The reasons why your "bugout plan" will absolutely fail!

i am a former wilderness patrol ranger. i was responsible for solo backpack patrol and rescue in wilderness areas for years. i am a hunter who makes jerky, etc. i have a multi acre garden. i have survived in remote wilderness situations on several continents in extreme conditions. i have a full stock of arms and skills to use them. i have medical and all other survival skills, and own my own remote, productive acreage. i am of native american heritage and have all the cultural warrior hunting/training. i am an expert fisherman, ocean and river/lake, and i am not talking rod-n-reel fishing. i would last approximately 1-3 years...max, on my own with all the above, fully prepped, in a societal meltdown. you wont last as long as me.

i watch the survivor and prepper series on tv, and i lol my arse off, everytime. what poser, fake fools these so called bug-eating experts are. you can scale any cliff you want, spend all your carbs making ridiculous shelters. those activities are wastes, risks and the activity of fools. no one. i mean, no one except rare sadhu-types are going to survive in the lushest natural setting in america off of game traps and cattails for very long. no one. you would die of carb-loss within a year. name your carbs son. meat? nope. veggies? nope. i promise. if you try to live off the land,m you will die the first winter. *grins*

if you take your silly bugout bag, and start driving the 300 miles of roads from the city to our area to make your lean-to to trap squirrels and run around with guns, the people here will kill you long before you get to my rural locale. the rural places belong to us. no armed tramps will be waltzing in to make pine needle tea. we dont like guns in criminal hands, so we will shoot you. we will be a community. if you dont have a tank, dont head here. if you do, make sure there is an army behind that tank. dont come here with a gun and a pocketknofe and 3 days worth of freeze dried food. really.

now let me explain reality. i would die in 1-3 years, surrounded by elk, salmon, gardens... becasue men dont survive by themselves. gardens get pests. salmon runs are community owned. gardens that dont produce carbs must trade with gardens that do. those farmers will trade with cattle and goat and sheep ranchers. this is how society is formed. not for survival of the fittest, but for mutal benefit. as for wild meat...we know where the deer bed, where the elk winter, when the salmon run. in 1-2 years there will be no deer to share with you. we know how to hunt OUR deer. they are not sustainable as a food source and dont provide sufficient carbs for survival anyway.

try to understand, in wild Native America, the worst sentence the clans could put upon a crime was banishment. thats right. the finest warrior, the best hunter, when banished from the tribe, was destined to die. AND I AM TALKING ABOUT INDIANS HERE! women gather the acorns. elders weave the cloths. MEN DO NOT SURVIVE ALONE. trust me, ive put it to a field test.

can a sadhu live for 3 years in montana? sure, i have lived entirely off the land there once for 3 months as a test. at the end i was actually planning to raid a ranger cabin to get butter and cooking oil. you get crazy quick. is there permaculture farming? sure, some collectives with alot of people have made almost-permaculture farming work...rarely. but some stupid city fool with a bugout bag and guns planning to roll where a rural comunity already lives, and where a rural community will continue to survive, by working together as a community, will not be welcomed. sorry to inform you city folks, there is no 'real' wilderness in the lower 48. parts of siberia might better qualify.

heres a suggestion. instead of a friggin bugout bag, WHY ARE YOU CITIZENS OF THIS DEMOCRACY NOT STANDING UP FOR THE SURVIVAL COMMUNITY YOU HAVE ALREADY FORMED - THE UNITED STATES. save this country and our humanity for the next generation and stop planning how you will roll out and kill bambi and rednecks because you didnt have the heart or courage to stand against out-of-control globalist insanity that caused the fall. community is the only sane path for survival in hard times. and losers with guns and city-smarts dont have anything to add to our community. so they should start adding to their own and save this dyin g rock. preppers are fools in that regard.

Don't plants have carbs?

Try coming up here to Alaska. The Inuits up here eat seal, whale, caribou and salmon all winter. I'm not sure where they get their carbs from, as they can't grow anything (permafrost).

People used to (and still do) live in simply log cabins, completley off grid with little to no assistance from the outside world.

