Vampires, Christianity, and The Vatican

a reply to: Muffenstuff

Yes Ezra the scribe could have been the culprit. Solomon mimicked Egypt's Amenhotep III life, his temple called aKom el-Hettân.

a reply to: glend

Texts like the collection of myths of origin in Genesis, develops over time. Apparently. There can be many reasons for this, like how good storytellers tend to change the stories slightly for the stories to become more vivid, and then we have the oral tradition you mention and like I said how things like politics and ruling clans change over time. However, speaking of the Bible and Torah in particular, there are many mechanisms in motion to secure the texts' accuracy over time, and it seems to have worked quite fine considering.

There are several meters in motion and things like gematria and how many of the texts contain further ciphering, some would typically remember the number of letters between every instance of את (AT), the odd word in Hebrew that marks the direct object, others would know the whereabouts of every instance of the Tetragrammaton יהוה. And so on. People all over society would memorise parts of the story, letter by letter, dot by dot.

They really put a lot of efforts into making the Torah as kosher as they could. There is hardly any difference in the text between the Leningrad-codex and the Stuttgartensia for instance, and they even sport full Mesora. These traditions of memorising Torah still goes on to this day, right now some Hashiddim is sitting bent over his Torah, memorising every last bit of his part, absorbing the texts, bringing these ancient texts to life, like sparks of heaven carried in clay vessels from one part of the world to the other.

The early Christians soon started writing their books in codices, and in times of trouble they could rip out the pages and distribute parts of these texts and transmit them orally avoiding keeping any hard copies in order to dodge the Romans and people like Saulus. When things would calm down again, they would come together and write them down again for safekeeping in libraries and chests.

a reply to: Utnapisjtim

"myths of origin in Genesis, develops over time"

Perhaps not, if writers of Torah being Egyptian-Jews saw Egyptian history as their own, then a large part of the origin myths might be based on Egyptian history. For example if Moses was actually Thutmose, the eldest son of Pharaoh Amenhotep III, who implemented egypts first monotheist religion it would explain why Thutmose, a high priest, disappeared from public records. And its perhaps not coincidental that a plague during during Amenhotep III reign that is thought to be the first recorded epidemic of influenza swept through Egypt killing thousands described here.

The Torah creation myth might be embellished somewhat but it could all be based on fact. We just need try unravel it from their point of view (egyptian-jew mindset).

And to keep the thread on topic, I doubt Thutmose was a vampire.

a reply to: glend

I believe Moses planned his people's revenge and poisoned the Egyptian firstborns during the annual festivals connected to the Nile floodings where «the sons of the gods» (Egyptian first born sons) would be celebrated each year. It would be fairly simple to do since all the servants were Moses' subjects and they had plenty traditional Egyptian poisons available they could choose from. There would be special foods only available to these lads. Remember that Moses was a survivor from when Pharaoh killed all firstborns among the Hebrews. It was revenge.

To stay further on topic, I doubt Moses was a vampire.

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: glend

I believe Moses planned his people's revenge and poisoned the Egyptian firstborns during the annual festivals connected to the Nile floodings where «the sons of the gods» (Egyptian first born sons) would be celebrated each year. It would be fairly simple to do since all the servants were Moses' subjects and they had plenty traditional Egyptian poisons available they could choose from. There would be special foods only available to these lads. Remember that Moses was a survivor from when Pharaoh killed all firstborns among the Hebrews. It was revenge.

To stay further on topic, I doubt Moses was a vampire.

You do realize that Moses story is a composite of Sargon, Akhenaten and others and not a historical person right?

Aside from him not being a vampire he also wasn't a real person.

Do you realize this or no? You seem to be implying he was real, most dont speculate on composite historically fictitious characters so I am guessing you actually believe that he existed.

Abraham (before redaction/editing) drank blood, ate flesh and sacrificed his son to Moloch. MLCH-ZDK was a priest of Moloch considered righteous. Before the editing.

