MI6 and CIA were told before invasion that Iraq had no active WMD

reply to post by Corruption Exposed


Agreed. I apologise in advance for the personal insults I'm about to unleash.

Just kidding...

reply to post by Kram09

We're not discussing China and although they may have profited from it, they didn't take part in the invasion. You're telling me the United States hasn't profited or has never profited from a war before or that they'd just sit on the sidelines if it was China launching an invasion?

Sure the Us "profited" if you call it that considering how much we buy and borrow from them from civilian products to "chips" in military technology.

There were attempts in another thread to claim that the discovery of a couple of rusty old mustard shells in Iraq somehow justified the entire wrecking of a country and the deaths of thousands of people. It goes to show the desperate lengths that people will go to in an attempt to justify the invasion.

The problems(s) with that is wikileaks www.wired.com... then during the war Saddams WMD's were reported being moved to Syria that was under reported.
winteryknight.wordpress.com...

I do know I watched the news show bunkers filled with Russian made mop gear no point in having that kind of gear if you don't have wmds all new.

reply to post by neo96

I do know

I see. Thanks for enlightening us all with your knowledge.

reply to post by neo96


I hope you realise my last post was sarcasm.

As mentioned the things found in Iraq were negligible and in a rather decrepit state.

There is nothing of substance in that article. It's just "some" things were found. What exactly they were we're not told. Nothing of any genuine military threat or anything that justified the invasion as I previously stated. From the article:

But even late in the war, WMDs were still being unearthed. In the summer of 2008, according to one WikiLeaked report, American troops found at least 10 rounds that tested positive for chemical agents. “These rounds were most likely left over from the [Saddam]-era regime. Based on location, these rounds may be an AQI [Al Qaeda in Iraq] cache. However, the rounds were all total disrepair and did not appear to have been moved for a long time.”

A small group — mostly of the political right — has long maintained that there was more evidence of a major and modern WMD program than the American people were led to believe. A few Congressmen and Senators gravitated to the idea, but it was largely dismissed as conspiratorial hooey.

The WMD diehards will likely find some comfort in these newly-WikiLeaked documents. Skeptics will note that these relatively small WMD stockpiles were hardly the kind of grave danger that the Bush administration presented in the run-up to the war.

We never acted on legitimate intel regarding Saddam's storage bunkers. Never!

www.nytimes.com...

archive.frontpagemag.com...

reply to post by neo96


I might also add that I pointed out the exact same things in the other thread, where you posted the same article.

Obviously you didn't get the memo...or you chose to ignore it.

Anyone remember this from 2004... Al Qaida Terrorists.....

In a series of raids, the Jordanians said, they seized 20 tons of chemicals and numerous explosives. Also seized were three trucks equipped with specially modified plows, apparently designed to crash through security barricades.

The first alleged target was the Jordanian intelligence headquarters. The alleged blast was intended to be a big one.

"According to my experience as an explosives expert, the whole of the Intelligence Department will be destroyed, and nothing of it will remain, nor anything surrounding it," Jayyousi said.

Details of the alleged plot were shown Monday on Jordanian television, including graphics of how the cell apparently intended to carry out the attack.

edition.cnn.com...

Many speculate that the chemical components found in that raid were acquired in Syria. 20 tons of material if used in full capacity could have wiped out 100,000 people.


and this

The CIA has in its hands the critical parts of a key piece of Iraqi nuclear technology -- parts needed to develop a bomb program -- that were dug up in a back yard in Baghdad, CNN has learned.

The parts, with accompanying plans, were unearthed by Iraqi scientist Mahdi Obeidi who had hidden them under a rose bush in his garden 12 years ago under orders from Qusay Hussein and Saddam Hussein's then son-in-law, Hussein Kamel.

U.S. officials emphasized this was not evidence Iraq had a nuclear weapon -- but it was evidence the Iraqis concealed plans to reconstitute their nuclear program as soon as the world was no longer looking

www.cnn.com...

reply to post by jibeho


From the New York Times article:

More than a year after the White House, at considerable political cost, accepted the intelligence agencies' verdict that Mr. Hussein destroyed his stockpiles in the 1990's, these Americans have an unshakable faith that the weapons continue to exist.

Somebody needs to tell him to let go. It's over.

American intelligence officials hastily scheduled a background briefing for the news media on Thursday to clarify that. Hoekstra and Mr. Santorum were referring to an Army report that described roughly 500 munitions containing "degraded" mustard or sarin gas, all manufactured before the 1991 gulf war and found scattered through Iraq since 2003. Such shells had previously been reported and do not change the government conclusion, the officials said.

reply to post by Kram09


Yeah well Saddam didn't get the memo and played a dangerous game and he was called on it.

Dismiss wikileaks go right ahead WMDS moved to Syria so where did Assads get his WMDS from?

You know the ones that made the news recently.

reply to post by jibeho


Yes this is all well and good but what you're failing to recognise is that all these alleged "findings" were just in a parlous state and were not fully operational, ready to go in 45 minutes etc.

Some old junk buried in a back yard is not an existential threat to the United States no matter how much the government and media might scream that is or was.

reply to post by neo96

Yeah well Saddam didn't get the memo and played a dangerous game and he was called on it. Dismiss wikileaks go right ahead WMDS moved to Syria so where did Assads get his WMDS from? You know the ones that made the news recently.

I didn't dismiss Wikileaks. You didn't post a link to Wikileaks. Your article was from Wired relating to things from Wikileaks.

You just ignored my post completely in fact.

Where did Assad get his WMDs from?

Well...oh I don't know...maybe he developed them in Syria? I don't know.

reply to post by Kram09


This post Sorry I am a tad bit busy at the moment

www.abovetopsecret.com...

