only seen after they are translated into various mediums. The secret of the Holy Trinity is that you take power from within yourself, focus on the idea you want to be, and enact it. Holy Spirit, The Father, and the Son. Will power, though, and manifestation of the thought.

“Power, true power, comes from within. Not without."

― Sherrilyn Kenyon, Infinity

Indeed.

AI, if you believe you are in control all the time, you will be reminded by events in your lifetime that you are not! Its a mercy from God to bring people back.

Part of having control is sharing it with others.