Evil or Satan

Hi all,

There are a lot of people here who've also read/studied or at least put a light on the bible/Qu'ran.
I want to know all about Satan. Let's say if everyone quotes out of the bible/Qu'ran verses about the nature of Satan we all get a good insight in this matter. This is the purpose of me starting this thread.

Out of the Bible I get Satan was a Liar and a Murderer.. from the beginning. Qu'ran says Satan is here to tempt and deceive people.

If anyone has examples out of the books, please post them.

A thx in advance. Who knows where this thread goes?.. The Most High, I know, I know. Jees..

salam

take my place.

Will be back within 2 hours.

My first point is that

Evil or Satan are said to the state or frame of acting ungratefully and seducing other beings.

But Azazel/Lucifer/Eblis are names of one Djin who was jealous and proud , he refused to bow and respect human beings.......................He swore that he would mislead all humans from straight way towards god.

Back to Qur'an verses.

17:27
for the wasteful are the brothers of satan; and satan is ungrateful to his lord.

21:81-82
to solomon the raging wind ran at his command to the land which we had blessed. we have knowledge of all things.
and some of the satans dived for him and others did work as well. we were watching over them.

6:112
as such we have assigned for every prophet an enemy; the satans of humans and jinn, revealing varnished speech to each other, all as a delusion. but had your lord willed, they would not have done so. therefore leave them and what they invent,

6:121
do not eat from that which the name of allah has not been mentioned, for it is a sin. the satans will reveal to their guided ones to argue with you. if you obey them, you shall indeed become idolaters.

2:102
and follow what the satans recited over the kingdom of solomon. solomon did not disbelieve, it is the devils who disbelieved, teaching people magic and that which was sent down upon the angels harut and marut in babylon. they did not teach anyone, until both had said: 'we have been sent as a trial; do not disbelieve. ' from them they learned how they might separate a husband and his wife. however, they did not harm anyone with it, except by the permission of allah. indeed, they learned what harms them and does not profit them, yet they knew that anyone who buys it would have no share in the everlasting life. evil is that for which they have sold their souls, if they but knew!

15:16-18
we have set constellations in the heavens and made them pleasing to the beholders,
and guarded them from every stoned satan
except for he who steals the listening and is then pursued by a visible flame.

26:112
it was not the satans who brought it down
it would neither suit them nor would they be able (to produce it).
indeed they have been removed far from even (a chance of) hearing it.

26:121
shall i tell you on whom the satans descend?
they descend upon every lying, sinful one,
(into whose ears) they pour hearsay vanities, and most of them are liars

38:36-38 the powers of solomon pbuh
then we subjected the wind to his power, to flow gently to his order, whithersoever he willed
and the satans, every builder and diver
as also others bound together in fetters......................

4:116-120
allah forgiveth not (the sin of) joining other gods with him; but he forgiveth whom he pleaseth other sins than this: one who joins other gods with allah, hath strayed far, far away (from the right).
(the pagans), leaving him, call but upon female deities: they call but upon satan the persistent rebel!
allah did curse him, but he said: "i will take of thy servants a portion marked off;
"i will mislead them, and i will create in them false desires; i will order them to slit the ears of cattle, and to deface the (fair) nature created by allah." whoever, forsaking allah, takes satan for a friend, hath of a surety suffered a loss that is manifest.
satan makes them promises, and creates in them false desires; but satan's promises are nothing but deception

3:35-36 story of Mary pbuh when she was born
behold! a woman of 'imran said: "o my lord! i do dedicate unto thee what is in my womb for thy special service: so accept this of me: for thou hearest and knowest all things."
when she was delivered, she said: "o my lord! behold! i am delivered of a female child!"- and allah knew best what she brought forth- "and no wise is the male like the female. i have named her mary, and i commend her and her offspring to thy protection from the evil one, the rejected."

5:90-91
o you who believe! intoxicants and games of chance and (sacrificing to) stones set up and (dividing by) arrows are only an uncleanness, the shaitan's work; shun it therefore that you may prosper
satan's plan is (but) to excite enmity and hatred between you, with intoxicants and gambling, and hinder you from the remembrance of allah, and from prayer: will ye not then abstain?

41:36
and if (at any time) an incitement to discord is made to thee by the evil one, seek refuge in allah. he is the one who hears and knows all things.

24:21
o ye who believe! follow not satan's footsteps: if any will follow the footsteps of satan, he will (but) command what is shameful and wrong: and were it not for the grace and mercy of allah on you, not one of you would ever have been pure: but allah doth purify whom he pleases: and allah is one who hears and knows (all things).

