The Day of the Cross.

What does it tell us about OUR place in the grand scheme of things..?

That's the question that comes to my mind when looking at this and making an honest inquiry as to it's meaning and significance at all levels.

Talk about upLIFTING!

Originally posted by Murgatroid

Originally posted by jiggerj
Why do you say this when you are shown historical facts?

WHAT historical facts?

There isn't even a SHRED of evidence that supports this.

Are you so easily convinced by frauds like Acharya?

Admittedly, I wasn't really focused on the deaths of these gods, but rather the historical fact that people worshiped gods before the Jesus story. Whatever miracles attributed to these gods during their time, the people believed it and would not accept any logic that these gods didn't exist. Were some of these gods reported to have died in violent, memorable ways with the purpose being of a great sacrifice for mankind? Without even reading them I can say, Of course they were; it would be a pretty boring piece of fiction if they all lived to a ripe old age where they would be seen as weak and feeble, constipated and senile.

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

What that really means and signifies is then the purpose of this thread and as a strong atheist indeed that meaning and significance might very well elude you.. I can understand how that might happen, that you might be confused about the meaning of the thread, but don't you see how funny that is?

Actually, I do!

Originally posted by jiggerj

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

What that really means and signifies is then the purpose of this thread and as a strong atheist indeed that meaning and significance might very well elude you.. I can understand how that might happen, that you might be confused about the meaning of the thread, but don't you see how funny that is?

Actually, I do!

Precisely, because to you it IS meaningless, whereas to the faithful and those who "grok" it, it is the very power and the love and light of God in action (made known, made manifest) as Grace, presented as a loving invitation offered freely and therefore unconditionally, yet urgently and passionately.

I'm not entirely sure you appreciate the full magnitude of the irony here though Pops, because you can't as a an atheist. You're not allowed to. You can't "go there" (does it mean or signify anything of value?). You are not permitted the inkling..

This whole inquiry, from an atheists perspective is "out of bounds"..lol

My laughter in Christ (as a result of his Great Work) goes on and on because it's not silenced by the trials and tribulations and the indignities of the injustices and "vicissitudes" of life lol, while making no compromises whatsoever with that which is truly meaningless and without value (absurd) so while it's at my own expense in so many ways I am rewarded with something infinitely better, and truer to my truest self and there comes the humor again.. lol

It's a great joke at the expense of all our prior ignorance you see Pops, that is shared between us and God in a "safe" environment (where we don't get ripped to pieces). This is what Jesus has created and generated for us, like a domain of limitless love and freedom and new possibility (in forgiveness) including that of life to life everlasting (the love never dies) and thus sufficient to allow us to recover the lost inner child and attain ever increasing peace, joy, love, happiness and all the fruits of the spirit as the good life (spiritual life) as it was meant to be lived, even intended from the very beginning and perhaps vaguely remembered as a passing glimpse from childhood.

It's a real marvel let me tell you Pops you have no idea, or maybe, maybe you DO, and that is the reason you love the Theology and Faith forums more than any other, because of your love of and search for God, however rancorous or conflicted it may have been up until now i.e.: angry with God for mosquitoes, etc.

I pray that you'll come to recognize it's supreme value (the love of God personified and a Great Work or High Art rendered) and in so doing receive and open the precious gift that is the very love of God itself, for you, his son and Brother of the Lord Jesus Christ himself who is your elder brother and his father your Pops. lol

And if what I've evaluated is right, then it's just as efficacious whether you believe it or not (lol), but as an inquiry, that it actually makes sense and is comprehensible enough to confound any unreasonable objective to it - is what makes it funny and hilarious don't you think? So the REAL joke, as the very truth at the heart of it all, is irresistible and therefore something that contains within itself the very germination seed of a whole new creation, but without having to wait 100 trillion years for the next Big Bang i.e.: starting now, as a place in the heart a place in the soul.

Atheist: Yawn..

lol:


Best Regards,


NAM

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Originally posted by jiggerj

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

What that really means and signifies is then the purpose of this thread and as a strong atheist indeed that meaning and significance might very well elude you.. I can understand how that might happen, that you might be confused about the meaning of the thread, but don't you see how funny that is?

Actually, I do!

Precisely, because to you it IS meaningless, whereas to the faithful and those who "grok" it,

I think you misinterpreted my statement of Actually, I do!

