"Plants" in internet forums

Originally posted by SPECULUM
absolutely. the government would spare no expense to ensure they keep enough confusion going and even going as far as to build fake information data bases to prove their points that they can lead everyone into.

True. But this is a topic about as sensitive as any can get.

Originally posted by DelMarvel

 

Just by the by, dude:

Just to make it clear, dude, I believe there are what the OP calls plants. Do you?

reply to post by ThinkingHuman


I don't see as how it even a matter for debate. I was a site admin in another place with a very large forum. Over a million and a half registered users. Like a lot of public forums we had a debate section. Like most debate sections we had the typical conspiracy related topics. One thing I noticed in my time there were posters who only stuck to topics of a specific subject matter (whereas most people have an opinion about everything). Israel for example. If there was a discussion on site that in any way was associated with Israel, these users would always gravitate towards these topics. Not only that, but they were always the users who took the defensive stance against criticisms against Israel. Bear in mind that as an administrator we had access to ip information, as well as the ability to see who was where on site, and a whole lot more. This site was much more than just a forum, yet these users never accessed any other part of the site except Israeli related topics on our forum. The vast majority of these users had ip addresses issues by Israeli ISPs. It has been widely accepted for quite some time now that both the ADL and the IDF have multiple accounts across multiple sites whos sole job is to shoot down any criticisms posted by members of the general public, and even, where possible, have content removed that is critical of Israel. I've lost count of how many times these morons have flagged up forum posts only to go look and find they have spammed the !Report! button in an attempt to get a particular thread or debate locked or removed.

And that's without even getting into the software doing the rounds that can create accounts AND post replys.

Originally posted by threewisemonkeys

 

they were always the users who took the defensive stance against criticisms against Israel... these users never accessed any other part of the site except Israeli related topics on our forum. The vast majority of these users had ip addresses issues by Israeli ISPs. It has been widely accepted for quite some time now that both the ADL and the IDF have multiple accounts across multiple sites whos sole job is to shoot down any criticisms posted by members of the general public, and even, where possible, have content removed that is critical of Israel. ... spammed the !Report! button in an attempt to get a particular thread or debate locked or removed.

And that's without even getting into the software doing the rounds that can create accounts AND post replies.

Thanks for your input. A real eye-opener. I believe your insight deserves a lot more attention, at least in forums like ATS (kudos to ATS, btw), since it will not be addressed in the MSM.

I wonder if this is limited to Israaeli topics, or if the same is true for other conspiracy discussions. If they try to discredit evidence that links Israel to 9/11 then they will probably also do so with evidence of a 9/11 conspiracy in general.

reply to post by ThinkingHuman


Signs of a Bot/shill/sockpuppets

-Usually multiple aliases from same ip.
-Gangs of aliases that parrot the same narrative(fake consensus,delphi technique) and follow each other around
-fake debates with aliases to lure people in.
-strawman with aliases.
-Non-US ip's that smear people from a rival country of that ip.
-Hackers that spoof your traffic/computer and talk too much about what they know
-Coercive "debate" that breaks down into character attacks and labeling.
-Ignore. type stock response. Repeat.(sockpuppet)
-Always in a certain themed message boards(911 boards)
-Stays logged in all day
-Shows up only when someone posts about a certain term/subject.
-Bumping/starring threads from other aliases(more fake consensus).

How fast did the trolls and or shills get to this thread, page 1

They sure are fast

It is very possible , and maybe even likely. Truth be told though there is probably no need as there exist a lot of narrow-minded people on the internet who believe what they want to believe and love debunking other peoples claims. Regarding your little NWO argument.. . . .I may just be a plant there actually is a lot of good reasons to support such an idea, as no matter what anyone says and no matter how hard it is fought a day will come when it is a reality. A lot of good could come from a united earth, and much could be done without the constant threat of looming tension, and war. The problem is though at the time of this post we just don't know the intentions of the people behind such a plot if there is one at all [and I agree there probably is one] , and the available [albeit] circumstantial evidence points to it being a not so savory group with hideous motives. Still though to deny a united earth with a responsible government truly for the people the benefit of the doubt is in my opinion very narrow-minded.

reply to post by R3nw0x1ng

You are correct that in a One World Government there will be no war. Because nobody will have weapons to defend themselves with. Those who have power will be able to simply get whatever they want from you.

