Could This be the First Evidence of Aliens and The Afterlife Being Related?

reply to post by pilotx

Originally posted by pilotx
Testing the true parameters of the natural world is also discouraged by the personal/collective mind, because then it would be discovered that it is possible to live in harmony, and still not exceed the presently-known limitations of life on earth and laws of nature.

Pure poetry (as was the rest of your post).

reply to post by Vrillion


It is always easier to mock than to make a stand for something you believe in. Instense bullying can even make you internalize the image they project of you being wrong, a liar, ridicoulous or whatever. But it doesn't make it so. I guess there is some comfort in chosing your forums, picking your battles. These kind of realizations are much like those with a recovering drug addict: it is only successful if the change is endogenous. It is a fine line between informing and preaching, inspiring and imposing... We much tread that path lightly.

For me perosnally I am glad that I have, so early on in life, come to terms with the spiritual reality as a natural part of the world. Being certain that death is not the end and that I will unite with loved ones in due time is a great comfort to me. "Mortal" life is but a phase and just as Pilotx said, it is not "lower" nor "prior" to any other phase since I can hardly imagine that the universal existance is as linear as the tethered human mind makes us believe.
This in turn assures me that the traditional, squared and inflexible contemporary science is not all there is to this world. What they can offer are rules and scematics for how to "play the game" that we've set up for us in the material world. Some of these rules have even become necissities for survival, whether we like it or not.

A quote that I always carry within, said to be uttered by Paracelsus (1493-1541) goes something like this: "Magic is wisdom for the few, just as common sense is an illusion for the many".
I like thinking like that, in ontological terms...

Bringing up an acid subject here, I am kind of hoping that the convergence of 2012 (as a process, not a flash event) is a shift in conciousness which enables us to improve life on earth with the wisdom provided from the spiritual realm- that their view on things can help us keep this lovely planet with all its wonders for millenia to come. It seems to me at least that without the intervention from something other than us "mortals" playing "the game" it is not possible to stay here for many more generations...

This discussion is the best I've had for a very long time at ATS. It might also be the very best.
Peace to all of you.

(sorry for typo's, I don't have spellcheck installed yet)

reply to post by HairlessApe


There's skepticism and then there's just straight out denial for the sake of appearing on intellectually higher ground, which is what you are doing. You immediately call into play the case of evidence, as if this is some sort of scientific procedure that the OP is trying to confirm through trials and testing. This isn't one of those things man. And believe me, I'm very skeptical about the paranormal/supernatural and understand your point about the aliens completely, but the way you handled it just reminds me of why I don't post on this board more. You allow no room for any discussion at all, what's the point of participating on this board if all you want to do is to attempt to tell people they are 100% wrong lol? Believe me, I am skeptical too on all of this but I think you should at least attempt some discussion or thought towards it.

A lot of supernatural/paranormal things can be researched to the point where you realise where the original ideas may have actually arisen from. For example, when you hear the word demon you instantly switch off because you expect the person using the word to believe in some religious type horned tail devil being that works for Satan lol. But if I told you what it really means is an entity of some form that produces fear in the subjective responder, you would have a different opinion and outlook to someone speaking about such a thing - whether it's real or not objectively, it is practically real to the person and in that sense a demon does exist.

For example, sleep paralysis is often accompanied by visions of 'shadow demons' who stand near/at the side of your bed or over you while you are in this state. However, their appearance is definitely not limited to sleep paralysis. Shadow demon is an appropriate word as they appear as large dark figures and illicit an extremely fearful response - that's all it is. Some people report talking to them and being told 'those that can see us are the lucky ones', others have absolutely terrifiying and consistent experiences and some even see these shadow 'demons' controlling their sleeping body in an OOB experience. I have personally experienced this being only once - I remember it vividly as it was the most fearful moment of my whole life (and that's saying a lot considering I've been in real actual life threatening situations). I found myself on my bed in a sort of hazy state (not sure whether I was awake or asleep) and suddenly felt this prescense in my room, so strong and powerful that I had no doubt it was conscious or alive in some sense of the word, whether my mind had created this entity or not the fact remains that it displayed the properties of an actual entity. It had no readily identifiable face, and looked like a large dark figure (much like the grim reaper if his hood covered his face, probably where stories of this symbolic being arises from) and it slowly moved past my bed. As it did this I was absolutely paralyzed with fear, this thing was radiating such 'evil' that I wanted to die as it went past me, it was that bad. It whispered something that sounded like no language I've ever heard, almost like a snakey slithering whisper :s. After that happened, I seemed to re-awaken in another dream and had to confront this being and fight it. I 'defeated' it and have never been bothered by it again (well kind of, the other day randomly a 'demonic' entity interrupted my dream literally, paused it, took me to some advanced lab like place in my dream and showed me that it could manipulate my dream at will, I had a realisation that reality is nothing but a simulation caused externally to our capacity of understanding and then awoke o_O lol).

