Do the "Men In Black" Actually Kill Witnesses Who Speak Out?

reply to post by elouina


I'm not denying the existence of legitimate "MiB" type persons and/or agencies.

I am, however, positing, and maintaining, that for the larger part of the mythology associated with the actual UFO phenomenon, there is a MiB mythos perpetuated and cultivated within the larger demographic of nutter fringe adherents to the phenomenon.

Allow me to ask this: Other than your own personal testimony, and/or the testimony of those involved in the incident you claim, what measures did you (or anyone) take to document these people?

Photographic documentation of MiB-like activity by MiB-type personages with time stamps in the EXIF data would certainly be just as valuable a data point regarding the claimed experience as clear unambiguous photos of the subject (UFO) that brought about the MiB-like activity.
As is purposely and falsely claimed by claimants of illegitimate sightings for attention, or whatever purpose such sorts have for making false claims, even if none at all, documenting these supposed MiB-types would certainly add a flavor of legitimacy to the claim.

Originally posted by elouina
reply to post by Druscilla

 

The MIB certainly do nothing to validate UFO claims that disappear into the night. So there goes your claim there... And of course by calling the witnesses nutters you attempt to invalidate them further. What do you have to gain by this? Why do you do this?

edit on 17-3-2013 by elouina because: (no reason given)

What do you mean?
Claims of MiB-like activity by MiB-type persons does indeed add legitimacy to any supposed claim of a UFO encounter.
If it wasn't real, or didn't happen, then, why would they be there?

reply to post by Druscilla


We were not out to document squat. My friends sister was terrified of them and what they may do to her. Also, this was before the days of easy photo and video evidence. This was just a life experience and not something we were out to talk about. And I certainly didn't want to cause her harm by talking about this. She is deceased now.

My second post was about your claim that nuts use MIB to validate their claims. I stated that how could that be since the MIB shut the witnesses up.

So how do you "know so much" about something you never experienced?

reply to post by elouina


It sounds to me like you're validating my assertions: In legitimate MiB encounters, people don't talk about it.
By extension, those that DO talk about it, must not be truly legitimate.

Note, that's not what I'm saying is the case, but, it would seem that's what you're saying.

I live in Canada so we don't have to worry about the MiB, lol

The men in black to me mean something different.

If you are talking about a FBI CIA type anti alien task for who clear up "messes" then no.

However a man in black to me, means any suited authoritative position, not necessary government or law, but banker, directors chairmen of boards - anyone that impacts your life whether you like it or not and often behind the scenes.

Do i think people have been "dealt with" in ways that are illegal to the average tax paying man - absolutely but through other ways, not "home invasion gone wrong by gangsters" every time, 'arranging' accidents perhaps or certain other sabotage.

reply to post by ImpactoR


I tried to get any info on ther newspaper titles that I posted because the info there may be more fresh and detailed, all I found was a site that requires filling in personal information just to even do a trial/then automatically paid subscription on some of the newspapers, including one of those I am looking for "UFO Crewmen Grill Musician "

www.worthpoint.com...

how lame, if anyone feels like trying it out..

Originally posted by Biigs
The men in black to me mean something different.

If you are talking about a FBI CIA type anti alien task for who clear up "messes" then no..

I think this needs to be distinguished. Gov agens in black suits that are kind of Man in Black, DO EXIST., whether such entities are hired specially for UFO cases is the question.

Based on description they are usually wearing old hats and kind of as if they are from the middle of the 20th century, so that's not WIll Smith and Tommy Lee Jones types.

reply to post by ImpactoR


If there were men in black suits and sun glasses "protecting us" from aliens, might they be protecting us from panic about aliens just as much as any direct confrontation?

Fear is the mind killer.

Based upon my own personal experiences the last 63 years, the MIB do indeed exist. Most often they target those how dare to expose the truth ... I've witnessed it and have been targeted more than a couple of times.

Its my personal opinion these MIB's are contracted killers following orders under national security.

I have proof from 1954 of one killing.

I actually got the idea for this thread whilst watching the latest Men in Black DVD. Whilst that is a work of humorous fiction. MIBs are a part pf UFO mythology. Although their origin (just like UFOs) is something debatable.

The most high profile case I could find, where some suspicion lingers, is the death of James Forrestal the first US Secretary of Defense.

