Protestant disinfo debunked-Catholics are also Christians

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

You have a serious problem with the Hebrew of Micah 5:2

No, I don't.
Maybe you have a serious problem by saying LXX without realizing that is the abbreviation for the Septuagint, which was written in Greek.
I quoted the Greek, like you would have been asking if you knew what you were talking about.

I know precisely what the LXX is. It was formulated around 270-285 BC from 70 of the best Hebrew scholars of the day. The LXX, also used a word explicitly stating what the Hebrew original states. That His origin was from eternity. Meaning before time was created the Son existed.

He was never created, He is the Creator of all ever created.

reply to post by adjensen


Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

Originally posted by jmdewey60
reply to post by NOTurTypical

 

Jesus said He shared glory with the Father before the world existed.

"And now, O Father, glorify thou me with thine own self with the glory which I had with thee before the world was."

John 17:5

That does not support your claim that I was asking scripture for:

The pre-existent, eternal Son of God took on flesh at the incarnation, He always existed with the Father in glory before the foundation of the world.

Where is the verse for "eternal Son", and where is the verse for "He always existed"?
I agree with part, which is the person who became Jesus existed before that, because Jesus claims that and Paul supports it in Philippians 2.
Where is the verse that says that Jesus "always existed?
If you say, John 1, then I don't accept that because it is talking about the Logos, which it says right at the beginning is God.
Now people argue that John is saying that it is Jesus, but it doesn't say that.

Huh? Why do you THINK people argue that? The context and subject of that portion of scripture is about Jesus. He is the Logos, it's a title.

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by adjensen

 

Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

No. He didn't say that, and furthermore did Jesus not say that no one had ever seen the Father?

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by adjensen

 

Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

No. He didn't say that, and furthermore did Jesus not say that no one had ever seen the Father?

If that is the case, he would be agreeing with me, but he isn't.

reply to post by truejew


Did Jesus state that no man had ever seen the Father?

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by adjensen

 

Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

No, he did not.

Do you seriously just not understand the Doctrine of the Trinity? Trying to discredit something by misrepresenting what it is or what it teaches is lying -- what "fruits of the spirit" do you show by lying?

Disprove the Trinity by disproving the Doctrine, not by lying about what it says.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by adjensen

 

Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

No, he did not.

Do you seriously just not understand the Doctrine of the Trinity? Trying to discredit something by misrepresenting what it is or what it teaches is lying -- what "fruits of the spirit" do you show by lying?

Disprove the Trinity by disproving the Doctrine, not by lying about what it says.

Good luck. I've tried to explain numerous times that he isn't criticizing the actual doctrine but a straw man of the doctrine.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by truejew

 

Did Jesus state that no man had ever seen the Father?

Yes, He did. That is another reason why Adjensen's belief that Stephen saw two gods is incorrect.

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by adjensen

 

Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

No, he did not.

Do you seriously just not understand the Doctrine of the Trinity? Trying to discredit something by misrepresenting what it is or what it teaches is lying -- what "fruits of the spirit" do you show by lying?

Disprove the Trinity by disproving the Doctrine, not by lying about what it says.

I understand what the doctrine is. I also understand that you are in denial about them being three gods.

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by truejew

 

Did Jesus state that no man had ever seen the Father?

Yes, He did. That is another reason why Adjensen's belief that Stephen saw two gods is incorrect.

That isn't what I said, stop lying.

Technically, a) Jesus said that before Stephen's vision and b) Stephen saw a manifestation of God, so there's no way to say what he saw and c) agreeing that Jesus claimed no one had seen the Father kind of torpedoes your theology, since you claim that Jesus WAS the Father.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by adjensen

 

Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

No, he did not.

Do you seriously just not understand the Doctrine of the Trinity? Trying to discredit something by misrepresenting what it is or what it teaches is lying -- what "fruits of the spirit" do you show by lying?

Disprove the Trinity by disproving the Doctrine, not by lying about what it says.

Good luck. I've tried to explain numerous times that he isn't criticizing the actual doctrine but a straw man of the doctrine.

Sorry... I don't drink the three gods is only one god kool-aid.

Originally posted by adjensen

That isn't what I said, stop lying.

I am not lying. You are the one saying Stephen saw two gods.

Originally posted by adjensen

agreeing that Jesus claimed no one had seen the Father kind of torpedoes your theology, since you claim that Jesus WAS the Father.

Incorrect. I do not claim that the flesh of Jesus is the Father. The flesh is the visible image of the invisible God.

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by truejew
reply to post by adjensen

 

Then you are saying that Stephen saw two gods.

No, he did not.

Do you seriously just not understand the Doctrine of the Trinity? Trying to discredit something by misrepresenting what it is or what it teaches is lying -- what "fruits of the spirit" do you show by lying?

Disprove the Trinity by disproving the Doctrine, not by lying about what it says.

Good luck. I've tried to explain numerous times that he isn't criticizing the actual doctrine but a straw man of the doctrine.

Sorry... I don't drink the three gods is only one god kool-aid.

We that's something we have in common then because neither do we.

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by truejew

 

Did Jesus state that no man had ever seen the Father?

Yes, He did. That is another reason why Adjensen's belief that Stephen saw two gods is incorrect.

Actually you have a massive problem with Genesis 18. Either Abraham saw and ate with the Son of God, and not the Father, or Jesus told a lie.

I reject the second option.

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by adjensen

That isn't what I said, stop lying.

I am not lying. You are the one saying Stephen saw two gods.

Show me where I said that, or admit that you're lying.

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by truejew

 

Did Jesus state that no man had ever seen the Father?

Yes, He did. That is another reason why Adjensen's belief that Stephen saw two gods is incorrect.

Actually you have a massive problem with Genesis 18. Either Abraham saw and ate with the Son of God, and not the Father, or Jesus told a lie.

I reject the second option.

I am not seeing this "massive problem" with Genesis 18... Perhaps if you gave more info?

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by adjensen

That isn't what I said, stop lying.

I am not lying. You are the one saying Stephen saw two gods.

Show me where I said that, or admit that you're lying.

In this case... Separate entities equal separate gods.

Stephen is having a vision, a vision of the manifestation of the Father, and the Son as a separate entity

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by NOTurTypical
reply to post by truejew

 

Did Jesus state that no man had ever seen the Father?

Yes, He did. That is another reason why Adjensen's belief that Stephen saw two gods is incorrect.

Actually you have a massive problem with Genesis 18. Either Abraham saw and ate with the Son of God, and not the Father, or Jesus told a lie.

I reject the second option.

I am not seeing this "massive problem" with Genesis 18... Perhaps if you gave more info?

You don't see a contradiction with Jesus claiming no man had ever seen the Father, yet in Genesis chapter 18 both Abraham and Sarah converse and commune with the LORD? If Jesus was truthful, God in Genesis 18 could not have been the Father. If God in Genesis 18 was the Father, that would make Jesus's statement that no man had ever seen the Father a lie.

I propose that Jesus is not a liar, and the Lord God Abraham saw, coversed with and ate meal with was God the Son, pre-incarnate appearance of Jesus Christ.

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by adjensen

Originally posted by truejew

Originally posted by adjensen

That isn't what I said, stop lying.

I am not lying. You are the one saying Stephen saw two gods.

Show me where I said that, or admit that you're lying.

In this case... Separate entities equal separate gods.

By the theology that I subscribe to, no it does not, and the fact that you do not subscribe to that theology changes nothing. I did not say that Stephen saw two gods, so you are lying.