Although not a historical person (Abe) this is not speculation.

a reply to: Muffenstuff

No, I am not aware of that. Why would I be? It's nonsense. Moses was Moses, a mythical man of God who is believed to have freed a bunch of Israelites from Egyptian captivity some 3000 years ago and made for them a primitive system of bronze age law that certain people still are trying to live by without realising the law was designed for that purpose, self-riddance and mind control.

originally posted by: Utnapisjtim
a reply to: Muffenstuff

No, I am not aware of that. Why would I be? It's nonsense. Moses was Moses, a mythical man of God who is believed to have freed a bunch of Israelites from Egyptian captivity some 3000 years ago and made for them a primitive system of bronze age law that certain people still are trying to live by without realising the law was designed for that purpose, self-riddance and mind control.

because its useful when people challenge your grasp of historical mythology crossed with ancient cultural literature and you can just pull out a bibliography complete with places, dates, and transliterative trail. then you dont have to look like a contrarian douche (not that you are one). people might lose interest after the first ten minutes of connecting dots for them but at least you had your facts in a bag.

a reply to: glend

Problems with the logic of current text suggest an alternative explanation. Genesis 16:16 states Abraham was eighty-six years old when Ishmael was born, Genesis 21:5 states Abraham was one hundred years old when Isaac was born. Yet Genesis 22:2 states "Take your son, your only son, whom you love—Isaac—and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on a mountain I will show you.”

Its possible that the Genesis 22:2 originally quoted "first born son" (being Ishmael) who incidentally had twelve sons that might have been the true fathers of the original twelve tribes.

When the Torah was rediscovered in 600BC (2 Kings 22:8), or more likely reappeared from behind closed doors, it could have been modified to successfully complete a deuteronomic reform of the land by elevating the people (then isaacs lineage in Torah) to Gods special people. The ego of humans being such, it would have been swallowed hook, line and sinker.

And Genesis 21:14-21 has Abraham sending his wife Sarah's maid, Hagar, away (and Hagar bare Abram Ishmael, according to Genesis 16:16).

"And Abraham rose up early in the morning, and took bread, and a bottle of water, and gave it unto Hagar, putting it on her shoulder, and the child, and sent her away: and she departed, and wandered in the wilderness of Beersheba.
And the water was spent in the bottle, and she cast the child under one of the shrubs.
And she went, and sat her down over against him a good way off, as it were a bowshot: for she said, Let me not see the death of the child. And she sat over against him, and lift up her voice, and wept.
And God heard the voice of the lad; and the angel of God called to Hagar out of heaven, and said unto her, What aileth thee, Hagar? fear not; for God hath heard the voice of the lad where he is.
Arise, lift up the lad, and hold him in thine hand; for I will make him a great nation.
And God opened her eyes, and she saw a well of water; and she went, and filled the bottle with water, and gave the lad drink.
And God was with the lad; and he grew, and dwelt in the wilderness, and became an archer.
He lived in the wilderness of Paran, and his mother took a wife for him from the land of Egypt."

It does not appear Abraham loved Ishmael to send Hagar away (and Hagar apparently took Ishmael).

An interesting match between Abraham's apparently 2nd Isaac is where he dwelt after Abraham died.

"And it came to pass after the death of Abraham, that God blessed his son Isaac; and Isaac dwelt by the well Lahairoi."
~ Genesis 25:11

Apparently, when Hagar found out she was pregnant, it was near a fountain of water, the well, Beerlahairoi.

"And Sarai said unto Abram, My wrong be upon thee: I have given my maid into thy bosom; and when she saw that she had conceived, I was despised in her eyes: the LORD judge between me and thee.
But Abram said unto Sarai, Behold, thy maid is in thy hand; do to her as it pleaseth thee. And when Sarai dealt hardly with her, she fled from her face.
And the angel of the LORD found her by a fountain of water in the wilderness, by the fountain in the way to Shur.
And he said, Hagar, Sarai's maid, whence camest thou? and whither wilt thou go? And she said, I flee from the face of my mistress Sarai.
And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Return to thy mistress, and submit thyself under her hands.And the angel of the LORD said unto her, I will multiply thy seed exceedingly, that it shall not be numbered for multitude.
And the angel of the LORD said unto her, Behold, thou art with child, and shalt bear a son, and shalt call his name Ishmael; because the LORD hath heard thy affliction.
And he will be a wild man; his hand will be against every man, and every man's hand against him; and he shall dwell in the presence of all his brethren.
And she called the name of the LORD that spake unto her, Thou God seest me: for she said, Have I also here looked after him that seeth me?
Wherefore the well was called Beerlahairoi; behold, it is between Kadesh and Bered."
~ Genesis 16:5-14

So it may have been the seeds spread by Isaac and Ishmael were not far apart.

Seems there are 3 major nations from the lineage of Abraham.

