No Proof is NO PROOF for Inexistence of God.

So, according to the premise of the original posting of this thread, there is a 50% chance a god exists. I just don't get the point of going around saying "maybe" a god exists and "maybe" he doesn't. Reading the replies to the thread it's apparent most people agree with me. I read a lot of "God exists and I know it" posts and a lot of "God doesn't exist and is a myth" replies. It seems this is a rather sore subject with folks.

The way I see it, both belief and non belief in a god take just as much faith. Religious people have the faith that there is a power higher than themselves that can't be seen, or measured or studied in a lab; but they know it's there, because they have faith that they can feel or have a relationship with something greater than themselves. Many people have been killed because they would not renounce their faith- now that's believing in something, if you ask me. Then the atheist has his faith in himself, science, things that can be seen, touched, measured. And I wouldn't be surprised if more than a few atheists have been put to death over the years for their beliefs (or non belief, however you want to phrase it).

Bottom line: I don't think people can help what they believe. They just believe it, or they don't. And you can't convince anyone to believe what you believe. The most convincing argument in the world to one person is totally illogical and flawed to another. Try convincing yourself there is a Santa Claus, or there are monsters under your bed- it's not going to happen.

That leaves me wondering what is the purpose of this thread? To convince people to believe there "maybe" a god? To incite people against one another? That I don't know.

reply to post by chrome413


So at this point in time, a thousand people are either screwed or they aren't. And by that, I mean they're screwed by a god who they couldn't give a bowel movement less about. How many of those people want to take their chances? I can show you a few Facebook pages that are heavily populated right now with people who have had it up to their necks with the crap their fellow man pulls in the name of righteousness and "the one true god."

It's come down to either you're a theist and you're a complete douchebag, or you're an atheist and you have only your word and your code, which means that you determine the worth of your life because once it's over, it's over. And people are really beginning to see that as a more practical view.

So what's Logical7's argument against that, eh? What's he got to convince these people that his "God" is more practical?

So I've been thinking. Please be kind, as I am dumb.

On the outside it seems like the the basic premise of the OP works. "No Proof is NO PROOF for Inexistence of God." But if no proof is not proof for God not existing, it also cannot be proof that God exists. But then the thread goes on and on about the proof of God's existence.

Now I'm not saying I believe or don't believe. That's irrelevant to the point I'm trying to get across. What I am saying though, is that how does someone post a statement that is basically 50/50 on existence of God and then ignore their logical reasoning in the original post to go on claim that God does exist in later posts?

Seems the whole thread has gone off track to me. I read the OP several times and I come to this conclusion, based on the logic of the OP: Nobody can know with any certainty if there is a God, or is not a God. Therefore, everyone of the billions of people on planet Earth are in "wait and see mode"- basically waiting for death to find out if there is a God (and if there is, if they are going to hell).

reply to post by chrome413


So this entire thread is pointless?

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by chrome413

 

So at this point in time, a thousand people are either screwed or they aren't. And by that, I mean they're screwed by a god who they couldn't give a bowel movement less about. How many of those people want to take their chances? I can show you a few Facebook pages that are heavily populated right now with people who have had it up to their necks with the crap their fellow man pulls in the name of righteousness and "the one true god."

Who cares? Numbers dont = truth, that's an argumentum ad populum.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


The direction of the thread certainly doesn't coincide with the logic of the OP. I kind of think the one who wrote the OP is also the one who derailed it all.

reply to post by chrome413

The direction of the thread certainly doesn't coincide with the logic of the OP. I kind of think the one who wrote the OP is also the one who derailed it all.

I wonder where Logical7 found the ladder? To get out of the hole s/he dug, I mean.

Wise move. It's never a good idea to linger on a sinking ship.

Wow another thread about the existence of god.

God is a figment of mans imagination, no proof of god means there is nothing to indicate that a god exists.

Atheists do not have a belief system we have an accumulation of scientific knowledge.

Theists talk of proof but never offer a shred of it. They bring up NDE's in false hope but they are explainable events.