When you people speak of such things I imagine that I am walking into a roomful of young teens deliberately talking nonsense that I, or any other rational being, can't possibly understand: "Tree say ahhh." "Gobble lake bah."

So, yes, I do see the irony, but not the way you see it.

reply to post by jiggerj

As a self labelled "atheist" you're not allowed or permitted to even begin to grasp it's true meaning and significance, so it presents to you as nonsense and you can't for the life of you even begin to make the inquiry as to what it might mean or signify because to you it's off limits and out of bounds.

I'm a rational being however, and the root of logos is logic, and Jesus (in the flesh) was a rational being also who understood the world and the human condition perhaps more than any other human being in history, but he spoke and taught in parables which probably don't make any sense to you either.

I tell you Pops that there's yet another even greater joke and humor awaiting you on the other side of you incredulousness and scepticism if only you'd open your mind and heart to the possibility that there might be something that you've missed, something in a blind spot that you were not permitted to see and recognize.

That was pretty funny though about the nonsense that you perceive it as - sounded almost like Ferengi..

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
I find the shrill protestations rather amuzing. To find out that they're not even factual makes it even funnier.

I will respond to your last reply to me by responding to this one. Maybe you have supported other parts of the bible as being factual. I just haven't seen it or remember you doing so. What I am aware of is how much support you have for the story of Jesus, more than any other story in the bible. So, how would you make sense of this? Are there parts of the bible you don't believe in? Of course there are, and here's a short clip to point out just how irrelevant and illogical the bible is when taken at full face value. This means that if you have decided that one part is unbelievable, illogical, and irrational then the validity of the whole bible must be called into question.

So, when you hear others talking about those parts of the bible that you don't take seriously, they would be able to say to you what you have said to me: Since you aren't a true believer, our logic is not available to you.

Very short clip. Enjoy.

reply to post by jiggerj

So if it doesn't make any sense to you (the meaning of the cross) you attempt to attack it's voracity as a historical fact, by suggesting that if any other part of the Bible is inconsistent, that the whole thing must be thrown out and discarded? Nice try.

Edit to add: Did you actually read and absorb everything that was presented on page one of this thread..?

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by jiggerj

 

So if it doesn't make any sense to you (the meaning of the cross) you attempt to attack it's voracity as a historical fact, by suggesting that if any other part of the Bible is inconsistent, that the whole thing must be thrown out and discarded? Nice try.

Edit to add: Did you actually read and absurd everything that was presented on page one of this thread..?

edit on 1-4-2013 by NewAgeMan because: edit

NAM, I have been very patient with you, hoping you'd see that I'm not attacking you in any way. I offer my ideas and opinions, and you're supposed to you offer your ideas and opinions (that is a conversation). Yet, you persist in pointing your finger at me and not at the subject within my replies. This is very childish, and I'm done.

I hate to say that all religious people seem to have this flaw, but it sure seems that way. Hope you find a bunch of people that agree with you on everything. Won't that be fun!

Peace

reply to post by jiggerj

With this thread I'm inviting everyone to consider that there's a tramission of meaning and significance involved, and I'm asking everyone to consider deeply what it might be, not to make every effort to try to deny it or reduce it somehow which is a copout.

Originally posted by jiggerj

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Originally posted by jiggerj

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

What that really means and signifies is then the purpose of this thread and as a strong atheist indeed that meaning and significance might very well elude you.. I can understand how that might happen, that you might be confused about the meaning of the thread, but don't you see how funny that is?

Actually, I do!

Precisely, because to you it IS meaningless, whereas to the faithful and those who "grok" it,

I think you misinterpreted my statement of Actually, I do!

When you people speak of such things I imagine that I am walking into a roomful of young teens deliberately talking nonsense that I, or any other rational being, can't possibly understand: "Tree say ahhh." "Gobble lake bah."

So, yes, I do see the irony, but not the way you see it.

Translations

"Tree, say ahhh."

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
What I see rendered there is the Love of God as Spirit blowing like the wind through the divided middle and the twin pillars of the height of Justice and Mercy, or in other words the Tree of Life itself.

Kabbalah Tree of Life



"Gobble lake (ocean) bah."