It all sounds silly but when you research this stuff you find the SAME FRICKIN' shadow demon being described in the same sense usually in the same scenario and often with the experiencer stating it was the most fearful moment in their life. Those that do not confront the 'demon' being in their dream and wake up often encounter it again and again until there is a confrontation. Some are literally bullied by this being and over time it is joined by more of the shadow demon beings in the person's subjective experience. They are often described as enjoying the process of causing fear in us, and alot of people are taunted by them. Once again, I am not a Christian or anything and I reject all the ideologies of the main religions and any concept of sin/judgement or angels/demons and that and I have a strong academic root in maths/physics and engineering. I am just trying to raise to you the possibility that there is something more to some of these things, in one way or another. The logical answer of course is 'ah man your brains just messing with you' but WHY does it choose to use this same entity in the same situation to scare so many people to unbearable levels of fear? WHY? Especially to someone like me who has never believed in actual demons, or been scared of them and has experienced ridiculously scary real life moments and scary dreams in the past. This is something else and makes me wonder if we are all too skeptical at times. Is it really that crazy that an entity has arisen on another plane of existance (such as the universe is our plane) and it can interfer with ours? You can see this in a simple analogous form in the case of a radio and frequency interference. Ofcourse, objective evidence is ultimately needed to establish the answer, but I believe as these experiences are inherently subjective and personal this is extremely difficult to achieve and instead research and rationale should be used. Logic can and WILL lead to you producing theories on these things once your knowledge contains enough similar independant examples, just as with anything else.

I hope I have intrigued you in the slightest at least. Peace.

I've now gone through the long version, i.e. the full documentary and I warmly recommend everyone to see it, especially for you who doubt. This is some solid material we're dealing with.
I realize that some of the ideas I have expressed above was shared by people in the documentary as well! Things like that seems to happen more frequently in my life since some time back.
An example: as I wrote the previous post and needed to confirm the quote by Paracelsus (I was a bit confused if it was his quote or Agrippa's) I went to get a lexicon and the first page I opened, quite unintentionally, was the section on the Paracelsus (the section about him only covers one spread out of 400 pages).
Now, I could of course disregard it as coincidence but when things like that happen over and over, so often that it starts making a pattern, it is the "logical" explanations that stops making sense.

The spirits talk to us in various ways and the more you accept and adhere to that, the more obvious and clear the communication becomes.

Again about Edisons device for cross-dimensional communication: what if it had been completed and released onto the market... The world would have been a very, very different place I reckon!

Sorry for the OT, just wanted to recommend all to see the full docu. Check it here

Interesting post! I think we could be on to something!

reply to post by ChaoticOrder


I just got chills at the "This is a historic moment"
EvP is fascinating

reply to post by DazDaKing


Cool story man, but how could we link it up with the OP? I've been thinking a lot about all this since first entering this discussion (it has even started to interfere with my "regular" studies, like I told a fellow ATS member) and I wonder if some of the abductions might have something to do with the spirit realm. Maybe not all of them, but some? Can we discover some links or coincidences to push that theory forward?

Anyhow, what you said about demanding proof: if you look at the full-length documenatry you will see that the scole team and associated scientist did in fact carry out several experiments in controlled environments with positive results. So there you have it.
Seems to me that those in fear of this stuff being true always seek to find some minor fragment or detail in any given experiment and then get a major hang-up on it, as if it was the only thing that mattered and not the "big picture". Fear is a mighty strong force that we've nurtured well throughout the ages...to the level of being enslaved under it.

Talking about fear: when I read your testimony about your encounter I come to think of how the spirits seem to need the radiance of our emotions to manifest better. I don't think any certain type of emotion consistenly matters even though some spirits might seek certain frequencies for their own special purpose. If they thrive on fear, they will produce fear as good as they can in order to manifest in the physical world. But I am sure that love or any other feeling works just as well.
Having an entitiy that seems malign hanging over you like that seems like a real tough experience but I would not reckon you as helpless. I am a firm believer that all is part of the same source of spiritual essence so in practic you are as powerful as the demon in question. It is all a matter of what it is able to make you believe with your heart.