It baffles me how people can be so stupid as to dismiss an observable fact such as evolution as far too unlikely to be possible yet happily accept that an invisible entity has always existed and created everything.

There's more horse s**t in religion than there is horse meat in Findus beef lasagne.

And Islam is the worst of the lot, the bastard child of christianity which in turn is the bastard child of judaism. Yet each one claim that there's is the true faith even though they are all interlinked. The non-prophet muhammad piss be upon him was just a con man with power. He told people he was receiving instructions from god purely so they would do what he wanted them to do.

reply to post by Wonders


You are totally correct. I should have said The Bible as we know it today, or Jesus’ “Bible” was not unlike my Old Testament copy. His “Bible” varied in number of books, and their order, but not in content.

Then Jesus too had some of the Old Testament scriptures before the modern church changed it, and removed books. (What i believe) Still, i have not written off the Bible as i believe He guides me in scripture when i get a bit stuck

What i am trying to say is that Jesus walked earth "talking" to our Father with prayer/meditation. He didn't need the Bible to walk in His Father's path with complete trust and confidence, He is the Son of our Creator.

Thank you for bringing this up. Never too old to learn

I own and have a personal relationship with an invisible unicorn which no one, not even me can see, feel, taste, touch or hear or even experience in any tangible way. And if I telepathically accept it as my master it will reward me with eternal life (Only after I die of course.)

So because you can't prove me wrong, I have a 50% chance of being correct?

reply to post by KaelemJames


No jesus wasn't the son of any creator unless you count man's imagination.

There isn't even any reliable proof jesus existed, if he was so important surely there would be some evidence.

You do realise the bible was written decades after jesus supposedly died don't you?

You're right about one thing though, you're never too old to learn, Put down that stupid bible and buy a science book with some actual researched facts written in it. Aren't you getting too old for fairytales.

reply to post by GafferUK1981

Atheists do not have a belief system we have an accumulation of scientific knowledge.

Technically, I am not a theist. But I wouldn't count myself as atheist either. There's a certain lack of spiritual sophistication involved in atheism, something that I feel hinders the ability to really understand the universe.

With that said, science doesn't know everything:

8 Questions Science Hasn't Answered

3 Mysteries Science Can't Solve

2 More Questions Science Has Difficulty With

reply to post by AfterInfinity


Can you say for certain that god did it to any of those questions or do you believe that one day man will find the real answer?

if this thread has shown anything its that atheists can be just as narrow minded and hostile as the backwoods Christians that you degrade constantly. its like you guys are just hovering over your computers salivating waiting for one of these threads to open up so you can put in your two cents. I don't think I read a single positive statement from any of you.

reply to post by GafferUK1981

Can you say for certain that god did it to any of those questions or do you believe that one day man will find the real answer?

I never said any god did it. You said science has all the answers you need, and I replied that science seems to be a little behind. I mean, you want to look to science for all your answers...modern Homo Sapiens has existed for 500,000 years approximately. How much do you expect us to know? We're just a teenage species. Our science is only as good as we are. People keep forgetting that.

I believe one day man will be surprised by the answers, just like we were when we found out the Earth was not the center of the universe, the Sun doesn't revolve around the Earth, the Earth is actually round, and everything else those radical scientists like Galileo and Copernicus told us.

Most of my life has been lived through the eyes of an atheist, I was not born in to any particular religion. For a very long time I was obsessed by the though of proving that god does not exist as soon as someone mentioned it. It made me feel very insecure and afraid I suppose, the fear of gods existence. I didn't believe in life after death, reincarnation or any such thing.

The change came to me as I lay pondering about death and my fear of it, how you everyday take all kinds of precautions to avoid it, we pay a high price for it sometimes like loss of liberty, happiness and many more little things. This little glimmer of a thought me feel unhappy and unsatisfied with the way I had lived up to that moment, how I had let my fears control me and hold me back from doing what I really wanted to do. The inevitable conclusion of all this is, of course, the question "Why live then?" it didn't consider suicide I should say, it was merely a self-reflecting thought that acquired momentum.