The Fully Informed Eternal Godhead
Brilliant Disguise: Light, Matter and the Zero-Point Field


"Tri theta vine, ahhh!"

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by lonewolf19792000

 

Re: Man's evolved relation to the eternal, cosmological Godhead

Jesus Christ is the Phi Ratio Son of God

The Golden Proportion is analogous to God’s relationship to creation

The Golden Section, or Phi, found throughout nature, also applies in understanding the relationship of God to Creation. In the golden section, we see that there is only one way to divide a line so that its parts are in proportion to, or in the image of, the whole:

The ratio of the larger section (B) to the whole line (A) is the same as the ratio as the smaller section (C) to the large section (B):

Only “tri-viding” the whole preserves the relationship to the whole
And so it is with our understanding of God, that we are created in His image. Not by dividing the whole, but only by tri-viding the whole does each piece retain its unique relationship to the whole. Only here do we see three that are two that are one.

The Book of John begins with these words that capture the essence of this:

In the beginning was the Word,
and the Word was with God,
and the Word was God.

Jesus, in John 14:9, expressed a similar thought:

Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father.


Conclusion:

The human Jesus (the Son of Man) is to the divine Jesus (the Son of God) as the divine Jesus (the Son of God) is to God (the Father or whole).

www.goldennumber.net...

Originally posted by NewAgeMan

Originally posted by tinhattribunal
reply to post by NewAgeMan

 

they study the skys and are well aware of coming astrological events.
when they time these properly with major earthly events, such as the preplanned crucifiction, it gives creedence to their actions

Are you saying that it wasn't Jesus who was controlling the events of the day and who said prior to it in the lead up "my hour has not yet come" but those who crucified him - who planned it to coincide with a lunar eclipse on Preparation Day of the Passover Festival?

Bear in mind that it was a rather unique lunar eclipse in the sense that it rose over the horizon already entering into the eclipse phase mid afternoon, when Jesus was already on the cross.

I don't know... sounds more like a double reverse sting operation on Jesus' part designed to confound his enemies, the only implications of this being that it would mean that Jesus must have been a trained Magus and intimately familiar with all the ancient wisdom teachings including astronomy/astrology. I think this is the case and that furthermore Jesus saw and noticed his life and Great Work written into the very celestial order of the earth, moon, sun, planets and stars of the heavens and that it was HIS timetable and schedule that he was working to, not theirs.

To me it appears to be not only a Great Work but a Great Work of High Art rendered from a first/last cause (from the beginning) including the Human Being as the crowning glory (or an integral aspect of the manifestation) of the Godhead where perhaps it can indeed be said that "the first shall be last and the last (most recent) first"..?

When we further consider the celestial framework as a timetable that Jesus himself was working relative to, the implications are astounding, not merely in regards to Jesus self-realization and fated or sent-calling, but also in terms of our place in God's creation as children of a loving God who made a plan, from the very beginning to reconcile with us and us back to him in and through his son as his very nature, Spirit, and essence (limitless love and compassion where "mercy is the heart of the law").

It must have something to do not only with man's fall and propensity to sin, but also, and perhaps even more significantly just how close man is to the Godhead (right hand).

Which means... that Jesus really was and IS God, but rendered in such a way that it evokes a smile, not chagrin, except maybe to the chagrin of our own egoic nature, relative to something that's capable of both utterly confounding it while being at the same time perfectly reasonable and rational and logical whereby the root of logos is logic.

That Jesus was able to carry out the mission flawlessly, while risking all, is a real marvel, even when we consider what might have gone wrong ie: if Jesus (like us) blew the assignment, or had an accident prior.

If my research has any validity, Jesus also spent over 20 years in training, learning and preparation and when he walked back onto the scene where he was almost assuredly teased unrelentingly as a boy for being a bastard child, he was armed to the teeth in mind, heart, spirit and purposeful design, even a design written in the very order of the cosmos suggesting in no uncertain terms that indeed Jesus was beloved of God from before the very foundation of the world.

And if anyone knew what this thread contains, as a pointer, they would see another piece of the Jesus-puzzle fall into place.

Therefore what does it really mean and signify, directly as an intended transmission of meaningful and symbolic content, and what did Jesus really want us to take away from it, and to "grok" of it?

