Jesus being God, the Most High, the Almighty, etc..

I have heard of claims people make that Jesus is God himself.

I, myself, do not believe this to be true. Where do I get this belief?

Jesus himself told he was the son of God. Jesus himself said there is only one God. Worship only the Most High he said, did Jesus ask of people to worship himself? Jesus praid to God..

These are my arguments, I can come up with more..

reply to post by Angle


Personally I have always thought of God as the Door and Jesus was the key...

reply to post by Angle

It's a lay person speaking here...but I've understood Jesus to be the Son of God as all his Angels are/were. In fact, in some of what I've read, Jesus would seem to have been on equal footing at one point in Heaven with Satan before he was cast out and down from Heaven for betrayal of God.

To be honest, my impression taken away from what I've read has always been that in Heaven, Jesus is one of the crowd and an equal among equals who may be just a bit MORE equal than the rest of the Angels serving God. Down here? Well, he was something special because we don't have Angels as a daily thing to compare with..so of course, he'd appear to be God himself by comparison to normal people for what Jesus did in 'acts and miracles'.

Again, I'm just a lay person offering my personal take from a protestant upbringing before going a different direction in Faith.

(I imagine it like the original Superman movie for pure simplicity. On Earth, Superman was Super....back on Krypton, he would have been nothing special and an average guy...all location and perspective.)

reply to post by Angle


You are correct sir...

He did not claim to be God!

reply to post by abeverage


I'd say Jesus is the door to be knocked on to eternal life.

I am not sure where it was but Jesus said something to the effect of "Before Abraham was I AM" in the gospels. This is a reference to How God referred to himself in the old testament. The Doctrine of the Trinity is very mysterious and I can understand how some cannot fathom it. It is topics such as these that make me thankful for the Catholic Church since the understanding of the entire Book have been handed down since it was written.

Jesus did not say many hypocritical things.

But people after him turned his teachings apart.

And as soon as the division comes in , all the problems and catastrophes commence.

All the prophets are proud to say they are one human servant of god.

But people want to make him god to ensure their afterlife and their wrong actions.

Because god forgives whoever he wants however he wants.

eh, I've read John 1. According to the book I'd say,.. Jesus is God.

Originally posted by Angle
eh, I've read John 1. According to the book I'd say,.. Jesus is God.

read closely...

John said that... Jesus didn't...

reply to post by Akragon



John 1

18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.

reply to post by Angle


right...

That is John's narration leading into the story...

I prefer the KJV btw...

Originally posted by Angle


I have heard of claims people make that Jesus is God himself.

I, myself, do not believe this to be true. Where do I get this belief?

Jesus himself told he was the son of God. Jesus himself said there is only one God. Worship only the Most High he said, did Jesus ask of people to worship himself? Jesus praid to God..

These are my arguments, I can come up with more..

From my point of view Jesus is part of the whole not the whole itself. But then on that level of connection between god and part of god becomes confusing since at times the part can get a glimpse of what it is being the whole.

In one sense god is the highest form of Jesus himself and you are also that since YOU ARE. One of the reason some people pray to a higher self. They know they are part of god and can no longer accept the dualistic view that they are separated from god and the love and sense of oneness/harmony/euphoria it brings.

Originally posted by ccross
I am not sure where it was but Jesus said something to the effect of "Before Abraham was I AM" in the gospels. This is a reference to How God referred to himself in the old testament. The Doctrine of the Trinity is very mysterious and I can understand how some cannot fathom it. It is topics such as these that make me thankful for the Catholic Church since the understanding of the entire Book have been handed down since it was written.

René Descartes was quoted as saying "Cogito ergo sum" (I think, therefore I am).

By your rationale, if there were a sub-culture of philosophy that claimed René's divinity, his quote could be used as a reference that proves it?

reply to post by Akragon


How would you interpret these verses then?

John 10

29 My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand. 30 I and my Father are one.

If his father was god and they are both one then that would mean Jesus is god, wouldn't it?

reply to post by ccross


What does "I Am" mean though? If god said he is the "I Am" wouldn't that mean he is us and us him? Just a thought.

jesus [not his real name] said he was the 'son of man'.

if one was enlightened, like luke-john-mark [not their real names], they would know that this means that he is the son of god, as we [real humans] all are.

so why all the confusion?

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


What I've read in the O.T. is that he said to Moses, I think it was when they 'met' on the Mount that God said: "Tell them (Moses' people) my name is 'I am what I will appear to be'".

reply to post by 3NL1GHT3N3D1


Yes, and Jesus said "I can only do what I see my father in heaven doing." He is God.

Jesus was the word that was with God and which was God.

Originally posted by Angle
reply to post by Akragon

 

John 1

18 No one has ever seen God, but the one and only Son, who is himself God and is in closest relationship with the Father, has made him known.

If I may add my thoughts to this discussion.

The above is John's testimony and not the words of Jesus. Jesus himself as far as I am aware never proclaimed himself God. However, he did say that the only path to God was through him and considering he would have been very familiar with the Kabbala that would make an awful lot of sense.

Jesus advocated the path of Love and that to anyone familiar with the Kabbalistic system would indicate the middle pillar path. However, whichever route you would decide to traverse the Tree of Life - Mystic or Magician - you still have to go through Tiphareth the sphere of Beauty to attain God Hood.

As an aside - whoever wrote the Lord's Prayer was very familiar with the Kabbalistic system.

Our Father, which art in heaven, (Chesod)
Hallowed be thy Name.
Thy Kingdom come. (Malkuth)
Thy will be done in earth,
As it is in heaven. (Chesod))
Give us this day our daily bread.
And forgive us our trespasses,
As we forgive them that trespass against us.
And lead us not into temptation,
But deliver us from evil.
For thine is the kingdom, (Malkuth)
The power, and the glory, (Geburah and Chesod)
For ever and ever.
Amen.

Brackets are mine. ;-)

Hope this adds to the discussion and not distracts from it. Its been a few years since I studied the Kabbala seriously but it did help with providing a framework for the understanding of various forms of religious thought and thus helping me to form mine. I call it my filing cabinet. ;-)