I used to believe that the world was heading toward a global spiritual ascension. No longer...

Originally posted by emeris
reply to post by Wanderer112358

 

As you said, the answers come in the stillness, not by going round and round in thought. There is no need to escape from the questions. Ask them, and be still. Put your efforts towards becoming more and more still rather than thinking more and more in the hopes that thought will bring the answers.

The distress is there because thought can only go so far. To go beyond thought is the real ascension. To go beyond thought.......be still. They are the same.

This means that at some point you will have to start a practice where whenever the mind starts asking questions you tell it to be still. Or rather you let it become still, and go deeper into stillness.

Stillness will show you all you need to know. It is not an escape. It is the ascension.

My heart tells me that you speak the truth. I agree with your understanding.

As I am beginning to understand, my path is about balance. The balance to ask the right questions and to then quiet the mind/Ego to be able to hear the subtle replies to my questions in my heart. When I do this, my heart never leads mt astray.

Thanks

We all know ascension isn't possible, and it remains the by-product of religious indoctrination. The Ascension of Christ? The Rapture? Spiritual ascension 2012? All fictions perpetrated by those who wish humans to be more than they really are.

These imaginings represent a way of thinking worse than nihilism—a wish to move beyond anything with intrinsic value into a fictional existence; a wish to move beyond humanity into nothing.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
We all know ascension isn't possible, and it remains the by-product of religious indoctrination. The Ascension of Christ? The Rapture? Spiritual ascension 2012? All fictions perpetrated by those who wish humans to be more than they really are.

These imaginings represent a way of thinking worse than nihilism—a wish to move beyond anything with intrinsic value into a fictional existence; a wish to move beyond humanity into nothing.

So, this is all we are and will ever be? This one life is all there is? We are limited physical animals with no hope of more?

I will NEVER believe that rubbish...

reply to post by Wanderer112358


I would never tell you what to believe, but I will tell you to stop lying to yourself. That rubbish you speak of is the truth. The lie of ascension does everything that has any value to mankind a great injustice.

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by Wanderer112358

 

I would never tell you what to believe, but I will tell you to stop lying to yourself. That rubbish you speak of is the truth. The lie of ascension does everything that has any value to mankind a great injustice.

To be very honest, I have no desire to live in such a world. Either I hold your views to be madness or I end this life. Neither choice is something that I am ready to consider. I will say that I sleep very well at night with my current view of our reality.

May you do the same.

Peace

reply to post by Wanderer112358


The form you take will continue to improve even after this life. Dont worry. But ultimately you are not the form, but the formless awareness that is already beyond. It seems that you are heavily focused on the level of forms and this will bring a lot of stress, worry, fear, anger etc. The play of forms will continue onwards and upwards. Just sit back and relax and watch the show.

reply to post by Wanderer112358

Either I hold your views to be madness or I end this life.

If you hold otherworldly (non-existent) things of more value then the very real things around you, you are already half way to ascension (death).

Originally posted by LesMisanthrope
reply to post by Wanderer112358

 

Either I hold your views to be madness or I end this life.

If you hold otherworldly (non-existent) things of more value then the very real things around you, you are already half way to ascension (death).

So be it...

reply to post by Wanderer112358

You have some good insights, but try not to judge others, especially those you know nothing about. You don't know me...

Peace

If you do not believe in enlightenment, then you do not know yourself.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by Wanderer112358

 

You have some good insights, but try not to judge others, especially those you know nothing about. You don't know me...

Peace

If you do not believe in enlightenment, then you do not know yourself.

What? When did I say that?

reply to post by Wanderer112358


My apologies, global enlightenment. If you believe the world is not heading toward enlightenment, then you do not believe it is capable of such. I suspect this has just as much to do with your personal awareness as it has to do with the awareness of the world. After all, if you knew yourself to the point of enlightenment, then you would know the world is capable of such an achievement, for you would see yourself in the world.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope


Do you mean nonphysical things? If you hold nonexistent things valuable, they cannot be nonexistent, otherwise you hold nothing valuable, and there is no such thing as nothing. Even nothing is something, for it is a concept we can consciously ponder. That gives it a form of existence, which in itself negates the nothingness we ascribe to it. And in this sense, something always exists. The only point at which nothing exists is when there is nothing to observe it. That is to say, it is unobserved, and therefore it is nothing.

Thus, I'm sure you meant nonphysical rather than nonexistent.

