I'm a felon, I've served my time...can I have my rights back please?

Originally posted by WeAreAWAKE
I'm just gonna spit this out and leave the topic alone. OP...I know nothing about you and your situation, so this may not apply to you at all.

Punishment is for the purpose of deterring the re-occurrence of a crime and to establish a "fear" in many who may consider committing the same crime. There isn't, or at least shouldn't be a "fine" for a violent crime (rape, murder, etc.). The punishment should escalate for individuals who commit the same crime multiple times and the punishment should match the severity of the crime. There can not be a "5 years for rape" applied to every rape regardless or you set a "price" for which rape is valued. A person shouldn't be able to say "I'll do 20 years to kill that jerk". OP...if you lost your rights, which I don't really see that you did, either the court screwed up or you have a longer history than you have divulged here.

At some point, you may loose everything...like your life. In the mean time, your punishment will grow and if you feel that "price" was loosing your rights, maybe that is a justifiable punishment so next time you consider not going for the needle.

edit on 2/19/2013 by WeAreAWAKE because: Mistake

We live in statistically one of the most violent countries on this planet. How has this "instilled fear" worked out for us?

When a person has paid their price, it should be as stated. If not they may as well begin sentencing everyone to 100 years for every infraction.

You sir are a good example of a bad example. People like you make other people realize "I shouldn't do!" because I get punished for violent behavior. If you are truly guilty of a violent offence then you SHOULD be forfeit in your right to bear arms. We have plenty of law abiding citizens without your criminal ass to up hold this country!

Originally posted by LoverBoy
reply to post by DZAG Wright

 

Pro gun here.....only difference is I actually passed my background check. To break that down a little bit for you, I never got drunk and sucker punched someone who was in an altercation with someone else. If thats even how he ended up serving time which I highly doubt.

How do you know he sucker punched him? Did he even swing first?

If an officer mistakes you for someone and questions you a little rough, grabbing your arm and you snatch your arm away. They can hit you with a violence on a LEO charge and you are now a felon.

The biggotry, selfishness and arrogance on this site is amazing...

reply to post by onequestion

he had a broken cheek bone but it literally resulted in a black eye and no further medical treatment.

I'm guessing it resulted in no further medical treatment because the person you hit didn't have good health insurance. I got hit once by some big thug and he broke my cheek bone, and let me tell you it's very far from just a black eye. It hurt like hell. Luckily I had good health insurance at the time and was able to go to a plastic surgeon to have the bone repaired. If gone untreated, I was told, my cheek could cave and cause disfiguration. You've spent a lot of time here trying to belittle you're crime while showing absolutely no remorse. "But I only hit him once," is not a valid argument, especially since you were a professional fighter at the time.

Nah i would never hurt someone unless it was either fight or flight or during an extremely explosive and high stress situation.

Really!? Define extremely explosive and high stress situations.

Even then i wouldnt really hurt anyone you know what i mean, i would do what i had to though, as would anyone.

No, I don't know what you mean. But it sounds like you're admitting that you are prone to violence. Hate to break it you, but life if full of extremely explosive and high stress situations, and most people don't end up in the slammer as a result. I really wanted to be sympathetic with you on this thread, but you're making it pretty difficult.

Im now nearing my thirties and its been almost five years. (maybe not long enough)

As your previos posts indicate, not long enough.

Im also angry because of the way i get treat during a routine traffic stop.

I find the best way to avoid being hassled by the cops is to not give them cause to pull you over. It's not like they know you're a felon beforehand. Again, you're not giving a very convincing argument as to why you should have your rights reinstated. How often are the police pulling you over?

It sounds like if you want your rights back, you're going to have to work for them, something that previous posters have told you is an option. Stay clean and convince the judge that you're no longer a threat to socienty, though based on your comments I'd say you're not ready for that, or you better have a damn good lawyer. Realize that not everyone "loses control sometimes" and puts people in the hospital by punching their face in during an alcohol fueled fight. And lastly, forget about ever owning a gun. Not going to happen, and that's something I completely agree with.

reply to post by DZAG Wright


Oh is that what happened to the OP? Didn't think so.

Originally posted by schuyler
OK. Let's pretend. Let's pretend OP actually pays attention to some of the suggestions posted here, petitions the governor, and gets his "rights" restored. Now he can own a gun. He can vote. He can serve on a jury. Anything else need to be restored? Well, let's make sure that happens, too.

So, from this sentence forward, he has all his rights restored.

Everybody happy now? OP happy? You did the crime, did your time, and your rights are restored. You paid, but it's over. It's history. So all you people who say, "He should not be punished for the rest of his life." now get your way. His rights are the same as yours and mine.

So what has changed?

