William Cooper

reply to post by kyviecaldges


You are much more knowledgeable than myself on Mr Cooper. And may I attempt to pick your brain without derailing the OP?

What do you know of his thoughts, if any, on the sovereign citizen/freeman on the land issue?

Did he ever delve into that aspect of things?

and if not, what do you think his position would be on that?

So I wanted to make a comment.

I read Cooper's autopsy report from the state of Arizona several years ago and it was clear that he had been shot in the back.

But everything that is online... NOW...

States that he was shot in the front.

Interesting.

Just thought that I would throw that out there.

Cheers.

HanzHenry
reply to post by kyviecaldges

 

You are much more knowledgeable than myself on Mr Cooper. And may I attempt to pick your brain without derailing the OP?

What do you know of his thoughts, if any, on the sovereign citizen/freeman on the land issue?

Did he ever delve into that aspect of things?

and if not, what do you think his position would be on that?

Cooper was knowledgeable of jurisdiction.

He understood what made the freeman movement work and what made it full of crap.

I could talk endlessly about this issue, but...

Understand this-

In 1938, a ruling was made, this ruling combined equity and criminal law into one jurisdiction.

This is called, in legalese if I am not mistaken, diversity jurisdiction.

It essentially makes the same court a court of contract law AND a court of criminal law.
When we are in court for what we think is a crime- we are actually in court for a contract obligation.

Equity is the enforcement of compelled behavior.
Compelled behavior is only enforceable by contract because we have to agree with it.
So really it's not compelled.
You cannot force someone to do anything against their will.
That is criminal.

Common law is the law of juries.
We have a jury trial because of common law.
Equity is crap law.
It always has been and any law book will acknowledge this.

Cooper understood this.
He understood that the only jurisdiction that the Feds have in a state is on land that was ceded to them by the state itself.
That is why the Feds had the Sheriff with them to deliver the arrest warrant.

I am going to try and answer you a bit better, but this is where I would start.

Cheers.

originally posted by kyviecaldges
Cooper may have initially been a proponent of aliens, but he realized that he was being duped to help sell the coming fake invasion, and he recanted and started speaking up about the majestic 12 being a lie.

Any links or references detailing this "recant"?
This information: www.bibliotecapleyades.net... by Mr. Cooper himself is a lot to refute. Or could it have been recanted due to threats stemming from him exposing the reality of MJ 12 itself?

TrueMessiah

originally posted by kyviecaldges
Cooper may have initially been a proponent of aliens, but he realized that he was being duped to help sell the coming fake invasion, and he recanted and started speaking up about the majestic 12 being a lie.

Any links or references detailing this "recant"?
This information: www.bibliotecapleyades.net... by Mr. Cooper himself is a lot to refute. Or could it have been recanted due to threats stemming from him exposing the reality of MJ 12 itself?

edit on 8-1-2014 by TrueMessiah because: (no reason given)

Listen to Cooper himself tell you this.

reply to post by kyviecaldges


This is only speaking of the false flag alien invasion which I was already aware of. However it's irrelevant to the specific info I asked for about MJ 12 being a lie. Just because there is a proposed end game scenario involving a staged invasion, it doesn't invalidate the info contained in the link I posted coming from Cooper himself.

TrueMessiah
reply to post by kyviecaldges

 

This is only speaking of the false flag alien invasion which I was already aware of. However it's irrelevant to the specific info I asked for about MJ 12 being a lie. Just because there is a proposed end game scenario involving a staged invasion, it doesn't invalidate the info contained in the link I posted coming from Cooper himself.

Did you listen to it?

At 1:10 he says-

"I have since come to believe that the extra terrestrial portion of this is nonsense, but that the technology is real."

That one statement explains it all.

Are you trying to split hairs by actually asking me to look for a quote from him where he says that MJ12 was crap.

Really?!?!?

I will dig, but it seems to me that you are either a believer and you don't want to come to grips with the fact that Cooper recanted all of that, or you are trying to smear Cooper.

Either way, if anyone listens to this with an open mind its easy to hear that he is claiming that he was being used to spread disinformation.

Right after that at 1:20 he says-

"I believe that many of us were shown these documents over the years so that later we would talk about it".

How much more do you want?

For what it is worth..I was lucky enough to see Cooper lecture both live multiple times and then on VHS tape. Additionally like so many people here I read Behold a Pale Horse multiple times. Hell I remember , in an era before Amazon, having to special order it from local book store when I was in high school and feeling like the next Fox Mulder because I was reading it.

That being said certain things about him have become accepted as truth when they are more urban legend.