Otherwise, I totally subscribe to your discarding of dichtonomous thinking.

reply to post by Raud


Hey man, I'll check out the full documentary I didn't have a chance to watch it properly when I first saw this thread!

I'm glad you asked about there perhaps being a link between abductions and this 'spirit world'. I suggest if you want evidence/ideas to push that theory forward to read 'The Spirit Molecule' by Dr. Rick Strassman. He's a Harvard psychology professor who's the only man to have conducted a FDA approved study into "substance x". It's an illegal substance, though it naturally exists in many plants and some mammals and talking about it properly on ATS is banned but basically in his book he finds that this substance when injected (or smoked) causes the most potent hallucinogenic effects known to us. It's not like an overlapping trip in your vision, it's a complete breakdown of reality, disconnection of 'soul' and body (as some explain it) and then BANG you're in an absolutely different 'reality' with other entities lol.

Like 85% of people encountered entities on this substance with the main types being reptillian-like, mantis type and geometrical/light/shadow type beings. At first Dr Strassman tried to explain it in terms of psychology and maybe archetypes in the subconscious manifesting themselves but everyone in his study was like 'no mate it was definitely real and seperate to me', until Strassman himself started to question if this experience was of a 'real' and constant place. Anyway, he went on to postulate that this substance is produced in our pineal glands (apparent 3rd eye, 'seat of the soul' - Descartes) when we dream and in out of body/near death and mystical experiences. The interesting part in regards to what you said is that he also finds a huge overlap in his volunteers experience and that of UFO abductees, and goes on to reason that perhaps a large percentage of UFO abductions are induced by the release of this substance and hence manipulation by these other beings in this other state of existance. A lot of people encountered advanced laboratory's and entities experimenting on them even in the Strassman trials... and apparently a significant amount of UFO abductions occur near high voltage power lines too, and those EM field fluctuations are known to induce 'mystical' states e.t.c. I don't want to ramble on about it too much more but definitely check out that book man, it will help you understand some more I promise you.

Now this MAY just be the case; Our bodies are basically computers, in every sense they operate in practically the same way and convert input information into meaningful output for the USER. Our whole system inc. the brain is a brilliant machine packed with survival instincts and learning algorithms, but it seems like we possess something else that nature and evolution doesn't always quite perfectly explain - the act of self consciousness, self-awareness and ultimately understanding of being an OBSERVER just merely using this body to interact with this specific information field (fundamentally wave form information proven by quantum physics) which we call our universe - OF which we personally only perceive a TINY fraction of input from (i.e visible light). Now all atoms are basically information points in a few different forms like binary and hence molecules are code/software, and this substance seems to have the amazing ability to actually completely change the input information we decode, or perhaps even 'release' us from this physical subset and exist in the higher up 'soul' set (the observer level, if you get me) Then some of this may actually make sense. If all emotions are actually experienced by the observer and not the body, would that explain why these beings manifest in sleep paralysis as all you actually experience in that state is ABSOLUTE fear yet your body is shut off. So it might not be them inducing more fear to manifest physically but you perceiving their domain (whatever creates that) in a more emotionally tuned state caused by this altered state?

But yeah in a sense maybe all these supernatural/paranormal/some alien beings never manifest in the physical world, they may just exist in this parallel or an even higher level of existence (assuming it's not in our own imagination completely and all the consistency is coincidence) and this substance is one way that allows our observer form to experience it - does that make sense? And what we do sometimes see in the physical world is just an 'image' in our decoding system of them, as actual physical matter can't manifest itself in a spontaneous coherent acting surplus like that under our laws of physics. I'm still unsure about the soul, but the user/computer analogy is logical in a way.

I agree about the whole same source thing, there's definitely a duality as well where you have to take the 'good' with the 'bad'. I'm not worried about that experience again though, whatever it was I metaphysically defeated it lol. I feel bad for the people with re-occuring experience - # that

reply to post by Vrillion


We can go to the "Astral" and they can come here. Other than what the mind perceives and experiences it doesn't seem like either can tangibly effect the other realm. I say "seem" because its highly possible that indirectly we could effect the others realm. Probably need an expert on Astral projection to clarify the cause and effect of the adventures

Originally posted by ThePhysicalExperience
reply to post by Vrillion

 

We can go to the "Astral" and they can come here.