When you're living like that, your full-time, 12+ hour a day job is preparing all day, all summer for the coming winter.

You're right though about isolation. It will drive you crazy. This is why the lock people up alone that are really, really bad. We are naturally social creatures.

And I too laugh at "survivalists".

Richard Proenneke retired at age 52, moved to Twin Lakes, Alaska, built a cabin using hand tools and lived there alone for the next 30 years.

He documented his life through film, which PBS airs every now and then entitled "Alone in the Wilderness"

www.dickproenneke.com...

reply to post by sirbadazz


S&F I agree, that's why my bugout plan is to take a trip and never leave the farm.

Originally posted by METACOMET
Richard Proenneke retired at age 52, moved to Twin Lakes, Alaska, built a cabin using hand tools and lived there alone for the next 30 years.

He documented his life through film, which PBS airs every now and then entitled "Alone in the Wilderness"

www.dickproenneke.com...

edit on 22-2-2013 by METACOMET because: (no reason given)

He didn't have 299,999,999 other people wanting his stuff either.

I've already bugged out

So, the way to survival is community and mutual benefit, yet you'd shoot me if I came your way? Kind of pretentious and rude, no?

reply to post by METACOMET


Yup he sure did. It's actually a really cool story! That's over by Lake Clark. It can be done...

Star for you good sir!

reply to post by sirbadazz


I don't have a plan! My plan is to kill you if i find you, then eat you as I call it manifest destiny just like my ancestors did before me "grins" lol but in all seriousness I think even that plan is going to go up in smoke as dangerous people do the same thing as you your bound to run into each other at some point and humans will go territorial then form tribes

reply to post by METACOMET


That's a great story.

There was also a man who bought an island and lived for decades away from society. There is a thread floating around about it somewhere on ATS. So I guess it can be done. lol Unless like that other member above says, it's a whole lot different when you have bandits coming from your stuff.

Regardless, I'm honest enough to admit I'd be toast pretty quickly either way.

The reasons why your "bugout plan" will absolutely fail!,

Awwww, you just dashed the masturbatory dreams of at least half of ATS members that hope and dream of a shtf event.........

Water
Fire
Food
Shelter
Security

Very difficult to cover all of those at all times, alone. The one thing I noticed never seems adequately addressed on those survivor/doomsday prepper shows is medicine/first aid and care.

I missed this part the first time, agree with the sentiment here

save this country and our humanity for the next generation and stop planning how you will roll out and kill bambi and rednecks because you didnt have the heart or courage to stand against out-of-control globalist insanity that caused the fall. community is the only sane path for survival in hard times.

Originally posted by METACOMET
Richard Proenneke retired at age 52, moved to Twin Lakes, Alaska, built a cabin using hand tools and lived there alone for the next 30 years.

He documented his life through film, which PBS airs every now and then entitled "Alone in the Wilderness"

www.dickproenneke.com...

edit on 22-2-2013 by METACOMET because: (no reason given)

Don't forget The Hermit of Gully Lake, Willard Kitchener MacDonald who lived in a secluded hut for nearly 60 years alone in Canada.

Originally posted by MystikMushroom
Don't plants have carbs?

Try coming up here to Alaska. The Inuits up here eat seal, whale, caribou and salmon all winter. I'm not sure where they get their carbs from, as they can't grow anything (permafrost).

People used to (and still do) live in simply log cabins, completley off grid with little to no assistance from the outside world.

When you're living like that, your full-time, 12+ hour a day job is preparing all day, all summer for the coming winter.

You're right though about isolation. It will drive you crazy. This is why the lock people up alone that are really, really bad. We are naturally social creatures.