He did not predict 9/11 but rather a nebulous attack on the country over a few week time frame which anyone with any ties to the intelligence world have been safe in saying based on the chatter of the time. Additionally what he did was assume that because their was a reporter who had a working relationship with Bin Laden that it must mean that reporter was a mole or working for the CIA so Bin Laden would be used as the scapegoat.

He also got played pretty hard on the driver using a blowfish gun to kill JFK story line. One of the first times I saw him lecture he was basically focused on that including multiple showings that night of the alleged weapon in the drivers hand..By the 4th time i saw him lecture he had learned that he was being played with that clip , correctly showed his disdain for the people that did it and he dropped it.

Those two things being said I believe that anyone's journey into the realm of conspiracies should start with Behold a Pale Horse and whatever clips you can find of Cooper. I believe that , we as a country, need more people like him and for his willingness to discuss the truth he paid the ultimate price.

reply to post by opethPA

He did not predict 9/11 but rather a nebulous attack on the country over a few week time frame which anyone with any ties to the intelligence world have been safe in saying based on the chatter of the time. Additionally what he did was assume that because their was a reporter who had a working relationship with Bin Laden that it must mean that reporter was a mole or working for the CIA so Bin Laden would be used as the scapegoat.

Correct, but I find it hard to say that he didn't predict 9/11.

He stated on air that there would be an attack in the coming weeks on the United States and it would be blamed on Osama Bin Laden.

If someone came onto this site and claimed that in the next month an attack would happen on the US and it would be blamed on a certain someone, and then something like 9/11 happened and it was, in fact, blamed on that someone, then every single person here would praise that individual.
Cooper stated that he figured this out by simply reading the news and watching for trends.

He also got played pretty hard on the driver using a blowfish gun to kill JFK story line. One of the first times I saw him lecture he was basically focused on that including multiple showings that night of the alleged weapon in the drivers hand..By the 4th time i saw him lecture he had learned that he was being played with that clip , correctly showed his disdain for the people that did it and he dropped it.

Correct again, but again you are leaving out a good bit.

Cooper was given what he thought was the complete Zapruder Film.

If anyone watches it, then it is plain to see that it looks like the driver turns and shoots Kennedy with this left hand.

Kennedy had a shell fish allergy and these types of weapons were used at the time in espionage.

He made a leap of logic based on information that he was given and it turned out to be wrong.

How can you blame him?

And, IMHO, the fact that he was able to admit that he was wrong only makes him that much more appreciable and it makes me realize that he was a target.
Obviously he was.
He was murdered by the Federal Government.

kyviecaldges
Correct, but I find it hard to say that he didn't predict 9/11.

He stated on air that there would be an attack in the coming weeks on the United States and it would be blamed on Osama Bin Laden.

We are essentially disagreeing on semantics. =)

He made a guess on an incoming attack based on commonly available information for a vague time frame.
His saying that Bin Laden was going be used as the scapegoat stemmed from his assumption that the reporter who had a working relationship with Bin Laden had to be working for the CIA not from some insider information.

My argument against this aspect of Cooper has been the people that blindly state he "Predicted 9/11" when those words never left his mouth. Their were multiple people in the defense world that were at a heightened state during that time frame expecting an attack to happen.

Correct again, but again you are leaving out a good bit.
Cooper was given what he thought was the complete Zapruder Film.

He was actually given a manipulated copy of the Zapruder film which a production company had tampered with to make it look like the driver was shooting with something that vaguely resembled a blow fish.

At the lecture I mentioned in my OP he basically ripped on that company for a good 20 minutes and at a certain point started to claim they were agents of the govt passing him disinfo. Certainly possible and certainly not the first time something like that could have happened.

And, IMHO, the fact that he was able to admit that he was wrong only makes him that much more appreciable and it makes me realize that he was a target. Obviously he was. He was murdered by the Federal Government.

100% agree with the above statement.

reply to post by kyviecaldges


Nope you're going to have to do better than that.
He was strictly speaking on the documents concerning "Project Redlight". On top of that, he explained that his review of these documents came many many years ago. You're using that to dismiss the reality of MJ12 completely which is not fair at all.

Another thing is that your claim contradicts what Mr.Cooper said himself about MJ12 back in 1989 which was not "many many years ago". If you bothered to read the link I previously posted, you'll see exactly what I'm talking about. For instance, he gives the origins of MJ-12 and the committee members names:

Founding of MJ-12

By secret Executive Memorandum NSC 5510, Eisenhower had preceded NSC 5412/1 to establish a permanent committee (not ad hoc) to be known as MAJESTY TWELVE (MJ-12) to oversee and conduct all covert activities concerned with the alien question.

NSC 5412/1 was created to explain the purpose of these meetings when Congress and the press became curious.

