Aurora project just a cover up?

Originally posted by ItDepends

Hey mb, I think that observation of the XR-37 being in orbit for 270 days and then another orbit lasting over 400 days raises the question(s) Do these missions have dual or multiple objectives?
First to put an umanned manueverable space vehicle in more than one orbit has tremendous benefits. No need to worry about the human aspect of being in Space if it can all be monitored and choreographed from multiple bases on the ground. The payloads I am betting are 1.) experimental technology, but my gut tells me, 2.) that these deployments are utilizing the most advanced Information gathering, Surveillance and Reconaisance technologies which include next gen of optical penetration. We have satellites, yeah. But, this platform can be directed to any orbit and provide details real-time while at the same time monitoring transmissions that are pinpointed directed as well on a broad spectrum. IMHO
The duration periods enable anomalies of on ground topographical changes with optical clarity unlike anything we have been known to exist....alluded to, but, nothing has leaked out regarding this latest advancement. So the long term orbit 'watches' specific and broad points of interest with never before transparency. Transmission is another test to send undetected real-time information to multiple land-based facilities worldwide which includes detailed optical and data retrieval. If something looks suspicious, the orbit and maneuverablity gained by the XR-37 is unmatched.

OK, that mission justifies orbital thrusters with substantial orbit-modifying capability. But it doesn't justify expending all the mass for the return plane! Without the return plane you could put up much more payload, or use a much cheaper rocket for the same payload. I just don't get it. The only reason to have a return plane is to return something, because it a large mass penalty otherwise. Without human meatbags, why? There's a reason none of these have been built before. Why is it so important? If it's a sensor that you put up, why ever take it down?

With that platform increasing the advancements in intelligence gathering, in virtually a stealth deployment (sure we see them being launched, but after that, virtually unseen) then opens up a multitude of other classified ISR experiments. So the length of orbit is not the question, the question is what and where are they receiving data on, and then secondly and thirdly, what other deployments (satellites, new technology (optics/comm) are being tested or actually being used in conjunction with the length of its mission? To have the capability to 'see' better, intercept with greater specificity of communications, while controlling the orbit, specific target area, tells me to guess that we are now playing with some very powerful next gen advancements.

That could explain the duration question, they don't need to come back with the data, they already have it, and they go back and recheck, verify, record topographical changes real time, as well as targeted communications supported by existing satellite and stealth UAV's. Just my speculation.

Unquestionably a goal: R&D for ISR technology. That doesn't explain the -37. Why return for this mission? Keep it working until it breaks and then splash it with a final thrust.

reply to post by mbkennel


You're overlooking the simple. Crystals grown in space are much better than anything grown on earth, and have a huge number of uses, from microchips, to lasers, to infrared cameras. The method of growth on earth requires them to be attached to a wall, so when they're removed, there are imperfections in the crystal. Crystals grown in space are grown detached, which means there are no impurities in them.

That's just one possible reason for a return mission. There are so many simpler applications that occur in space that are overlooked that it's not even funny. The X-37 is capable of doing so many things in one mission, due to the length of time that it can stay in orbit.

Originally posted by Yngvarr
From the defenceaviation link:

I've not seen this video posted before but does anybody have any background
on it? Thoughts, opinions?

We see air gases in suspension, perhaps an electrical suspension of some type
because that ship is highly charged by momentary variance that moves the
ship forward.

reply to post by mbkennel


Hi mb!
I do see and understand your question. All I can say, (because I do not know) is that the - 37 is a multi-purpose vehicle/platform. Beyond highly advanced optical and comm technologies, we know it has a bay just like the shuttles had. So, our speculation could run wild, but, a guess is that there is/are payloads in that bay, that are being deployed, tested in a Space environment, that is a component or a full system, that we do not want to leave in orbit. It is technology which is so advanced (speculation on my part), that we want returned and fully evaluated.

The mysterious X37-B plane is headed back to space tomorrow for a third mission, though we're still no closer to knowing exactly what the United States Air Force is using the aircraft for. Yet again the cargo being carried inside the unmanned Orbital Test Vehicle 3 (OTV-3) is heavily classified. The Air Force is touting one aspect of the mission however, and that's reusability. The X37-B plane being prepared for Tuesday's liftoff was the same one used in the inaugural 224-day OTV-1 flight in 2010. Officials say repurposing the aircraft in this manner demonstrates "a reliable, reusable, unmanned space test platform for the United States Air Force."

OTV-2 returned in June after an extensive 469-day mission — 200 days longer than originally planned. As the Pentagon has refused to offer any insight into these missions, critics maintain the Orbital Test Vehicle is being used for reconnaissance purposes. One report even accused the X37-B of spying on China, though that theory has met resistance of its own.

Third Deployment of X37-B Deployment Source ^^^^^^

Very insightful, to some degree, alot being stated:

The X-37B Orbital Test Vehicle is led by the Air Force Rapid Capabilities Office, and is designed to demonstrate reusable spacecraft technologies for America's future in space and operating experiments which can be returned to, and examined, on Earth. Technologies being tested in the program include advanced guidance, navigation and control, thermal protection systems, avionics, high temperature structures and seals, conformal reusable insulation, lightweight electromechanical flight systems, and autonomous orbital flight, reentry and landing.

Nightime landing, and look at the clean-suits, not necessarily unusual, but, interesting?


Peace!! ID

reply to post by ItDepends


We had speculation about the sits in another thread. I'm almost willing to guarantee it's due to the hydrazine fuel. Nasty stuff that.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by ItDepends

 

We had speculation about the sits in another thread. I'm almost willing to guarantee it's due to the hydrazine fuel. Nasty stuff that.