If he also knew, which he appears to have, that we of ourselves could not do what was needed, and that we basically wouldn't make it, spiritually, then truly it is something that's been done FOR us and on our behalf but also done in such a way whereby Jesus knew that the trail was left and thus the Great Work of Art rendered for our appreciation and contemplation.

"I give my life a ransom for many."

"I have the power to lay it down and then pick it back up again. This command I have received from my father in heaven."

"No greater love is there than that of a man who lays down his life for his friends."

He had no assurance that he would survive the ordeal by a thread, so he was entirely obedient unto death and the very point of death.

Imitating Christ’s Humility

Therefore if you have any encouragement from being united with Christ, if any comfort from his love, if any common sharing in the Spirit, if any tenderness and compassion, then make my joy complete by being like-minded, having the same love, being one in spirit and of one mind. Do nothing out of selfish ambition or vain conceit. Rather, in humility value others above yourselves, not looking to your own interests but each of you to the interests of the others.

In your relationships with one another, have the same mindset as Christ Jesus:

Who, being in very nature God,
did not consider equality with God something to be used to his own advantage;
ather, he made himself nothing
by taking the very nature of a servant,
being made in human likeness.
And being found in appearance as a man,
he humbled himself
by becoming obedient to the point of death
even death on a cross!
Therefore God exalted him to the highest place
and gave him the name that is above every name,
that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow,
in heaven and on earth and under the earth,
and every tongue acknowledge that Jesus Christ is Lord,
to the glory of God the Father.

Pope Francis knows what he's doing, you see, but nothing, absolutely nothing we can do and no action we can take compares to what has been done in our midst by he whose name (person) is raised high.

And let us bear in mind too that the fully informed Spirit never really changes, only gobbles up all information as it goes. "Gobble ocean bah." LOL

But to see it become MANIFEST through the living historical person of Jesus Christ to see it made known and represented, just 2000 years ago (and at just the right time to still require a certain degree of faith about it even if only as need be the side of tiny mustard seed) is a real marvel!

And as this thread shows, it cannot be uprooted either, and contains embedded within itself it's own reason, logic, and boundless love, and genius, unbelievable genius, to the nth degree, and what power, yet presented in the form of apparent weakness! My oh my Jesus you really did it!

..no more words..

Earth-Moon-Sun Cosmological Configuration by Superintelligent Design

Son of man son of God as the reflected light of life - view whole page (page 19) from that post down re: Moon Earth Sun configuration as intended allegory (symbolic representation).

Happy Easter! / Happy Resurrection Day!

On the Road to Emmaus

13 Now that same day two of them were going to a village called Emmaus, about seven miles[a] from Jerusalem. 14 They were talking with each other about everything that had happened. 15 As they talked and discussed these things with each other, Jesus himself came up and walked along with them; 16 but they were kept from recognizing him.

17 He asked them, “What are you discussing together as you walk along?”

They stood still, their faces downcast. 18 One of them, named Cleopas, asked him, “Are you the only one visiting Jerusalem who does not know the things that have happened there in these days?”

19 “What things?” he asked.

“About Jesus of Nazareth,” they replied. “He was a prophet, powerful in word and deed before God and all the people. 20 The chief priests and our rulers handed him over to be sentenced to death, and they crucified him; 21 but we had hoped that he was the one who was going to redeem Israel. And what is more, it is the third day since all this took place. 22 In addition, some of our women amazed us. They went to the tomb early this morning 23 but didn’t find his body. They came and told us that they had seen a vision of angels, who said he was alive. 24 Then some of our companions went to the tomb and found it just as the women had said, but they did not see Jesus.”

25 He said to them, “How foolish you are, and how slow to believe all that the prophets have spoken! 26 Did not the Messiah have to suffer these things and then enter his glory?” 27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.

28 As they approached the village to which they were going, Jesus continued on as if he were going farther. 29 But they urged him strongly, “Stay with us, for it is nearly evening; the day is almost over.” So he went in to stay with them.

30 When he was at the table with them, he took bread, gave thanks, broke it and began to give it to them. 31 Then their eyes were opened and they recognized him, and he disappeared from their sight. 32 They asked each other, “Were not our hearts burning within us while he talked with us on the road and opened the Scriptures to us?”

