What's Wrong with School Administrations These Days?

reply to post by generik

it may be time to start not talking around the dinner table or even within earshot of seemingly innocent kids about anything that may seem contrary to what the government wants.

This is absolutely the LAST thing that we need to do! For if the child doesn't receive at least a little bit of sensibility and the chance to view the whole picture from the opinions of their parents, then we have already lost!

I teach first grade. Developmentally speaking, first grade boys are about as violent as they come.

Every game they play during recess involves chasing, throwing people in jail, using weapons, etc. Its just the way young boys are. Nothing will change it.

Personally, I told my students they couldn't play "guns" and explained why. So they switched, now they play "tasers." Still makes me laugh.

When one of my students does the gun thing, I don't report it. I simply talk to the child, explain how it could be interpreted incorrectly, and suggest a different form of play. That usually takes care of it.

There's no reason for a 6-8 year old child to be suspended for playing "guns." Making threats, though...that's different.

I am a LEO who specifically works as a School Resource Officer. I completely disagree with zero tolerance policies. I see the consequences of them on a daily basis. Luckily I am not a school administrator so I at least have officer discretion on my side.

reply to post by Darkphoenix77


This great panic is like a ripple effect. The local news networks ran a few reports on the isolated incidents and like gossip other Schools became aware and did the same and now they are just copying each other until it becomes some kind of unwritten law that becomes enforced in the minds of the teachers perspective. It's a Meme fighting for dominance.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by Darkphoenix77

 

Oh no! Did the kids feel bad when they were in trouble? Good. That's how you teach right from wrong.


Schools have had shootings since before this was even a country. Source

It's time to take a zero tolerance policy to any threat inside a school. Realistic or not.

Hmmmm... maybe we should move this into life outside of school. Forget the justice system completely. Anyone accused of anything gets automatic jail time. That is what you are proposing for kids. Punishment regardless the infraction.

reply to post by ObservingTheWorld


I understand where you're coming from, and could interpret my post that way. The thing is, my concern is for children, specifically while at school. If kids want to play with toy guns at home, that's fine. School is for learning, and that includes how to interact within an authoritative society. If that's not something you want your child developing, then get them out of the public school system. You have that ability.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by Darkphoenix77

 

Oh no! Did the kids feel bad when they were in trouble? Good. That's how you teach right from wrong.

No.

These policies have nothing to do with teaching children right from wrong. That is just the excuse, and an absurdly transparent one at that.

That's how you employ behavior modification techniques sanctioned by the state to brain wash children into thinking guns are bad. This is mass psychology, and bad, irresponsible psychology at that implemented to make the upcoming generation compliant.

These children did not actually do anything violent, therefore they did nothing wrong, yet they were shamed and punished like criminals before an act was committed. They were not actually acting in a way that was, or speaking of doing something violent. All of this was with toy weapons and in the context of play. Such draconian responses for play is abusive.

Responses such as yours are just proof that the brain washing is working and people rely upon the state to tell them what is right or wrong; which will only benefit the state in the end.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by ObservingTheWorld

 

School is for learning, and that includes how to interact within an authoritative society.

Yes, children should learn learn respect for those in authority. No, we should not teach children to blindly obey at all costs.

As children, we played with toy guns all the time. Even at school we played with imaginary guns. And you want to know something amazing, not one of us has ever shot another person.

So the question I have for you is, where do you let paranoia draw the line or do you believe that anyone who even thinks about using guns is a potential killer?

reply to post by ObservingTheWorld


If you want to raise your child to play with guns or toy guns, that's fine. That's your choice as a parent. Once your child sets foot on school property, he or she must abide by their rules, not yours. If that's not to your liking, there are ways to alternatively teach children outside of public/private schools.

Originally posted by smyleegrl
I teach first grade. Developmentally speaking, first grade boys are about as violent as they come.

Every game they play during recess involves chasing, throwing people in jail, using weapons, etc. Its just the way young boys are. Nothing will change it.

Personally, I told my students they couldn't play "guns" and explained why. So they switched, now they play "tasers." Still makes me laugh.

When one of my students does the gun thing, I don't report it. I simply talk to the child, explain how it could be interpreted incorrectly, and suggest a different form of play. That usually takes care of it.

There's no reason for a 6-8 year old child to be suspended for playing "guns." Making threats, though...that's different.

It's nice to know that we still have some teachers that use common sense. If there was a threat I think however that suspension, expelling is a tad much. Especially considering age 5-10, parents should be notified, and let them handle it. If the offenses are frequent and continue then you start thinking about other options. They are kids, not terrorists making bomb threats.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by ObservingTheWorld

 

I understand where you're coming from, and could interpret my post that way. The thing is, my concern is for children, specifically while at school. If kids want to play with toy guns at home, that's fine. School is for learning, and that includes how to interact within an authoritative society. If that's not something you want your child developing, then get them out of the public school system. You have that ability.

I agree there are right and wrong times to play, and if they are playing when they should be learning that is a 'no no'. It's not about that though, It is about taking things too far and the punishment no longer fits the "crime". Kids are kids, who hasn't brought any toys to school as a kid ever? Who hasn't ever played with imaginary guns when they were young? If you are over the age of 30 and claim to have never done this then you are either odd, or a liar. It also includes, for kids 5-10 how to socialize with and make friends. They don't learn this by being turned into unthinking robots.