Originally posted by AfterInfinity
reply to post by LesMisanthrope

 

Do you mean nonphysical things? If you hold nonexistent things valuable, they cannot be nonexistent, otherwise you hold nothing valuable, and there is no such thing as nothing. Even nothing is something, for it is a concept we can consciously ponder. That gives it a form of existence, which in itself negates the nothingness we ascribe to it. And in this sense, something always exists. The only point at which nothing exists is when there is nothing to observe it. That is to say, it is unobserved, and therefore it is nothing.

This, I'm sure you meant nonphysical rather than nonexistent.

Yes. Sorry for the confusion. I am trying to type replies to very deep thoughts and concepts on a small tablet at lunch. I don't think I am doing very well explaining my views today.

I will step back a little and let others discuss this issue. I do think it's an important topic.

Peace

reply to post by emeris


Sorry to jump on board this conversation, but I have a question about stilling ones mind. I agree with your thoughts, but could you elaborate on stilling the mind. Do you mean just don't think about anything and just let your mind wander aimlessly while in a conscious state. Daydreaming if you will?

How does one make the mind be still.

Your own attitude is your biggest ally and enemy. First of all, this whole idea of "ascension" is not a very defined thing. What does it mean anyway? There is no ascension, only the here and now.

If you spend all your time going to conspiracy websites, that is half your problem. They are full of negativity, half-truths, some lies, etc.

Whatever evidence you find for your conclusions is always presented to you not so much because it is the truth, or that it exists, but because you sought it out. There is much evidence that indeed slowly and surely we are getting better each and every day. One tripping block for a lot of people is that the world seems darker, scarier, even more negative than before. But when negativity is going down, disappearing, it hangs on, it gets louder, it becomes more obvious - like a supernova before a star dies.

You will be presented with the evidence that you already believe. Your own attitude towards the world is what will make you "ascend" or not.

reply to post by AfterInfinity

Do you mean nonphysical things? If you hold nonexistent things valuable, they cannot be nonexistent, otherwise you hold nothing valuable, and there is no such thing as nothing. Even nothing is something, for it is a concept we can consciously ponder. That gives it a form of existence, which in itself negates the nothingness we ascribe to it. And in this sense, something always exists. The only point at which nothing exists is when there is nothing to observe it. That is to say, it is unobserved, and therefore it is nothing.

This, I'm sure you meant nonphysical rather than nonexistent.

Yes maybe non-existent was a poor choice of words. Maybe deceptions would be better; for instance the unfulfillable promises of ascension or the afterlife. They do exist as concepts, that I must admit, but beyond that they point at nothing but a willingness to believe what we are told.

reply to post by skorpius


No not aimless wandering. That is still thought whether its directed or not. There are many techniques to still the mind. Practicing those techniques is called meditation.

Here are a few good meditation techniques if your interested:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

Maybe deceptions would be better; for instance the unfulfillable promises of ascension or the afterlife. They do exist as concepts, that I must admit, but beyond that they point at nothing but a willingness to believe what we are told.

Perhaps "deceptions" would be a better word if you could actually prove them to be deceptions and not simply contorted truths.

reply to post by AfterInfinity


One has to deceive himself into believing these things. Do you think it was logic that lead people to believe they would ascend on Dec 21st 2012? Is it logic or rationality that leads people to think they will be raptured? Show me any logic that forces one to think he will become enlightened or reach nirvana.

At some point, one must take a leap of faith, deceive himself, tyrannize over his reason and force himself in order to believe these things. Call it whatever you want, but "contorted truths" is more than a little naive.

reply to post by LesMisanthrope

One has to deceive himself into believing these things. Do you think it was logic that lead people to believe they would ascend on Dec 21st 2012? Is it logic or rationality that leads people to think they will be raptured? Show me any logic that forces one to think he will become enlightened or reach nirvana.

The only thing illogical about that particular event (or lack therein) is that people expected enlightenment to smack them in the face with absolutely no effort on their part. That was the stupidity talking. Everything stayed the same because no one is willing to work for what they want. Have you ever seen the movie Pay It Forward? The little kid's speech in that movie, during the interview toward the end...that's what I'm talking about.

At some point, one must take a leap of faith, deceive himself, tyrannize over his reason and force himself in order to believe these things. Call it whatever you want, but "contorted truths" is more than a little naive.

There's a fine line between being wrong and a visionary. Unfortunately, you have to be a visionary to see it.