33 They got up and returned at once to Jerusalem. There they found the Eleven and those with them, assembled together 34 and saying, “It is true! The Lord has risen and has appeared to Simon.” 35 Then the two told what had happened on the way, and how Jesus was recognized by them when he broke the bread.

~ Luke 23-24

So the question then becomes not merely one of how Jesus could be the crowning glory of the manifestation of the Godhead and with humility filled with the Spirit without measure i.e.: the son of God, but what is it about the human being as a phenomenon intrinsic to the entire evolutionary process that the son of God, that the son of God has appeared in the form of a human being or son of man. The implications of this are truly astounding, especially when we are presented with all the same clues embedded into the very blueprint of creation by a Creative Agency for our own recognition or the Godhead speaking to us through the earth, moon, sun, planets and the starry skies, and not only that but providing us with the evidence that he passed through the scene, in the form of his son who filled quite literally to a t a fated destiny or a sent calling. Extraordinary! Magnificent, pick your word. It takes my breath away as to the implications in terms of what it might actually signify and represent.

What I'm then suggesting here in this thread is that we have a transmission in and through Jesus from the Godhead as fully informed Spirit, directed to us, like a multi-faceted diamond of potential meaning and significance for the human being as an evolutionary phenomenon intended to realize God consciousness but only in the most appropriate way as mediated through Jesus as a model, where in a non-local, holographic universe events in time, once they've happened could just as easily have happened yesterday as approx 2000 years ago.

It's relevant in other words where meaning and context is decisive. Therefore, the more we're able to discern it's meaning and significance and it's application to ourselves in an integral and evolving manner, the better able we will be to correctly discern our true place in the creation and one with a value assigned to us by God in Jesus, of incalculable measure. Now that's really something, and it wasn't of our doing that's fur sure, so we're invited to laugh at ourselves while entering into a whole new and FRESH domain of new possibility for us and for our fellow man or for the human being in history as our destiny where Jesus faith and sent-calling IS tied and is applicable directly to us, speaking to us as symbolic meaning, which if it means anything at all means by extension everything.

So life is not absurd and meaningless, and Jesus really is life itself.

What a wonder and a marvel - shaking head in awe.

reply to post by jiggerj


I don't think you're attacking me personally.

I'm just saying that if you accept Jesus' Passion as they call it and willing sacrifice as historical fact, what if anything does it mean and signify, that's all.

If it's meaningless to you, or if you don't accept it as historical fact, by all means feel free, but that's not the only side to it, setting aside all religious bias for or against. As a real event, what does it mean and if it's meaningless, in your view, tell us why.

I also humbly ask that you also listen to your own spirit and intuition as to whether there might not be something to it after all, something important, something meaningful or significant, imparted, or not.. (which would seem rather intentionally blind to me, but to each his own).

Best Regards, (sincerely),

NAM

Jesus' Magnum Opus

Mods I really have to add the following posts I made in another thread because the context is directly applicable to what I wish to convey in this thread, about the very nature of the Triumph performed in our midst, for the sake of everything that's worthwhile in life, and in the the life to come as the eternal domain of the forever rising sun and even the midnight sun that never sets.. so please, for the love of God, allow me to quote a bit without infraction, just this once, just to get the info presented here in it's relevant context, to allow people to "get" or really "grok" the bigger picture.. Thanks.

It's the kind of stuff that actually makes perfect sense when you think it all the way through but that you'll never hear in Church on Sunday! Maybe some day, hey anything's possible.

from the thread

Is Christ's Resurrection Important to you (Theists)?

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
reply to post by SaturnFX

 

I'm a follower of Christ and a lover of Jesus and I think that he was simply obedient unto the point of death but by the grace of God and with the help of some friends like Joseph of Arimathea, Nicodemus and even Pontias Pilate, made it through the ordeal by a mere thread and completed the ritual, to exit the tomb (with wounds on the mend) three days later ie: that he did not come back to life having died as dead as a doornail, as evidenced by his use of disguise, hunger for food, etc. (See Road of Emmaus story for more), but instead, actually survived the ordeal but by a mere thread. ("it is easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than it is for a rich man to enter the kingdom of God.")

It's even BETTER this version of the story, with him entering into a glorified life of heaven on earth than "beamed straight up", imho.