It's history, but it's recorded history. His rights are completely restored, but his conviction is not erased from the history books. It's still there. I still have the right to know what happened. I also have the right to react to him based on my knowledge. I have the right to NOT hire him. I have the right to NOT associate with him. There's no law that says I can't do those things. There's no law that insists I hire him. There's no moral code that suggests such either. It's not about his skin color; it's about something he did. I have the right to discriminate against him.

You see, I think a lot of you folks are misinterpreting the word "rights". It does not mean what you think it means. For half the people here his "rights" are theoretical. You have no wish to own a gun. You don't vote anyway, and you don't want to serve on a jury. If those rights were taken away from you, you wouldn't even notice they were gone.

This "punishment for life" has nothing to do with his rights and everything to do with my rights to know what he did, which, by virtue of the web and computers, is easy for me to find out, and my right to react as I see fit. Are you saying I do not have these rights?

Actually according to this www.eeoc.gov... you do not have the right to discriminate against him.

Your last paragraph is something I am currently working on. I'm not a felon and I don't believe anyone has the Right to know everything about anyone else. See that's a lie that has been instilled in our society for some time now.

Your Rights end when they impose on someone elses...

Originally posted by schuyler

Originally posted by bigfatfurrytexan

We've been talking about Constitutional rights. Where in the Constitution is there a "right" to work? It isn't there. You made up that right. Nobody owes you a job and you can work for yourself.

Yes, WE do. We have the right to judge character and make decisions accordingly. We have the right to assess risk and act accordingly. Your insurer has the right to protect itself against your poor decisions by holding your feet to the fire and forcing you to not hire felons. If you did and your hire committed a crime against your customer, you could get sued and your insurance agency would have to pay the claim, which would be a lot more if it came out that you knew ahead of time that you hired a felon. You have the right to find different insurance, too. And you have the right to lobby your insurer to allow you to hire only the right kind of felon. You don't have to remain passive here.

The point is that I am allowed to make a judgement. I'm allowed to assess character to protect myself or my company. That YOU don't agree with my decision doesn't matter to me because you are not the one taking the risk. I am. If the worse happens, it makes no never mind to you, but I am at substantial risk. If you want to get yourself into a position where you must assess risk to you, your company, and your fellow employees whereby if you make the wrong call, you are liable, and you still want desperately to hire felons, I have no problem with that. But if the worst happens, and you are the one who made the decision, it's you I'm coming after.

Do you have a problem with these felons and now people with misdemeanors, riding government assistance then? I mean you have no problem not giving them a job right?

reply to post by TKDRL


Three? Well, good for you, glad you're keeping count!

Good luck!

reply to post by schuyler


Well, leaving the 14th amendment out of it (and all the arguements made pertaining to its guarantee of a right to work), let me ask you this: if a person has a right to life, then would that person not also have a right to support that life? If not, then what right to life does a person have? It is the same as the gun argument: if you have a right to live, you have a right to defend that life. In just the same way that you have a right to support that life.

If all men are created equal, and have a right to the pursuit of life, liberty, and happiness....would that not be contingent upon finding an ability to feed yourself? To seek economic opportunity to support that life, to secure that liberty, and to ensure that happiness?

It would seem that you have made a fine argument for the creation of a second class of citizen.

RE: the 1200 hot check.....people get in financial trouble. If left with the option of writing that hot check or having a loved one continue to suffer from lack of medications, etc....

I guess my point is, a hot check for 1200 bucks is something that I care far, far less about. And to call a measely grand a "felony" is beyond ridiculous any way.

As the person who controls the HR and Accounting functions for my corporation, I can honestly say this: if my controls are poor enough that someone could embezzle from me, i am not doing my job. I can tell you, to the penny, who has done what on any given day.

To hide behind the insurer is difficult for me to digest. It would seem to me that insurance, in a nation where everyone wants to hit the litigation lottery, is a must. This has, unfortunately, driven a nation where risk aversion is considerd a viable business model....unless you are an investment banker. Why should I be accountable for the actions of an employee? Having gone through hours of Civil Treatment, I can rattle off the patent answers for that question. But i am not buying them.

Individual responsibility. Personal accountability. These are terms I was raised with. They are terms I live by. And it seems as though I am too old fashoined because of it.

reply to post by schuyler


I would add that "working for yoruself" is a joke. In a nation that is unionized to the hilt, with regulations from multiple governmental entities dictating how a business will operate, and with vultures looking for gaps in indemnity, working for yourself has become something that only kids with lawnmowers can really do.

Especially in a town where education has not been promoted, there are only about 30k people, and no shortage of "handy men". yeah....that will really ensure the pursuit of life, liberty, and happiness. We might as well let them eat cake!

reply to post by headforthehills


I dealt with a gentleman at my office where his daughter an 18 year old in high school was slapped with a felony because herself and some other girls egged another girls car. Something about the damage was more than a certain amount making it a felony.