For example, if you own land, guess what, you are told by those powers that it is better for all the people that your land is developed into a shopping mall, and you will get a penny per acre. Of course, the revenue from that mall will go to those powers. if somebody resists the police will enforce the law.

If you drive a car, you will be told by those powers that your car pollutes and it is better for all the people that you stop using it, or pay a "Carbon fee". You know who sells the "carbon credits"? You guessed it, the same power brokers.

All your personal data will be in a computer, it will be analyzed, and when it is calculated that you consume more than you produce, it will be for the good of all people, that your life is terminated.

But you are right there will be no war. And "plants" promote that utopia.

Topics that bring the disinfo agents out, feel free to add:

Aliens
Atlantis
Ascension
Bosnian Pyramids
Chemtrails
Constitutional Changes
Crop Circles
FEMA Camps
GMO
JFK
Lemuria
Libertarians
Meteors increasing
Monsanto
Nibiru
NWO
Ron Paul
911

And yet on many controversial topics they do not appear. Hence you can discern which topics may contain hidden truths, coverups and are important to the PTB, and which topics may be BS or not important.

As I say in every thread like this, there is no need for plants/shills/disinfo agents/etc. the conspiracy theory community is its own worst enemy. Even when we agree there's a conspiracy we devolve into infighting about the specifics. Then we have the people who make their livelihood off these conspiracy theories by coming up with increasingly absurd explanations. While we like to think of ourselves as fighters of truth and justice the reality is that we're a small fraction of the entire population. To the most of the world we just come across as crazy babblers. This isn't due to the work of people like James Randi and Michael Shermer but the continued popularity of people like David Icke. TPTB have nothing to fear from us. So why would they waste resources on a non-issue?

Originally posted by PlanetXisHERE
Topics that bring the disinfo agents out, feel free to add:

Aliens
Atlantis
Ascension
Bosnian Pyramids
Chemtrails
Constitutional Changes
Crop Circles
FEMA Camps
GMO
JFK
Lemuria
Libertarians
Meteors increasing
Monsanto
Nibiru
NWO
Ron Paul
911

And yet on many controversial topics they do not appear. Hence you can discern which topics may contain hidden truths, coverups and are important to the PTB, and which topics may be BS or not important.

Of course, there is a possibility that doesn't involve being a 'shill', a 'disinfo agent', or a 'plant'. Speaking from personal experience, I only post on threads that I find interesting. At risk of seeming crude or insensitive, there are a lot of topics on ATS that I couldn't care less about if I made an effort. I don't say that to insult people who *do* care about said topics, but to point out that it's only reasonable to see certain names hitting certain topics. It's not conspiracy, but converging interest.

This begins to brush against one of the problems with serious conspiracy research...was it Freud who said "Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar"? What conclusion can you draw from the fact that Brother Stormhammer posts a lot in space and aviation related threads? A) He's a government plant sent in to derail and destroy threads showing the Truth About Nibiru/The Moon Landing Hoax/Insert New Theory Here or B) He's a real fan of manned space flight, loves airplanes, and dabbles in amateur astronomy.

The "Plant" accusation gets really, really over-used. In my experience, it's one of the "weapons of last resort" used to support an unsupportable argument. If you can't refute a position, just accuse the poster of being a "Government Plant". It's the conspiracy forum version of "Have you stopped beating your wife?"

I'm a mouse, not a mole. Moles can't see clearly, their vision is bad from being in the dark so long. I'm a white footed mouse, we like nuts and berries......There seems to be a lot of nuts here so I feel at home on ATS

Originally posted by Xcalibur254
. Even when we agree there's a conspiracy we devolve into infighting about the specifics. Then we have the people who make their livelihood off these conspiracy theories by coming up with increasingly absurd explanations.