Edit: Additional Info

On the Road to Emmaus

13 Now that same day two of them were going to a village called Emmaus, about seven miles[a] from Jerusalem. 14 They were talking with each other about everything that had happened. 15 As they talked and discussed these things with each other, Jesus himself came up and walked along with them; 16 but they were kept from recognizing him.

17 He asked them, “What are you discussing together as you walk along?”

They stood still, their faces downcast. 18 One of them, named Cleopas, asked him, “Are you the only one visiting Jerusalem who does not know the things that have happened there in these days?”

19 “What things?” he asked.

“About Jesus of Nazareth,” they replied. “He was a prophet, powerful in word and deed before God and all the people. 20 The chief priests and our rulers handed him over to be sentenced to death, and they crucified him; 21 but we had hoped that he was the one who was going to redeem Israel. And what is more, it is the third day since all this took place. 22 In addition, some of our women amazed us. They went to the tomb early this morning 23 but didn’t find his body. They came and told us that they had seen a vision of angels, who said he was alive. 24 Then some of our companions went to the tomb and found it just as the women had said, but they did not see Jesus.”

25 He said to them, “How foolish you are, and how slow to believe all that the prophets have spoken! 26 Did not the Messiah have to suffer these things and then enter his glory?” 27 And beginning with Moses and all the Prophets, he explained to them what was said in all the Scriptures concerning himself.

28 As they approached the village to which they were going, Jesus continued on as if he were going farther. 29 But they urged him strongly, “Stay with us, for it is nearly evening; the day is almost over.” So he went in to stay with them.

30 When he was at the table with them, he took bread, gave thanks, broke it and began to give it to them. 31 Then their eyes were opened and they recognized him, and he disappeared from their sight. 32 They asked each other, “Were not our hearts burning within us while he talked with us on the road and opened the Scriptures to us?”

33 They got up and returned at once to Jerusalem. There they found the Eleven and those with them, assembled together 34 and saying, “It is true! The Lord has risen and has appeared to Simon.” 35 Then the two told what had happened on the way, and how Jesus was recognized by them when he broke the bread.

~ Luke 23-24

Commentary on The burial of Jesus.

Joseph of Arimathea was a disciple of Christ in secret. Disciples should openly own themselves; yet some, who in lesser trials have been fearful, in greater have been courageous. When God has work to do, he can find out such as are proper to do it. The embalming was done by Nicodemus, a secret friend to Christ, though not his constant follower. That grace which at first is like a bruised reed, may afterward resemble a strong cedar. Hereby these two rich men showed the value they had

for Christ's person and doctrine, and that it was not lessened by the reproach of the cross. We must do our duty as the present day and opportunity are, and leave it to God to fulfil his promises in his own way and his own time. The grave of Jesus was appointed with the wicked, as was the case of those who suffered as criminals; but he was with the rich in his death, as prophesied, Isa 53:9; these two circumstances it was very unlikely should ever be

united in the same person. He was buried in a new sepulchre; therefore it could not be said that it was not he, but some other that rose. We also are here taught not to be particular as to the place of our burial. He was buried in the sepulchre next at hand. Here is the Sun of Righteousness set for a while, to rise again in greater glory, and then to set no more.

www.biblegateway.com...

The Death of Jesus

28 Later, knowing that everything had now been finished, and so that Scripture would be fulfilled, Jesus said, “I am thirsty.” 29 A jar of wine vinegar was there, so they soaked a sponge in it, put the sponge on a stalk of the hyssop plant, and lifted it to Jesus’ lips. 30 When he had received the drink, Jesus said, “It is finished.” With that, he bowed his head and gave up his spirit.

31 Now it was the day of Preparation, and the next day was to be a special Sabbath. Because the Jewish leaders did not want the bodies left on the crosses during the Sabbath, they asked Pilate to have the legs broken and the bodies taken down. 32 The soldiers therefore came and broke the legs of the first man who had been crucified with Jesus, and then those of the other. 33 But when they came to Jesus and found that he was already dead, they did not break his legs. 34 Instead, one of the soldiers pierced Jesus’ side with a spear, bringing a sudden flow of blood and water. 35 The man who saw it has given testimony, and his testimony is true. He knows that he tells the truth, and he testifies so that you also may believe. 36 These things happened so that the scripture would be fulfilled: “Not one of his bones will be broken,”[c] 37 and, as another scripture says, “They will look on the one they have pierced.”[d]