People you all can't avoid and ignore this for too much longer....IT WILL HIT YOUR FRONT DOOR!

This is a upper/middle class white family. Her father is a well known businessman in the city.

Originally posted by Brimichl
You sir are a good example of a bad example. People like you make other people realize "I shouldn't do!" because I get punished for violent behavior. If you are truly guilty of a violent offence then you SHOULD be forfeit in your right to bear arms. We have plenty of law abiding citizens without your criminal ass to up hold this country!

Will those other law abiding citizens have the heart/guts to use that gun even if it's necessary to defend someone? Or will they be like the OP's friend who I bet has a clean record, but he's a coward?

You want a conspiracy, here's one: The government is trying to take the Gun Rights of as many people with the guts to do something against them as possible. Most of the people who have guns and have kept the straight narrow talk a good one, but wouldn't have the heart to actually shoot someone even in self-defense and I've seen it. I've seen a man get his gun taken from him and he pistol whipped with it.

Originally posted by LoverBoy
reply to post by DZAG Wright

 

Oh is that what happened to the OP? Didn't think so.

Nice side-step and avoidance...

I was applying it to YOU!

Would you sit as high on your horse if you as simply snatch your arm back from an over aggressive officer and get a battery on leo charge?

Or are you so docile that someone can walk up and slap the # out of your kid and you just scream for help ?

Originally posted by onequestion
reply to post by NoJoker13

 

If you want a snapshot of my personality you can get one from reading my profile. I have been on ATS for a few years, almost the entire time i was going through this ordeal. From a lot of my posts and threads you may get a sense of my state of mind as well as the evolution of such.

This is the exact avoidance I'm talking about. I'm sure you can put together an outline of the crime, if you can't then your clearly guilty. You didn't answer a single question I asked, not one.

reply to post by DZAG Wright


Maybe try a few more what if's. I don't get myself in situations where LEO's have to grab my arm. You keep bringing this what if up a lot, does it happen to you often? Maybe you need to take a step back and think hmm, what am I doing to keep putting myself in this situation. Ill wait while you attemp to think of a different what if now.

I don't know where you live but I have yet to see a random person walk up and slap someone's child. I do like good comedy though so keep up the what if's, you can do better than that strawman.

reply to post by DZAG Wright


There's a reason they are making him prove his stability. He's a violent offender. Let him wait. A felony related to violence is a pretty big deal. Maybe he's a pedo? woman beater? a rapist? child hurter? Those are pretty big in my book.. I'd rather see those types of man dead in a ditch.

I just want to leave this here for all the people saying "He served his sentence man, what else do you want?"

Losing your rights is part of your #ing sentence. I've been charged for committing some crimes which I did not fight against since I obviously was behind them, and I will say, the sentence I was given was definitely far less than what I deserved.

Originally posted by AnonyWarp
what if tomorrow they pass a law saying : wearing black pants is a crime

how many people will decide to cast the first stone, saying "OP is an animal he deserve to be caged, he wore black pants " ?

I must say, i am a bit lost on that one!

How can a pair of black pants smash someone in the gob leading to a broken cheek bone?

Although, i wouldn't go as far as treating or judging the OP as an animal as only he knows the real reason why this fight took place, maybe someone had a go at him first and he was defenfing himself, maybe someone was having a go at his girlfriend, family etc... (This happened to me many years ago when a big rugby player type bloke tried to bop my girlfriend, i am much smaller and just layed straight into him and nutted him in the face... He ended up with a broken nose but didn't press charges against me as he started first (and especially tried to assault my GF))... Does this make me an animal?

To top things off, the police arrived on the scene and he ran away but the police managed to catch up with him... What was surprising was that when he was brought back, he also had a split lip, couple of very swollen and bruised eyes and was limping quite badly... The policeman winked at me and said "Oh, he just fell over when we were running after him"!

The OP has payed for his errors and should have all of his rights back, apart from the gun ownership rights until otherwise proved that he is safe to own by a panel of specialised psychiatrists IMO

Kindest respects

Rodinus

Can you explain to me why in the United States in this day and age I have to have an argueement to have rights?

Your point. Of view in this topic is a joke. If your alive you have rights period. Otherwise... I'm tired of working my ass off to pay taxes to protect your rights while I do t have those same rights.

I just can't believe who people think they are making me defend my god given rights as a human being as defined by the constitution.

I also can't believe the audacity of the people here who think they are of a hirer jugement the. The courts to question the details of my case.

Who do you think you are? Get real. You don't deserve to question only my god or my higher authority has the right to question me. You know nothing.