Holy hell in a handbasket!! Does NOBODY remember what it was like to be young anymore!?!?

What's Wrong with School Administrations These Days? The simple answer: Liberals are in charge!

This is what happens when you put a bunch of weepy, emotional idiots in charge! Logic and reason fly right out the window and you're left with touchy-feely crap that has the exact effect of their intended outcome. The more liberal the Department of Education becomes, the less it actually educates and the more it administrates - to the horrible detriment of our children!

Just take a look at what has happened to America's education system over the past 3 decades. As the system has implemented more and more rigorous liberal policies, academic performance has tanked!

Liberalism is a cancer to human advancement!

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by ObservingTheWorld

 

If you want to raise your child to play with guns or toy guns, that's fine. That's your choice as a parent. Once your child sets foot on school property, he or she must abide by their rules, not yours. If that's not to your liking, there are ways to alternatively teach children outside of public/private schools.

Sorry, school administrations that act this dictatorial and fascist are wrong, you will not convince me otherwise. They are not using common sense and are wrong. I'm of the mind that children forced to not play with guns and are punished if they do are a bigger threat to society than those who do play with imaginary guns. Not, everybody can home school either, in fact most parents both have to work to make ends meet these days.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by ObservingTheWorld

 

If you want to raise your child to play with guns or toy guns, that's fine. That's your choice as a parent. Once your child sets foot on school property, he or she must abide by their rules, not yours. If that's not to your liking, there are ways to alternatively teach children outside of public/private schools.

Da, mein fuhrer!!! Ve vill obey your every command and submit to your will, oh master!

WTF kind of nonsense is that? So, you find it appropriate to expel a child because they held their hand in the shape of a gun and said, "bang"? Or expel a child because they drew a picture of a gun? What the hell kind of world are you trying to create for our children???

reply to post by Darkphoenix77


Oh I played Cowboys & Indians and even had some Entertech Water Guns.



As I said, kids can play however they want to outside the school as long as the parents approve. But, if the school says no guns or gunlike threats, that means NO guns or gunlike threats.

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by Darkphoenix77

 

Oh I played Cowboys & Indians and even had some Entertech Water Guns.

As I said, kids can play however they want to outside the school as long as the parents approve. But, if the school says no guns or gunlike threats, that means NO guns or gunlike threats.

Ok, thanks. That clears it up. You support absolutism. Good luck with that. In a world where everything is grey, you ascribe to make it all black and white. Why even have things like... oh, I don't know... say... DISCRETION??? Why not just scrap this whole "human" thing and replace us with automatons who can only function under the auspices of 1's and 0's. That sounds like a world perfectly to your liking.

Originally posted by kozmo

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by ObservingTheWorld

 

If you want to raise your child to play with guns or toy guns, that's fine. That's your choice as a parent. Once your child sets foot on school property, he or she must abide by their rules, not yours. If that's not to your liking, there are ways to alternatively teach children outside of public/private schools.

Da, mein fuhrer!!! Ve vill obey your every command and submit to your will, oh master!

WTF kind of nonsense is that? So, you find it appropriate to expel a child because they held their hand in the shape of a gun and said, "bang"? Or expel a child because they drew a picture of a gun? What the hell kind of world are you trying to create for our children???

It's not about obeying commands. You have the right to home-school your child. You're not forced to enroll in public school systems, but you're already paying for them, so why not attend? If you don't like the idea of someone else having authority over your child for several hours a day, then DON'T enroll in public schools. I don't understand why you can't grasp that.

reply to post by kozmo


Murder is wrong.



Oh no, I'm an absolutist!

No I'm far from an absolutist. I have common sense that says when I'm on someone else's property, I obey their rules. Can I come over to your house and rub my muddy boots on your couch? Why not? Screw your rules man, I'm American!

reply to post by DaTroof


Okay, so now I know that you were at least human at one point in time. I'm still of the opinion they can take thier "zero tolerance" policy and stick it where the sun don't shine though.

Originally posted by DaTroof

Originally posted by kozmo

Originally posted by DaTroof
reply to post by ObservingTheWorld

 

If you want to raise your child to play with guns or toy guns, that's fine. That's your choice as a parent. Once your child sets foot on school property, he or she must abide by their rules, not yours. If that's not to your liking, there are ways to alternatively teach children outside of public/private schools.

Da, mein fuhrer!!! Ve vill obey your every command and submit to your will, oh master!

WTF kind of nonsense is that? So, you find it appropriate to expel a child because they held their hand in the shape of a gun and said, "bang"? Or expel a child because they drew a picture of a gun? What the hell kind of world are you trying to create for our children???

It's not about obeying commands. You have the right to home-school your child. You're not forced to enroll in public school systems, but you're already paying for them, so why not attend? If you don't like the idea of someone else having authority over your child for several hours a day, then DON'T enroll in public schools. I don't understand why you can't grasp that.

Did you miss my post where I pointed out that parents have to work for a living to make ends meet. Sometimes several jobs because full time jobs are scarce. You can't home school unless you can survive on one income and minimum wage jobs do not allow a family to survive on one income period.