The Burial of Jesus

38 Later, Joseph of Arimathea asked Pilate for the body of Jesus. Now Joseph was a disciple of Jesus, but secretly because he feared the Jewish leaders. With Pilate’s permission, he came and took the body away. 39 He was accompanied by Nicodemus, the man who earlier had visited Jesus at night. Nicodemus brought a mixture of myrrh and aloes, about seventy-five pounds.[e] 40 Taking Jesus’ body, the two of them wrapped it, with the spices, in strips of linen. This was in accordance with Jewish burial customs. 41 At the place where Jesus was crucified, there was a garden, and in the garden a new tomb, in which no one had ever been laid. 42 Because it was the Jewish day of Preparation and since the tomb was nearby, they laid Jesus there.

For this more context and understanding see The Day of the Cross.

Philippians 2:5-11
English Standard Version (ESV)
5 Have this mind among yourselves, which is yours in Christ Jesus, 6 who, though he was in the form of God, did not count equality with God a thing to be grasped, 7 but emptied himself, by taking the form of a servant,being born in the likeness of men. 8 And being found in human form, he humbled himself by becoming obedient to the point of death, even death on a cross. 9 Therefore God has highly exalted him and bestowed on him the name that is above every name, 10 so that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, 11 and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

--------

Is Christ's Resurrection Important to you (Theists)?

Originally posted by NewAgeMan
The Sacred Heart of Jesus (encircled by thorns of sorrow)


As vital as this understanding is, fortunately, it's only half of the story.

Simon Peter said unto him, Lord, whither goest thou? Jesus answered him, Whither I go, thou canst not follow me now; but thou shalt follow me afterwards.
~ John 13:36, KJV

And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again, and receive you unto myself; that where I am, there you may be also.
~ John, 14:3

So in reply to the question posed in the OP - absolutely YES, because his resurrection is OUR shared triumph, and oh what a TRIUMPH it was and IS!

Can you imagine? He put the double bind on the strong man, pilfered his "house" of everything and all power reserving it all for our mutual enjoyment, and then got to have his cake and eat it too in the liberated life, but not just for himself but for US where when the last is first and the first last, the best is always reserved for last.

Then, after a natural lifespan and dropping his body at around the age of 67 or something like that, he wasted no time confronting Saul from the abode of light on the Road to Damascus, and so the dance goes on!





So YES YES YES! - The resurrection of Jesus Christ is VERY important to me!

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Summation / Conclusion

Based on my posts above and from my own deep investigation into this matter, I think it's important to consider the Great Work and life of Jesus Christ in terms of a type of fated "wedge" or sent-calling (leading to the cross) whose "framework", for the first half of his life, formed a type of "box" which was made, by design, from the very beginning ("because you loved me from before the foundation of the world") to contain him and only him and none other than him (as true son of man son of God), but one which, to be functional and formative had to also contain embedded within it, as an evolutionary resurrection principal of life meeting life - his eventual release and escape from it's "entrapment" or confine (represented by the tomb) making of his glorified life with the father in heaven a liberated life of heaven on earth. In other words that "the work" was not entirely complete until he was able to enter into that domain of absolute freedom.

If so, and it looks that way to me, the implication of this for Christianity is profound because it doesn't leave us in guilt and shame at the foot of the cross but instead invites us into a shared glorification with Jesus through the death and resurrection process, which is an evolutionary process of new life and new possibility and a new domain of unconstrained and unfettered freedom to be free to freely love as we are loved. Furthermore, it poses a supreme challenge to the Christian not only to be forgiven, but also and perhaps even more importantly, to have the audacity and the courage, to live a happy and fulfilled life on the other side of the sorrow and the suffering or the joy that can only be completed in and through us, joining his circle of joy in the resurrection life.

This is our Great Work then to complete his joy where it was always done for US, and not for him alone because after all "if I seek only my own glory then that is no glory at all".

This removes the "guilt factor" inherent in a Christianity which terminates at the cross (ie: Roman Catholicism), and invites us also into the new life and the new domain of a state of absolute liberation where it may be said that absolute forgiveness = absolute liberation, not as a permissive framework to sin which only leads to unhappiness and sorrow, but as a permissive framework to really LOVE and thus to be truly happy and fulfilled, not in the next life, but in this one.