Really? I didn't know you were into conspiracies, never seen you support one, though I haven't gone through all your posts. Mind sharing a few examples of conspiracies you agree with? I'm just curious, and mind you of course you're under no obligation to reveal yourself..........

reply to post by PlanetXisHERE


I'm interested in the UFO and cryptozoological side of things. Unfortunately, most of what we get here is the same old same old. On top of that, when it comes to these topics, already have preconceived beliefs that they refuse to give up so discussion becomes pointless. I'm particularly interested in the cases of high strangeness involved with these phenomena but on here people are more interested in arguing over whether or not a dot in the sky is from Andromeda. That's generally why I don't participate in those forums. There's nothing for me there.

There are times when I think the moles outnumber the real people.

reply to post by Xcalibur254


Thanks for sharing. So you're saying you're open to the possibility of aliens and bigfoot?

I agree that on both sides, genuine truth seekers and disinfo agents, the emotions and bickering should be toned down and cut-out, and an attempt made to stick to what is being discussed.

Originally posted by Brother Stormhammer

 

The "Plant" accusation gets really, really over-used. In my experience, it's one of the "weapons of last resort" used to support an unsupportable argument. If you can't refute a position, just accuse the poster of being a "Government Plant".

How exactly do you know it is "overused"? Did you ask the poster if they are plants? Did you even count them?

To me it seems that it's the plants who are at their wits ends to explain something inexplicable, who then resort to accusing the one pointing out some inconsistency of being a "conspiracy theorist" or "truther" or "astroturf".

By making such an affirmative statement, do you seek to give the impression that your statement is true beyond dispute? I find that to be laughable.

reply to post by ThinkingHuman


Actually, if anyone is laying claim to some form of "truth beyond dispute", it would be someone making the assumption that any disagreement with their position couldn't possibly stem from evidence, or even an honest difference of interpretation or opinion, but must, due to the indisputable truth of their opinion, must come from 'plants' operating on behalf of undefined external forces.

As you might guess, I'm rather skeptical about 'plants' and 'paid shills'. They don't make a lot or sense to me. Assuming the "Powers that Be" really have some interest in suppressing Truth as revealed in an internet forum, why not just make the posters of such Truth vanish? After all, They can kill Presidents, destroy banks, and subvert governments. Why not normal people? *shrug* Perhaps I'm missing something?

reply to post by Evil_Santa

What I have noticed from a hard-line conspiracy theory group, is that ANYONE who hold different views from that group is automatically called any of the above names. It's sad to see happen, because that group is trying to define their own reality, claiming some kind of moral - and intellectual - superiority, where they demand recognition for their views. And the entire time they're doing that, they are dismissing anyone who has opposing view's experiences, opinions and thoughts on life.

And you don't do that exact same thing to them? Yeah whatever hypocrite.

Originally posted by Brother Stormhammer

 

Actually, if anyone is laying claim to some form of "truth beyond dispute", it would be someone making the assumption that any disagreement with their position couldn't possibly stem from evidence, or even an honest difference of interpretation or opinion, but must, due to the indisputable truth of their opinion,

This describes plants.

As you might guess, I'm rather skeptical about 'plants' and 'paid shills'. They don't make a lot or sense to me.

This describes your own limitation.

Assuming the "Powers that Be" really have some interest in suppressing Truth as revealed in an internet forum, why not just make the posters of such Truth vanish? After all, They can kill Presidents, destroy banks, and subvert governments. Why not normal people? *shrug* Perhaps I'm missing something?

This describes what may happen more and more very soon. They are already killing JOURNALISTS, WHISTLEBLOWERS, and WITNESSES. (are those "NORMAL" people in your view?)

They are stealing from "normal" people through the Federal Reserve - several TRillion $ at a time, and through Corporate "Bail-out" of the "Too Big to Fail" - close to a TRillion $ a time.

They give no advanced warning - and no accountability.

Look at all that Land and Water resources that will become available when hundreds of millions of Americans vanish. They just wait for the right moment to send a flood, pandemic, Nuclear war, or some other kind of "emergency".

Plants keep telling you "They would not do that". How do ou think the plants know?