The realms overlap and are intrinsically intertwined.

Other than what the mind perceives and experiences it doesn't seem like either can tangibly effect the other realm. I say "seem" because its highly possible that indirectly we could effect the others realm. Probably need an expert on Astral projection to clarify the cause and effect of the adventures

Not really. Why not ask the spirits themselves?

Lesle Flint Spirit Communications via Independent Direct Voice

Perhaps this will aid the conversation.

Alec Harris, Physical Medium and The Ectoplasmic Flying Saucer

Originally posted by MUness

Originally posted by ThePhysicalExperience
reply to post by Vrillion

 

We can go to the "Astral" and they can come here.

The realms overlap and are intrinsically intertwined.

Other than what the mind perceives and experiences it doesn't seem like either can tangibly effect the other realm. I say "seem" because its highly possible that indirectly we could effect the others realm. Probably need an expert on Astral projection to clarify the cause and effect of the adventures

Not really. Why not ask the spirits themselves?

Lesle Flint Spirit Communications via Independent Direct Voice

Even though a spirit is its own energy i could only ever perceive what it has to say by things already inside my own mind. This is a paradox in my "sphere of reality" and would only cause me to distort my "own truth". This is about all i can really say on the matter. Good luck to all those seeking their own truth.

reply to post by CJCrawley


Thanks for the clarification, CJ.

The person who uploaded this version stated the same in their lengthy description - I wish I'd seen it before I posted:

Kenneth Parsons on the Scole Experiment

[
Even though a spirit is its own energy i could only ever perceive what it has to say by things already inside my own mind. This is a paradox in my "sphere of reality" and would only cause me to distort my "own truth".

So sorry to hear that you are so addled.

reply to post by MUness


"One mans dirt is another mans stars".
This is not the path i have chosen for self discovery. So you don't need to be sorry for anything.

So all the governments are in on this? I still find it funny how the only footage that always comes up is grainy, distorted, far out. Why does nobody ever get nice HD close ups?

reply to post by mtlcruisin


HD did not exist in 1993.

reply to post by ChaoticOrder


i, agree; i also have a hard time believing this; the part when a voice asked "...experimenting with audio equipment?..." is just too good to be true. It is either the best video or one of the greatest hoax i ever seen!
Those moving eyes were bone chilling,btw...

Some of the other websites I once read had authors who claimed that Earth is some kind of "spiritual rehab" for lost souls. Some people are here to help others to learn things like friendship and love, while others are there recovering themselves.

reply to post by DazDaKing


I saw something about the God Molechule on a documentary at Netflix. If I remember it correctly, this molechule is present in all living organisms, both plants and animals. This might be the physical evidence that "God" is inside all that lives and that there are no separation between "God" and "man" as Christianity (among others) wants us to believe.
In said documentary they pointed to that the synthetic God Molechule was very volatile and that it quickly went through the human brain before dissolving. What they found very interresting, however was that South American indians had somehow found a way around this and figured out how to prolong the effect by adding other ingredients, thus cooking what we know as Ayahuasca. How they found that out is a total mystery- unless you believe in the powers of those in the spirit realm...

I've been thinking much about all those religions, both living and extinct, where the spirits of the ancestors are a vital part. It is probably so that the parcticioners of such a religion actually did speak to their ancestors in a very direct way, recieving advice from the other side. Those are not stories. Maybe the also had/have contact with other than the spirits of the deceased.

So, I kind of forgot what I was replying to here but I'll come back to you if I remember what I forgot, lol

Originally posted by ThePhysicalExperience
Even though a spirit is its own energy i could only ever perceive what it has to say by things already inside my own mind. This is a paradox in my "sphere of reality" and would only cause me to distort my "own truth". This is about all i can really say on the matter. Good luck to all those seeking their own truth.

I can totally dig that and I am on the very same page which in itself might be a pretext for us beinga able to discuss these matters without risking to "contaminate" our perceptions, don't you think?
I am already surprised with how many feels the same way that I feel about these issues. Like I said before, it is a fine line between informing/inspiring and imposing/preaching. That line is not so fun to walk if the risks are real and appearent... At least in my case there are no such riks (I think).

Anyway, I don't know where this post is headed so I'll drop it right here instead