Hmm, The F-16 fighter jet uses hydrazine to fuel the aircraft's emergency power unit. So, we already know its use, and has been used for some time now and for multiple applications. That just doesn't seem right to me. My guess, is that it is something more than a propellant. Knowing a little bit about optics and communications advancements, I'd think it is more related to Intelligence gathering. And, just because the - 37 returns, doesn't mean it hasn't left something remaining up there, right? The duration of the missions only increase speculation. The appearance that something is returning each time, would appear logical. But, stay up there, leave something, hang around, come back with an empty bay. Multiple missions, deploy new technology, pick up previous load, bring home?

reply to post by ItDepends


When the EPU fired, we had to park the aircraft 100 yards away from everything else and wait four hours before we could go close to it. Then to service it required full body smocks, gloves, face shield, etc. That was for a very small tank. A space craft is still venting it when it lands, and in this case, it being so small you're much more exposed to it, so need more protection.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by ItDepends

 

When the EPU fired, we had to park the aircraft 100 yards away from everything else and wait four hours before we could go close to it. Then to service it required full body smocks, gloves, face shield, etc. That was for a very small tank. A space craft is still venting it when it lands, and in this case, it being so small you're much more exposed to it, so need more protection.

Thanks for that Zaph, I do not have much knowledge on post-landing protocols for re-usable shuttles. I'll take your word on that aspect.

Peace!! ID

reply to post by ItDepends


This is video of Endeavour landing. After they come to a full stop, you can see the APU venting hydrazine. I suspect that the X-37 has something similar for the simple reason that it works really well. Hydrazine makes a great fuel for space craft for various purposes, with the minor side effect that it's really really deadly to humans.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by ItDepends

 

This is video of Endeavour landing. After they come to a full stop, you can see the APU venting hydrazine. I suspect that the X-37 has something similar for the simple reason that it works really well. Hydrazine makes a great fuel for space craft for various purposes, with the minor side effect that it's really really deadly to humans.

Still awesome to watch. oh, I wouldn't disagree with you that hydrazine certainly could be used as a propellent for the - 37, I was just saying I didn't think that would be the purpose of its mission. Including that minor side effect that it's really really deadly to humans.

Peace!! ID

reply to post by ItDepends


No, that's just the fuel. I'm willing to Betty it's growing crystals, among other things, or leaving something up there that is, and getting it back later.

Originally posted by Zaphod58

Originally posted by boomer135
Sure the RQ-170 is out. But they didn't build that many and obviously, in my opinion, they wanted Iran to have that aircraft, but that's a whole other thread.

The RQ-170 was never meant for large numbers. They only bought 20 as it was an interim platform until the new ISR platform (probably the NG one that's under development) is flying and in service. It was never designed to do much more than fly over Afghanistan and Iraq, and doesn't have the capabilities to cover the Pacific the way they need to.

I agree completely except it does have one capability over other drones that would be useful in the Pacific, and its not the stealth

reply to post by boomer135


Oh absolutely, but I'm willing to bet the new NG platform will have it as well. I'm also willing to bet it's a lot closer to operational than most people think.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by HumAnnunaki

 

Except both did what they were supposed to do. The N1M was quite a nice plane to fly once they worked the bugs out, which they did. But it's not so much a choice of choosing who to believe. It's well documented that Jack Northrop was interested in flying wing designs from very early in his career, and thought they were the way to go in the future.

As for the B-2, they already had all of Jack's information, as well as information from other stealth programs, so there was no need to copy the 229.

Everything I wrote regarding the Horten was from memory pre-computer era.
After our discussion I was inclined to research your statements to see if I
had indeed forgotten Jack Northrop's linage.
My findings conclude that I stand behind my original statement.
However, I do not wish to derail the O.P.'s thread therfore I will only continue
this discussion with the O.P.'s permission.

reply to post by HumAnnunaki


We're just going to have to agree to disagree.

Originally posted by Zaphod58
reply to post by HumAnnunaki

 

We're just going to have to agree to disagree.

Fine with me..

Just for the record though I would like to say that your aeronautic
knowledge supercede's my own.

Be well

reply to post by HumAnnunaki


I'm actually pretty impressed with what I've seen of your knowledge. I just got a much earlier start than most avnerds, so I've been at it for a really long time already.

Keep up the good work with the posts, it was fun.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
reply to post by HumAnnunaki

 

What's interesting is that Northrop went to the Smithsonian to study the only surviving Ho 229, and built a mock up of it to study the RCS, and see how effective it really would have been in the war. They did it on their own time and with their own money during down time between projects.

Theres a documentry I saw a few days ago, that was talking about just this thing. Let me see if I can find it...
Here it is, from NatGeo. natgeotv.com...
I believe it was on NetFlix when I watched it.

Great thread, BTW! As someone who worked in military aviation (USMC CH46E helos),and who grew up in the Air Force culture, I find all this quite interesting.

lol, maybe the 37 can swap an enemy satellite w/a clone.

That's how I'd approach the problem.

originally posted by: Zaphod58
reply to post by ItDepends

 

No, that's just the fuel. I'm willing to Betty it's growing crystals, among other things, or leaving something up there that is, and getting it back later.

What kind of crystal? Certainly not a timing crystal. The energy requirement for the melt is ridiculous for a space application. Not as bad as growing silicon wafers, but still very energy intensive.

Do you have any specifics?