For those who aren't familiar with the story there is a great thread here concerning Forrestal's career and his suspicious death which was officially pronounced as suicide.

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Forrestal was a key player in US Defense policy for years and there were no end of political problems facing him. His death is seen as suspicious without needing to point to the UFO issue at all.

However before his nervous breakdown Forrestal believed he was being followed by "foreign-looking men"

Friends commented on his growing paranoia. He was convinced that "foreign-looking men" were following him, and that Symington was spying on him. Forrestal’s belief eventually came to the attention of Truman and Secret Service Chief U. E. Baughman, who decided that Forrestal was suffering from "a total psychotic breakdown."


keyholepublishing.com...

In the late 1940s Forrestal would have been well aware of the Roswell and Flying Saucer stories. Some have linked this to his suspicious death. The "foreign looking men" being the "Men in Black" and his death being part of a murky plot to keep a lid on the UFO issue after Forrestal's breakdown.

It's all conjecture and the story is far too complex to cover in a few paragraphs. Interesting theory though and if true means Forrestal was one of the "first" casualties.

reply to post by Druscilla


Perhaps not everyone is intimidated by them? I know I wouldn't have been in her shoes. So does that make those that are stronger willed less credible? She was truely fearful and I respected her wishes and promised not to jeopardize her safety. So you are saying that if she spoke out, she was then lying? Yours is not a very good rationale.

Originally posted by Aliensun
Wouldn't Gary McKinnon be the one guy you would silence in some fashion unless you really wanted folks to start considering the possibilities of a grand US space armada?

I had a chuckle at this one. In a word no. Gary McKinnon had absolutely zero evidence of anything. Which makes anything he said hearsay. He wasn't the hacking savant the Americans liked to portray, and in my view the whole "searching for UFO evidence" defense he liked to use was pure bluff.

The Americans only pursued him so doggedly because they like getting their own way, and he had embarrassed them by highlighting their ridiculously substandard security. I'm glad he got off, but it shouldn't have taken 10 years for the UK to tell the US to "bog off".

Originally posted by DaTroof

Aliens aren't visiting Earth in spaceships, and there's no secret agency that threatens the lives of Americans who believe they've witnessed a UFO.

edit on 16-3-2013 by DaTroof because: (no reason given)

Personally I believe in the MIB. After reading some of the replies on here, yours in particular, I am even more convinced of their existence. They have a fairly simple mission...to threaten and/or discredit those who have seen things. I'm sure you've heard the saying "The devil's greatest trick was convincing man-kind that he doesn't exist". Think about it...

Originally posted by Biigs
reply to post by ImpactoR

 

Fear is the mind killer.

I love hearing that. DUNE!

I believe the MIB phenomenon has be co-opted to the point that it no longer means what it originally did. The movies haven't helped the issue either. AND I think this confusion has manifested itself on this thread and fostered some of the dissent recorded here.

To any old-time UFO researcher who has actually studied the issue over the years the "Men in Black" were mysterious creatures who did, indeed, visit people, but they were a little "off," i.e.: Their mannerisms were strange. It was almost as if they were an ill-fitting disguise with which they were uncomfortable. The idea proffered here was that they weren't really human, and though they were scary, they didn't hurt or kill anyone. Some people have made the case that the original "Men in Black" was simply a hoax made up by Gray Barker, a well-known UFO researcher and prankster who died in the eighties.

I actually talked with Barker many years ago and purchased "The Varo Edition" of Morris K, Jessup's Book, "The case for the UFO." This was an annotated edition taken from a paperback copy which two people had supposedly commented on the book from a position of authority and made fun of Jessup's outlandish conclusions on such things as the Philadelphia Experiment. Barker sold it as "I found a few extra copies in the back room," which in all likelihood, was just another one of his schemes.

However, the concept of the MIB has gained popularity so now you have people re-defining what the MIB are by making up their own definitions. one fellow above insists the MIB are "anyone in authority." Well, OK, if you must, but you are transforming the original concept into any old government agent that goes around intimidating people. You may as well say the MIB killed Kennedy, caused 9/11, and buried Jimmy Hoffa in concrete. The MIB now include just about any Bad Guy(tm) you can make up.

In other words, by doing this you cheapen the brand and dilute the history of what the original MIB were about, slightly bungling, weird guys with strange mannerisms that seemed to come out of the blue and weren't quite sure what they were doing, devoid of the social graces, and disappeared as strangely as they arrived. Now the MIB don't even have to wear black.

