'The Magical Battle for Britain' during WW2 and how the witches of Britain fought the Nazis.

Originally posted by HelenConway
reply to post by Bybyots

 

I think Crowley died before the war ended,

Hi HC,

Just to follow up on all this Crowley stuff:

He died in December of 1947, Dion Fortune preceded him nearly one year previous in 1946, when she died of leukemia.

Crowley was addicted to heroine, which was prescribed to him for respiratory problems (asthma), during most of the years that he was supposed to be a 'spy'. His friends, like Ian Fleming, had tried to help him find war-time work in essentially the capacity that this spy-myth tries to support, but the actual military brass did not want him.

I have to admit that going over all this again is rather saddening. These authors were my childhood friends and it can be hard to read about the very mundane and terrestrial lives that they led, complete with debilitating sickness and old age.

Crowley died in a halfway house, indebted to others for his care.

He was not working for MI5, or any other spy organization. He was really just a guy that wrote a lot.

The myth is good fiction, though, I mean, where else were folks going to go with the story? Making all these characters active during WWII kinda provides extended play for those that don't want the story to end.

Thanks for a good thread. It has been educational to go over this stuff again.

Originally posted by rockymcgilicutty
reply to post by HelenConway

 

Truce

About time you and Helen got things sorted out, it was nearly time to knock both of your heads together and send you both to bed without supper.... PHEW *breathes a huge sigh of relief*

But well done to both of you for *battling* with a certain amount of fairplay.

Kindest respects

Rodinus

reply to post by Bybyots


Thank you Bybyots for this brilliant and informative post - so you knew Dion Fortune and Crowley and Fleming ?
Well I at least we are still talking about them today, and Dion Fortune is still seen by many in her world as a leader, which is why her books are still in print.
Crowley is still famous - for what its worth, maybe he would like that?
Ian Flemming is just a legend !

reply to post by HelenConway

Thank you Bybyots for this brilliant and informative post - so you knew Dion Fortune and Crowley and Fleming ?

Well I at least we are still talking about them today, and Dion Fortune is still seen by many in her world as a leader, which is why her books are still in print. Crowley is still famous - for what its worth, maybe he would like that? Ian Flemming is just a legend !

No, of course not.

But you know how it is, you grow up with these people as you read their books. In my twenties, I actaully got it into my head that these people were my literary aunts and uncles. I set out to introduce myself to as many authors that were writing in the same genre and were influenced by their work as I could. I met a lot of people, HC, and even a few that were still around that had rubbed elbows with people that had actually rubbed elbows with my literary heroes; that was the best I could do.

In some cases I even have had the opportunity to handle personal items that belonged to Crowley, and I am probably one of the last 4 or 5 people to ever participate in group practice in the original L.A. Golden Dawn temple.

I was on a mission.

I think that the proof of what these folks were really doing during the war years is in your comment above. The reason all of their books are so legendary is because these folks were doing what they did best; they were writing. And the part people don't realize is that it was very competitive. Most of the magicians that we are talking about were all contemporaries, living at the same time, and competing for the public's attention by writing the most outrageously cogent stuff that they could. Kinda like ATS.

It's literary warfare, not spiritual warfare.

I like you, HC, you actually remind me a little of how Dion may have been. I also like that you have a heart for all of these old authors. I know it is there, too, HC, even if we can't see it. Avalon will rise, Arthur will return.

I remain faithful.

LUX.

P.S...

Crowley is still famous - for what its worth, maybe he would like that?

I think that he would be dying of laughter; we'd have to bury him all over again. Just for fun, what types of things do you suppose Aleister would be pursuing if he were active in today's world? Do you think he would be in to Tarot and Dee's Encochian Aethyrs? Or do you suppose he would be fascinated with other stuff, considering today's science and technology?

Thanks.

reply to post by Bybyots


Thank you Bybyot that is such a lovely thing to say.

I grew up reading Edgar Cayce, he was my favourite mystic and Harry Price [ Ghost hunter extraordinaire ], and T H White, C S Lewis, Tolkien and various others - no wonder I love mysteries.

I have never been attracted to formula and ritual though.

Dion Fortunes, Psychic Self Defence book is very old fashioned but good stil - very.

I must order her magical battle for Britain book ..

Originally posted by Bybyots
I think that he would be dying of laughter; we'd have to bury him all over again. Just for fun, what types of things do you suppose Aleister would be pursuing if he were active in today's world? Do you think he would be in to Tarot and Dee's Encochian Aethyrs? Or do you suppose he would be fascinated with other stuff, considering today's science and technology?

Thanks.

edit on 11-2-2013 by Bybyots because:

Come on you know the answer to that ...
he would have his own TV show - a reality scary show, a bit like most haunted meets Derren Brown.
' I am a celebrity scare me out of here '

He would be outrageous and always in the press

reply to post by HelenConway

Come on you know the answer to that ...

I sure do. I like to think that he would be a hacker. And a very high profile and flamboyant one, as well. he'd make Anonymous look like a bunch of script kiddies. Yep, I think he would be bringin' the digital witchcraft, big time.