"All with the ears to hear let them hear!"

Edit: For more context and understanding - see The Day of the Cross.

That blood red moon on Preparation Day of the Passover Festival was also a FULL moon (signifying a life FULLY lived, not a half life).

Whoever understands this information that I've presented, it will either leave you confused and none the better, or, it will fill you with great joy to discover, and if anyone is tempted here to suggest that Jesus hoaxed his death because he knew in advance that he'd pull through somehow, don't you dare go there, because obedient unto the point of death is as obedient as anyone can be, and knowing Jesus, he almost certainly set it up so that going into it he was "double blind" to use a scientific term, meaning that he could not be absolutely assured of the outcome, but simply "seeded" it in the minds of others while leaving it all in the hands of God as a first/last cause because that's just the way he rolled.

I find it interesting however the use of Aloe by Nicodemus in the preparation of the body.. that's not just standard burial practice, but a healing substance well known to bring about healing of the skin and tissue.

In the final analysis.

God Bless. Jesus loves you and no I'm not Jesus even though I love you too, as a Christian, rationally and logically I have no choice, having been already chosen out of the pit of folly and ignorance, and hey we were all in the same boat at one time or another, so all my job here is to share what I've discovered as a result of my own reasonable searching out of the historical Jesus.

It's a Christianity which isn't only eminently believable but the only thing that makes any sense or is reasonable not matter how unreasonably reasonable it may be as a limitless love that is boudless and that binds or bound the only thing which needed binding and it was of no value anyway to begin with, so his "threshing floor" that's an allegory for another process altogether which means simply to sort the wheat from the chaff as a philosopher king, and a very well trained and very learned one at that (to say the least).

So what I'm saying here is that when we inquire into the historical Jesus what we discover is the very same son of God the fundamentalists tell us to believe in but for no reason at all.

That's funny too! It's FUNNY all around from what I can tell.

Jesus would certainly have been a real belly-laugher too I'll bet... HO HO HO! ..? (one wonders how he might have celebrated each Winter Solstice thereafter.. - see hat in avatar.)

Maybe Nicholas of the Council of Nicaea knew more of the story and was imitating Christ either knowingly or unwittingly, but a red cloak and hat trimmed in white would only be appropriate don't you think?

Things that make ya go hmmmm....

The Good Shepherd and His Sheep

10 “Very truly I tell you Pharisees, anyone who does not enter the sheep pen by the gate, but climbs in by some other way, is a thief and a robber. 2 The one who enters by the gate is the shepherd of the sheep. 3 The gatekeeper opens the gate for him, and the sheep listen to his voice. He calls his own sheep by name and leads them out. 4 When he has brought out all his own, he goes on ahead of them, and his sheep follow him because they know his voice. 5 But they will never follow a stranger; in fact, they will run away from him because they do not recognize a stranger’s voice.” 6 Jesus used this figure of speech, but the Pharisees did not understand what he was telling them.

7 Therefore Jesus said again, “Very truly I tell you, I am the gate for the sheep. 8 All who have come before me are thieves and robbers, but the sheep have not listened to them. 9 I am the gate; whoever enters through me will be saved.[a] They will come in and go out, and find pasture. 10 The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I have come that they may have life, and have it to the full.

11 “I am the good shepherd. The good shepherd lays down his life for the sheep. 12 The hired hand is not the shepherd and does not own the sheep. So when he sees the wolf coming, he abandons the sheep and runs away. Then the wolf attacks the flock and scatters it. 13 The man runs away because he is a hired hand and cares nothing for the sheep.

14 “I am the good shepherd; I know my sheep and my sheep know me— 15 just as the Father knows me and I know the Father—and I lay down my life for the sheep. 16 I have other sheep that are not of this sheep pen. I must bring them also. They too will listen to my voice, and there shall be one flock and one shepherd. 17 The reason my Father loves me is that I lay down my life—only to take it up again. 18 No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of my own accord.

I have authority to lay it down and authority to take it up again. This command I received from my Father.”

19 The Jews who heard these words were again divided. 20 Many of them said, “He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?”

21 But others said, “These are not the sayings of a man possessed by a demon. Can a demon open the eyes of the blind?”

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