I have no doubt there really are agents that intimidate you about UFOs. There are too many good stories related by reputable people to doubt that. But they are not the "Men in Black."

Very odd you would mention this, seeing as just one or two days ago there was a poster who joined and created their introductory thread claiming that they were being hunted by the men in black, that there was some murder with their friend involved and that they were next. The thread wasn't just closed, it was 404'ed--no mod note or anything...

I mean I didn't really take it seriously because people join all the time claiming things that aren't real... But it is a little odd that you would bring this up after this JUST happened. In your OP you didn't even discuss that member's thread, meaning you are either hiding something or there are strange coincidences going on.


I only skimmed the first page, has anyone else posted on this point? I find it odd, and would like to be involved in the truth. What's going on? Maybe its nothing, but...

I'm not 100% sure that there is an MIB program; but what i am sure of it that they are not killing people. even if they could erase someones mind to forget a person, they would have to erase almost everyone's mind who has ever came in contact with that person. someone would have caught on by now.

reply to post by schuyler


Actually does anyone truely know who the MIB are? Back when I encountered them, I am not even certain the phrase exsisted. If it did, we didn't know about it. We had no clue who they were and where they were from.

Were they a UFO reporting group? A government agency? If it was a UFO reporting group, then why did they follow and watch my friends sister? I saw them watching and following her myself, so she wasn't paranoid. One showed up at her work where I also worked. I was the first person to talk to him. Do UFO reporting agencies just show up out of the blue at someones work? Obviously they were around her if I talked to them twice. They also called her unlisted phone number. If they were a UFO reporting agency would they show up to talk to her without her contacting them in the first place? Why did they talk to a bold and outgoing person with no fear and turn her mute and fearful?

So then who were they then? It definately happened, please trust me on this. I would just like to know who the heck they were. What do you think? Do you have any ideas?

This thread is a much larger discussion, I feel best discussed in that conspiracy forum.

In any event, things happen, people are taken care of. Throughout the government in western culture that being the United States for decades people just go away, do what your told or bad things happen. Those people put themselves in those positions so if things get out of line they really cant blame anyone but themself. Noone who just sees something or has a vague idea about something would ever be a target for lethal force such as someone who just had a random encounter. Collecting intel if their spoken to or intimidated, that is a different story but who knows then and the people dealing with both may not be the same people which would make more sense considering compartmentalization. Looking at important projects in the past it happens, whoever it is, and whatever is all interesting discussion but it does happen, Read up to page 2 and didnt see any references to these types of cases but seek and ye shall find. Ill read the other 2 now but still surprised there are not more cases cited where people who were here before are gone now, important people too, people IN the field not watching it or reporting on something they saw. Perhaps it is because its in the aliens forum its limited exposure is limiting the pool of eyes who could be seeing it here to post more information but it is out there.

But is there any proof of witnesses being threatened and then those threats being carried through when the witness goes public?

Proof? No, Evidence? Yes, but not a lot. The conspiracy theory world is full of mysterious deaths, but most of them are due to the person in question being a bit off, vs. killed by the G-Men, more likely than not.

Aliens aren't visiting Earth in spaceships, and there's no secret agency that threatens the lives of Americans who believe they've witnessed a UFO.

That's a pretty bold statement to make. Is this based on your own conclusion after examining available evidence? In the early days of the modern UFO phenomenon, reports of military and alphabet agencies threatening witnesses into silence were pretty much the norm....at least until the government switched gears, and adopted an aura of ridicule approach instead...which was much more effective. Just check into statements made by former Blue Book leaders and the Condon Committee to see evidence of that yourself.

Indeed, there is a believable paper trail of documentation for a group being established just after the "Battle of LA" incident, then kicking into high gear after Roswell, etc., starting as the IPU (Interplanetary Phenomenon Unit...whose existence was rather incidentally confirmed by the Air Force), then growing into a working group later called MAJIC (Military Assessment, Joint Intelligence Committee) that then pushed for the unification of different military intelligence services into what would become the CIA later that year.

The Roswell case is full of witnesses reporting being threatened, with many witnesses even describing the same two threatening officers.

reply to post by mirageman


Well if the mythical MIB's kill UFO witnesses who speak out................they're not doing a very good job are they?