And publishing expensive little leather bound boutique volumes of his work in highly limited editions at exorbitant prices. It's all the rage, even today. Have you seen some of these publishing houses that print the stuff?



P.S.

I have never been attracted to formula and ritual though.

Me neither, I was always attracted much more to the mysticism than the magick.

They even made a movie about it:

This is a highly fascinating subject, but perhaps unsurprisingly there is little in the way of substantiated commentary to be found on the net. I read a few articles, one of which is at the following link:

OCCULT WAR, by Michael Howard

The above reports connections between all manner of high-society types & persons of renown during the 1930's and 40's, and beyond, who were alleged to have been recruited into MI5 & 6, variously involved in disinformation plots & actual magical ritual during wartime, generally connected to the idea of overthrowing Hitler.

My opinion? These were obviously persons rightly opposed to the psychotic inclinations of the Third Reich; however, whether it profits a nation to involve itself at the highest levels with what could amount, in some cases, to demonological manipulations, is a matter for careful contemplation. We reap what we sow, and personal choice leads to personal consequence, after all. On a national scale? The balance & the measure, the intention & the focus, the hidden state of the heart behind such activities would be counted in the final reckoning, as with all activities in all spheres... I suppose there's also the risk that the long-term ambitions of persons & groups involved in such magical rites might be entirely contrary to the actual interests of the State & its people. Indeed, the proponents themselves might be pawns in the hands of greater powers..

Whatever the details, I have a feeling that these types of practice have been refined - & perhaps redeveloped - in the years since WW2, and I hope that if so, the correct path has been followed.

reply to post by alldaylong

Don't forget the P-51 Mustang...i believe they changed the V-12 Allison with the Merlin.

It is an interesting story and, IMHO, any benefit they had was in their own deluded minds. To look for Britain's salvation, one only has to look at the brave men and women who stood on the wall, took to the skies, and kept watch over the seas to get your answer.


"Never has so many owed so much to so few." ~ Churchill

And there I was thinking the Spitfire's engine being called the Rolls-Royce Merlin would be your thread's party piece.

reply to post by Hopechest

Well obviously the witches were not that powerful since it was the good ole U.S.A. that bailed the brits out of trouble. Not witchcraft. Britain was all but at the end of her rope before America jumped into the war.

So the RAF and the Royal Navy are American?

Which part of Britain was "at the end of it's rope" by early 1943? (When US troops fought their first engagement against the Western Axis)

well Britain fought bravely alone up until this point and against overwhelming odds. So don't be so quick to kick or judge.

reply to post by HelenConway


Indeed, the minuscule British Empire along with Free Polish, Free French and many others had fought "alone" up to that point. Against an enemy who by 1942 still had a far smaller Navy and only a marginally larger Air Force.

But the fact of the matter is that without US help their time was numbered. They would have simply been overwhelmed and would have ran out of supplies. It was only a matter of time.

reply to post by Hopechest


Overwhelmed by what at that point? Rommel swimming across the Channel? You are clearly not at all knowledgeable in this topic

Well I don't see what turned around for Britain, they were running on fumes until America joined and sent supplies in greater numbers.

reply to post by Hopechest


Yes, Britain's 1943 force strength of 800 major naval combatants and 50,000 combat aircraft had all been flown and sailed over from America by Ben Affleck's grandad.

I agree that we didn't join the war soon enough but it was not Russia that sent supplies and troops to Britain to save her, America did. Had America not joined the war Russia still would not have saved Britain. America did. And yes America did save Russia because we opened the second front in the west which made Hitler split his forces.

reply to post by Hopechest


Who is it that prevented the German Invasion any further West? The British. Nobody needed to save Britain by 1943. Yes, America planned that invasion, what was it called, that was launched from America, involving mostly American forces and troops, that opened up a western front in Fortress Europe. Oh wait no that was Britain.

Originally posted by Hopechest
Well obviously the witches were not that powerful since it was the good ole U.S.A. that bailed the brits out of trouble.

Not witchcraft.

Britain was all but at the end of her rope before America jumped into the war.

I think you'll find that following the Battle of Britain Hitler called off Operation Sealion indefinitely and instead turned his attention towards Russia.

You'll also find that all of the planes involved in the Battle of Britain were built in the UK.

And while mainland Europe owes an awful lot to the United States for its assistance in removing the Axis forces, the UK itself was never truly threatened after the end of the Battle of Britain, as the RAF and Royal Navy were more than capable of preventing an invasion.

We even sent you guys some destroyers and mine hunters to help out on your side of the pond....

reply to post by rockymcgilicutty


The Eagle Squadrons were not certified for defensive duties until February 1941, which is 4 months after the end of the Battle of Britain - they wouldn't have taken part.

I'm sure some US pilots probably flew, but it would literally have been a handful, and they were probably masquerading as Canadians.

ETA

Non-British Personnel in the RAF during the Battle of Britain

reply to post by neformore


Jumping in kinda late aren't you I made all those points eariler.