Seems not only Jacob and Esau (Israel and Edom) were the 2 major nations to come from these myths,
but also Ishmael (a wild card?)

a reply to: Grifter42

I believe the myth of the vampire was a counter action designed by groups defined as heretics and renegades by the church. They made a blueprint of the Church and identified themselves with the gothic vampire. He did the same things as the Church and they held similar myths and dogma as the Church, but since they were in opposition to the Church they were demonised. They would both drink blood, and this was how they obtained eternal lives, but where the Church would only do this symbolically, the idea was that these undead vampires were the enemy since they would do it for real, real blood, real puncture marks, fangs, Transylvania, cloaks and daggers. I think these stories were folklore kept alive by people who saw the Church as hypocrites and make-believers. Confronted with themselves, the Church didn't realise what they sent people out to destroy with torches and pitchforks-- were themselves. The Church.

From vampire sightings topic:

originally posted by: DarknessForever


Yes, there is something I would like to personally share. It's basically the vampire origin legend. It was told to me by a much older vampire. It dates back around 3000 BC some were in Europe. it was passed down orally through generations, so I'm not sure how true this really is, but then again vampire generations are much longer than yours.

A long time ago there was barbaric warrior tribe that followed a cult religion in which they worshiped a powerful demon. Their leader asked the demon for supernatural power and eternal youth, and his wish was granted and the only thing he needed to sustain him self was the blood of his enemies, and those who drank from him would become like him. Then he turned his Friends and best solders into vampires, and they started to destroy and pillage other villages and tribes. Until they came upon a village where there lived a man who worshiped the one true god and he prayed out for the horror to be undone, and then god cursed all vampires to hide in the shadows forever by blessing the sun to burn us away.

There leader was tricked form the beginning vampires may not age, but man kind is doomed to die out one day. When they do vampires will have no blood to drink and we will all starve to death, and since are bodies and souls are as one when we die the soul dies with the body, unlike normal people whose soul goes on after death.

originally posted by: Grifter42
Two thousand years ago, a man died, and rose from the dead as a revenant. Now, as to the origins of this revenant, people will argue. People will bicker, and claim that this act of rising from the grave itself was some how holy.
If you look at it outside of the context of religion, however, it seems to fit the myth of the revenant. The undead.
The legend of the bloodsucking vampire.

You see, crucifying would not kill a vampire. Jesus was stabbed in the side with the spear of Longinus, but never in the heart. After Christ rises from the tomb, without witness, except for alleged angels, he only makes shadowy appearances. In my opinion, he fled the tomb in the night. Moving aside the boulder with the unnatural strength of the vampire. He then passed down the secret through the disciples. The first church being founded by Peter would go on to continue the traditions.

I believe that of the sects of Christianity, the true corrupt heart of this ancient lie is within the Vatican. Within this heart of darkness lies numerous secrets and eldritch horrors. Beings of perhaps centuries of age, debauched and savage. There are many tombs and catacombs for such to hide inside. The question remains as to whether the pope himself might be a vampire, but the man behind the pope who manipulates him is almost certainly one.

Viewed in a different light, Christianity appears as a death cult, centered around drinking the consecrated blood of an undead. In myth, drinking the blood of a vampire is enough to enslave mortals. Through ancient pact, this remains much the same effect. Modern religion has watered down the religion, but the catholic church is still ran by blood suckers. The rest of Christianity is just sort of cargo cult religion.

The truth will come out.

Vampire: The Masquerade 5th Edition Sabbat The Black Hand, coming soon!

originally posted by: Suiren
From vampire sightings topic:

originally posted by: DarknessForever


Yes, there is something I would like to personally share. It's basically the vampire origin legend. It was told to me by a much older vampire. It dates back around 3000 BC some were in Europe. it was passed down orally through generations, so I'm not sure how true this really is, but then again vampire generations are much longer than yours.

A long time ago there was barbaric warrior tribe that followed a cult religion in which they worshiped a powerful demon. Their leader asked the demon for supernatural power and eternal youth, and his wish was granted and the only thing he needed to sustain him self was the blood of his enemies, and those who drank from him would become like him. Then he turned his Friends and best solders into vampires, and they started to destroy and pillage other villages and tribes. Until they came upon a village where there lived a man who worshiped the one true god and he prayed out for the horror to be undone, and then god cursed all vampires to hide in the shadows forever by blessing the sun to burn us away.

There leader was tricked form the beginning vampires may not age, but man kind is doomed to die out one day. When they do vampires will have no blood to drink and we will all starve to death, and since are bodies and souls are as one when we die the soul dies with the body, unlike normal people whose soul goes on after death.

Vampire: the Masquerade Clan Brujah

a reply to: Grifter42

Vamps can't travel over water, yet he walked on it?