And I too laugh at "survivalists".

most greens dont have carbs, fruits have simple carbs. animal fat with dried meat and vitamin C are a complete food source when supplimented with seasonal foods that tribes had knowlege of, but not long term.

but dont forget, the inuit ARE A COMMUNITY. the division of labor and protocals for sharing as well as technologies for survival are ancient and ingrained.

my small point here is that if banishment from the tribe is a death sentence to a pre-western contact indian [native american], then it is also a death sentence for a fool with city skills, or even the guys on tv with survival skills. the lone indian HAD full eco-knowlege and would still die when banished. even 'ishi' lived only a few years alone and was at death when he hit white culture [read 'ishi' - the last wild native american's bio]

human need comunities to survive. rural areas will survive with their current communities. bug outs dont work.

if we need communities to survive, then survivalists should acknowlege they have a community already, their country and their countrymen. instead of bugging out to die, WORK NOW TO SAVE YOUR COUNTRY FOR FUTURE GENERATIONS. its every warrior's responsibility to take care of earth and each other for a fututre for our children. rant done. debate on peeps.

reply to post by sirbadazz


Also... With all your ranger skills and native training, what have you done to stand up for this "survival community" the United States?

those that can't live together..
...will die together

WHY ARE YOU CITIZENS OF THIS DEMOCRACY NOT STANDING UP FOR THE SURVIVAL COMMUNITY YOU HAVE ALREADY FORMED - THE UNITED STATES. save this country and our humanity for the next generation

- "Citizens of Democracy" don't exist.
- USA is not a "Survival Community"

reply to post by sirbadazz


Wow you really seem to be stereo typing preppers as some lone idiot with a 3 day pack who heads for the hills and thinks he is going to survive in the wilderness... And you think prepper TV shows represent the average prepper?

Also I think most people know meat is not carbs. Also all greens "ARE" carbs! they are called complex carbs and fruits are simple carbs. If you can't survive more then 3 years with a two acre garden and all your so called skills me thinks you are exaggerating your skills or just plain ignorant of growing food. Most prepper have a plan to raise meat along with their garden and also to work together with others.

What you describe are not preppers they are idiots so it is bit pretentious of you to lump preppers into that category and claim their plans will fail..

Oh almost forgot and why is it you think permaculture doesn't work since you can't even survive on a two acre garden? How many permaculture farms have you visited? And what is your experience level with permaculture?

Seems to me that the best sought out plan for a bad leader is to take them out and replace them with a better leader.
The only problem is there are none,and the one's who could are thought of as crazy.People ain't going to vote for crazy as long as they have bread in they're hands.
Once that is gone,then we can talk about saving what was once a great idea.

reply to post by sirbadazz


This is by far the most ridiculous post I've ever seen in the survival community on ATS.

People are praising this? This is completely silly and everything you state is just plain wrong in so many ways.

I guess all vegans are going to die based on your studies because they don't have meat? What you are saying is vegans and most vegetarians can't live for more than 3 years because, what, gardens can't produce what you need to survive?

If you are able to have a garden to grow crops that aren't heavy carb producers, then there is no reason in hell that you can't grow high carb crops as well. High carb crops are the most resilient crops out there and can be grown in most cases in the coldest of temperatures with minimal soil nutrients. Things like potatoes, carrots, beans, corn, yams, any kind of roots, mushrooms - the list goes on and on and on. Combine those with other nutritious wild foods and vegetables and you could survive indefinitely if you never see the sight of an animal again.

And the talk of communities working together when you want to shoot anyone who wants to join in a community. Kind of self defeating don't you think? What about the people who just want to be left alone? I guess they won't survive if you go out there and actively hunt people for trying to survive, but words of wisdom, anyone bugging out with the skills to do it on their own, will probably off you before you even know where they are - I know I would just based on your attitude.

People live alone all the time. You make it sound impossible. Far from it. I guess if some clown from the city with wild dreams of living off roots and rivers comes running out at first change, they might have a helluva a time - but most people know what they hell they are doing. Obviously you don't. If you did you wouldn't be so wrong on so many fronts. Or maybe your are just trying to scare people and get their hopes done, who knows - either way it is "fail" written in so many words.

I'll be sure to stay away from your "turf" if SHTF, but by the sound of it, I will only have to wait a few years. Once you die off in 1-3 years I'll be able to go in and pick up all the stuff you failed miserably at handling and survive handily, thank you very much.