The quote "Seize the day" came to mind and that if you don't cling to your fear of death all the time you can actually do exactly what you want to, even that which would seem to be only a remote dream becomes possible. If you live each moment as one you can truly be proud of then there will be no moment for your death to be in vain. After this experience my fear of death was greatly diminished, not completely extinguished, I'm still working on that to this day but I feel much more alive. You are only what you are at this moment, the power to be is always there.

This led me to the belief we defy death all the time in our dreams and if we die in our dreams, we wake up. I believe the same principle applies to physical death, when we die we wake up, but in another body. What does this have to do with god? Maybe nothing, maybe everything. I believe god is everything and it gives me peace, since when I didn't believe it gave me fear. I don't adhere to any particular religion, I just am. I still very much enjoy science I just don't see it as a way to find or invalidate the existence of god. What we get when we search for answers are just more questions?

Whether or not god exist is irrelevant as my life will still have been lived to the fullest extent, with infinite possibilities, we are god maybe not the complete being manifested into a human body but we used to be that singular manifestation.

Originally posted by GafferUK1981
reply to post by KaelemJames

 

No jesus wasn't the son of any creator unless you count man's imagination.

There isn't even any reliable proof jesus existed, if he was so important surely there would be some evidence.

You do realise the bible was written decades after jesus supposedly died don't you?

You're right about one thing though, you're never too old to learn, Put down that stupid bible and buy a science book with some actual researched facts written in it. Aren't you getting too old for fairytales.

edit on 14-2-2013 by GafferUK1981 because: (no reason given)

Actually, you may want to be the one to research some actual facts. There is plenty of reliable historical evidence that Jesus did exist. I make no claims to his deity, but Jesus, the man, did in fact exist. And since you're never too old to learn, do a simple Google search on the subject.

reply to post by Konoyaro


Your fear-inspired assumptions do not mean a thing and it's simply a coping mechanism to counteract your own weakness, a pointless phobia of your own inevitable demise. When we die, we die and that's it. Not a single tangible thing would suggest otherwise, and everything suggests that we simply cease to be.

I hear this "ENRGY CANT BE DESTROYED ONLY TRANSFERED!!!!" # all of the time from afterlife proponents. And they're right it can't. But "You" aren't energy in any sense of the word which goes beyond the physical processes that cause you to be. Once you die, you decay into the ground and the energy that was you (e.g. Your brain which forms your consciousness within the confines of your skull alone) is aborbed into the soil and turned into trees, worms, nitrate for plants and whatever else. That's it.

reply to post by sajuek

I hear this "ENRGY CANT BE DESTROYED ONLY TRANSFERED!!!!" # all of the time from afterlife proponents. And they're right it can't. But "You" aren't energy in any sense of the word which goes beyond the physical processes that cause you to be. Once you die, you decay into the ground and the energy that was you (e.g. Your brain which forms your consciousness within the confines of your skull alone) is aborbed into the soil and turned into trees, worms, nitrate for plants and whatever else. That's it.

And where does the energy go from there? Please, explain to me all about how much you know without your PhD in biology and physics.

reply to post by sajuek
I must say you seem fairly aggressive in your statement. Do you think that after this spiritual journey I've taken to arrive at this conclusion that has deep meaning to me will succumb to that uninspiring comment?

Though my story maybe short, it was not so short a moment that inspired me but several hours of contemplation, and many events led up to those hours of contemplation. That being said neither of us can prove either persons assertion to what the truth is. What is fact though I will not go back to your side of thinking again, I stand by my statement, there is peace here for me.

What I can say though is that when I die I don't believe I will be reincarnated as what I now call myself but rather a completely different person. Consciousness is all the same only interpreted subjectively through your brain.

"“Try to imagine what it will be like to go to sleep and never wake up... now try to imagine what it was like to wake up having never gone to sleep.” - Alan Watts