The only way to be sure what exactly Saddam had was just what happened boots on the ground did people really think they were just going to take Saddams "word" for it?

reply to post by Kram09


Did you miss this?

When the sites identified to him were not searched, he said, he called the 75th Exploitation Task Force every other day, and later the Iraq Survey Group, pleading with whoever answered to send a team with heavy digging equipment.

He recalled: "They'd say, 'We're in a combat zone. We don't have the people or the equipment.' "

His informants grew angry. "They said, 'We risked our lives and our families to help you, and nothing's happened,' " Mr. Gaubatz recounted.

He was disillusioned.

"I didn't imagine it would be a battle to get them to search," he said. "One of the primary reasons for going into combat was the W.M.D."

Or this

Iraqis from backgrounds such as Iraqi Police officers, Doctors, Engineers, Iraqi Govt. officials, farmers, tribesmen, etc. identified sites that contained WMDs. They explained in detail why WMDs were in these areas and asked the U.S. to remove the WMDs. Much of the WMDs had been buried in rivers (within concrete bunkers), and in the sewage pipe system. There were signs of chemical activity in the area (missile imprints, gas masks, decontamination kits, atropine needles, etc..) The Iraqis and my team had no doubt WMDs were hidden in these areas.

The Agents and I knew we had found what we had been looking for. We immediately wrote our reports, which included all the source names, their credibility, their contact information, grid coordinates of the sites, and photographs. The reports were then sent to the U.S. Weapons Inspectors (in northern Iraq). This was mid April 2003. We were initially told by the Inspectors that their team was not organized at this point to conduct exploitations of sites. The sites we had identified would require an extensive amount of excavation. The actual ISG was not formed until a couple of months after the war. Not only did ISG not have the people and proper equipment, they advised Iraq was still a combat zone and very dangerous. ISG members further told us that WMD searches were being concentrated in northern Iraq, and not southern Iraq.

This was the first and largest mistake by ISG. During my intelligence gathering the Iraqis had told us that Saddam concentrated on hiding the WMDs in the southern region because the history of prior UN Weapons Inspections had always concentrated in searches of northern faculties. Searches in southern Iraq had primarily been helicopter flyovers. I have respect for every U.S. member of ISG who served in Iraq, but as an organization, the management was poor. They were not organized nor prepared for this type operation. I compare them to FEMA during Hurricane Katrina. Good people, but poor management. Poor management results in disaster and failure.

We had the evidence, failed to act quickly and many say that's why Bush never pushed the issue of the existence of the WMD.

Is there a possibly that some of the sites you identified three years ago may have been exploited by others (not the U.S.)? Could the government be covering this up because it may be embarrassing that we let the WMDs slip out of our fingers when we had a chance to obtain them?

It is certainly a feasible option knowing all that we know now regarding Syria..

reply to post by neo96


So as you're so certain that Iraqi WMDs were moved from Iraq into Syria, I suppose you're in favour of military action against Syria?

After all if these WMDs are such a huge threat shouldn't we try and get them?

Then again those wily Arabs will probably move them from Syria to Iran. Then where next? Who knows?

It's like pass the parcel but with WMDs.

reply to post by neo96


I know what I posted, why are you posting a link to it?

reply to post by neo96

The only way to be sure what exactly Saddam had was just what happened boots on the ground did people really think they were just going to take Saddams "word" for it?

So on the merest suspicion of any countries wrong doing we should launch a military invasion "just to be sure."?

As opposed to the word of the United States and Britain which proved to be false?

reply to post by Kram09

So as you're so certain that Iraqi WMDs were moved from Iraq into Syria, I suppose you're in favour of military action against Syria?

That is a hell of a leap did I say I was?

After all if these WMDs are such a huge threat shouldn't we try and get them?

They did try and all people can do is sit around, and call them "liars",.

Then again those wily Arabs will probably move them from Syria to Iran. Then where next? Who knows?

Considering their close ties to Iran and Russia could be either or both were in Iraq from the get go

Maybe they need to stop supplying the technical support for them and "pass that parcel".

reply to post by Kram09

So on the merest suspicion of any countries wrong doing we should launch a military invasion "just to be sure."?

"Merest suspicion" eh gee the fact that he gassed his own people, and his hatred for the west had nothing to do with anything what so ever.

Given the fact that terrorist groups have tried, and still to this day to get WMDS, and use them some people are willing to say "meh so what they won't do nothing".

Others know better.

reply to post by jibeho

We had the evidence, failed to act quickly and many say that's why Bush never pushed the issue of the existence of the WMD.

You have a point. But it may also be that WMDs were not the real prime motive in attacking Iraq and at this stage the issue had become irrelevant.

It seems they considered it a waste of resources to thoroughly and adequately search those sites, especially the one mentioned. They should have done to see properly what was there and whether it was serious equipment of an operational nature or just old stuff as before.

reply to post by neo96

That is a hell of a leap did I say I was?

No. Let me ask you directly. Are you in favour of military action against Syria to recover alleged weapons of mass destruction?

They did try and all people can do is sit around, and call them "liars",.

They tried? When? Where? Apparently according to those articles you linked there were transports moving across into Syria. Why weren't they stopped?

"Merest suspicion" eh gee the fact that he gassed his own people, and his hatred for the west had nothing to do with anything what so ever. Given the fact that terrorist groups have tried, and still to this day to get WMDS, and use them some people are willing to say "meh so what they won't do nothing".

By "merest suspicion" I was referring to countries generally and not specifically Iraq. Yes and as we've already established he gassed his own people with the connivance and in some cases assistance of our benign Western governments. We're not talking about terrorists here, we're talking alleged Iraqi WMDs and the invasion of Iraq.