Majesty Twelve was made up of Nelson Rockefeller, Director of Central Intelligence Allen Welsh Dulles, Secretary of State John Foster Dulles, Secretary of Defense Charles E. Wilson, Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Admiral Arthur W. Radford, Director of the Federal Bureau of Investigation J. Edgar Hoover, six men from the executive committee of the Council on Foreign Relations known as the "Wise Men," six men from the executive committee of the JASON Group, and Dr. Edward Teller.

Now if this was retracted by Cooper as you say, then I'd sure like to see evidence.

reply to post by TrueMessiah


I am going to get to you, but I want this to be posted.

This is the most accurate account of Cooper's death.

Wow. I've heard of him from here on ATS and various places and never did delve into anything until now, for some reason. Personally, I've always suspected the possibility of Alex Jones as a "Fatherland" (the movie) sort of guy. I have listened to Alex Jones for years and feel that he does deserve some credibility, but, ....well I'm digressing. I think I'll be trying to get a copy of Cooper's book and keep watching vids on You Tube.

missvicky
Wow. I've heard of him from here on ATS and various places and never did delve into anything until now, for some reason. Personally, I've always suspected the possibility of Alex Jones as a "Fatherland" (the movie) sort of guy. I have listened to Alex Jones for years and feel that he does deserve some credibility, but, ....well I'm digressing. I think I'll be trying to get a copy of Cooper's book and keep watching vids on You Tube.

Here is Cooper exposing Alex Jones as a fraud.

Cooper rips Alex Jones up. I mean he tears him apart. I laugh every time that I listen to it.

reply to post by kyviecaldges


This is how you know someone is getting close to real truth.

ThePsychopathsThatSee will come after you or smear you.

reply to post by kyviecaldges


Thank you for posting that video. I am now sharing it with my husband and plan on watching the remaining two parts. I understand how both of these guys are controversial, both have true blue fans and rabid critics. But, I have to say I am still on the fence, even after all these years about Alex Jones. My deepest gut feeling is that Jones is this era's "Fatherland" guy, which bothers me even more than if he wasn't. Btw, does anyone know what I'm talking about when I mention the movie "Fatherland"?

reply to post by kyviecaldges


Listening to Part Two. sounds to me that Cooper was the "Fatherland" guy of his time. will listen to Part 3 and more of Cooper's video/broadcasts on You Tube....but so far sounds like a baton was passed...maybe by force...but a baton was passed.

Cooper establishes his credibility and discovery of information based on his position in "naval intelligence". Reading his accounts of information he saw in memos is rather comical. Not only the information, but that such information would be available to him in his limited position and the way this information was cataloged. Really folks its to good to be true.

I have his book and its a mess.


I have also watched his early UFO talks.....he tosses around "official documents" like toilet paper, doesn't vet them to an extent any thinking person would be satisfied with. He just tosses stuff out their to be sopped up and by God you better sop it up.

I wouldn't doubt that his problems with Jones stem from his own megalomania. He wasn't above lying about Jones.


As well long before Cooper there was already an established underground information effort going on by the 1970s.....an effort Cooper rarely gives credit to. This movement really didn't have any superstars but a great deal of information. Cooper looks to me much of the time like a guy that came along with the purpose of derailing that effort by making himself the lightning rod go to guy overshadowing the effort already underway. An effort that dispensed the information without the big blow hard super conspiracy personalities that have become more important that the information.

missvicky
reply to post by kyviecaldges

 

Listening to Part Two. sounds to me that Cooper was the "Fatherland" guy of his time. will listen to Part 3 and more of Cooper's video/broadcasts on You Tube....but so far sounds like a baton was passed...maybe by force...but a baton was passed.

I wouldn't say that the baton was passed.

I, personally, think that Jones was put into the mix to siphon off Cooper's listener after Cooper was killed.

Alex Jones is straight disinfo.

Anyone that knows what disinformation is-
90% truth and 10% lies.

People seem to want to think that Jones brings good information, and the majority of the time he does, but it's the little bit that he gets wrong that matters, because unlike Cooper, Jones refuses to acknowledge when he is wrong.
Jones is an agent provocateur.

Classic agent provocateur.

I am not familiar with "Fatherland". Will you fill me in?

reply to post by kyviecaldges


Fatherland is an old movie with Nick Nolte starring as lead. It's about a deep cover op in WW2 in which they put Nolte's character in the mix of the German ""in crowd" as an Allied Spy. He winds up as a talk radio celebrity who spews Nazi propaganda for hours every day....but within that propaganda are hidden codes for Allies. He is so deep cover that the U.S. never acknowledges him. It's a really good movie, but haven't seen it in a long time. I think I'll rent it to see it again.