2:168-169
o ye people! eat of what is on earth, lawful and good; and do not follow the footsteps of the evil one, for he is to you an avowed enemy.
for he commands you what is evil and shameful, and that ye should say of allah that of which ye have no knowledge.

7:11-30 one of the stories of creation
it is we who created you and gave you shape; then we bade the angels prostrate to adam, and they prostrate; not so iblis; he refused to be of those who prostrate
(allah) said: "what prevented thee from prostrating when i commanded thee?" he said: "i am better than he: thou didst create me from fire, and him from clay."
(allah) said: "get thee down from this: it is not for thee to be arrogant here: get out, for thou art of the meanest (of creatures)."
he said: "give me respite till the day they are raised up."
(allah) said: "be thou among those who have respite."
he said: "because thou hast thrown me out of the way, lo! i will lie in wait for them on thy straight way
"then will i assault them from before them and behind them, from their right and their left: nor wilt thou find, in most of them, gratitude (for thy mercies)."
(allah) said: "get out from this, disgraced and expelled. if any of them follow thee,- hell will i fill with you all.

"o adam! dwell thou and thy wife in the garden, and enjoy (its good things) as ye wish: but approach not this tree, or ye run into harm and transgression."
then began satan to whisper suggestions to them, bringing openly before their minds all their shame that was hidden from them (before): he said: "your lord only forbade you this tree, lest ye should become angels or such beings as live for ever."
and he swore to them both, that he was their sincere adviser.
so by deceit he brought about their fall: when they tasted of the tree, their shame became manifest to them, and they began to sew together the leaves of the garden over their bodies. and their lord called unto them: "did i not forbid you that tree, and tell you that satan was an avowed enemy unto you?"
they said: "our lord! we have wronged our own souls: if thou forgive us not and bestow not upon us thy mercy, we shall certainly be lost."
(allah) said: "get ye down. with enmity between yourselves. on earth will be your dwelling-place and your means of livelihood,- for a time."
he said: "therein shall ye live, and therein shall ye die; but from it shall ye be taken out (at last)."
o ye children of adam! we have bestowed raiment upon you to cover your shame, as well as to be an adornment to you. but the raiment of righteousness,- that is the best. such are among the signs of allah, that they may receive admonition!
o ye children of adam! let not satan seduce you, in the same manner as he got your parents out of the garden, stripping them of their raiment, to expose their shame: for he and his tribe watch you from a position where ye cannot see them: we made the evil ones friends (only) to those without faith.
when they do aught that is shameful, they say: "we found our fathers doing so"; and "allah commanded us thus": say: "nay, allah never commands what is shameful: do ye say of allah what ye know not?"
say: "my lord hath commanded justice; and that ye set your whole selves (to him) at every time and place of prayer, and call upon him, making your devotion sincere as in his sight: such as he created you in the beginning, so shall ye return."
some he hath guided: others have (by their choice) deserved the loss of their way; in that they took the evil ones, in preference to allah, for their friends and protectors, and think that they receive guidance.

8:47-48
and be not like those who started from their homes insolently and to be seen of men, and to hinder (men) from the path of allah: for allah compasseth round about all that they do.
remember satan made their (sinful) acts seem alluring to them, and said: "no one among men can overcome you this day, while i am near to you": but when the two forces came in sight of each other, he turned on his heels, and said: "lo! i am clear of you; lo! i see what ye see not; lo! i fear allah: for allah is strict in punishment."

14:22
and satan will say when the matter is decided: "it was allah who gave you a promise of truth: i too promised, but i failed in my promise to you. i had no authority over you except to call you but ye listened to me: then reproach not me, but reproach your own souls. i cannot listen to your cries, nor can ye listen to mine. i reject your former act in associating me with allah. for wrong-doers there must be a grievous penalty."


17:61-65
behold! we said to the angels: "bow down unto adam": they bowed down except iblis: he said, "shall i bow down to one whom thou didst create from clay?"
he said: "seest thou? this is the one whom thou hast honoured above me! if thou wilt but respite me to the day of judgment, i will surely bring his descendants under my sway - all but a few!"
(allah) said: "go thy way; if any of them follow thee, verily hell will be the recompense of you (all)- an ample recompense.
"lead to destruction those whom thou canst among them, with thy (seductive) voice; make assaults on them with thy cavalry and thy infantry; mutually share with them wealth and children; and make promises to them." but satan promises them nothing but deceit.
"as for my servants, no authority shalt thou have over them:" enough is thy lord for a disposer of affairs.


So , Eblis is an invisible , talking enemy who was not happy to respect our one ancestor , Adam. He has a tribe and he has armies on foot and on horses. He was worshiping god for about 70000 years and he was driven out because of his jealousy toward Adam. So , he has most rage for humans.

1st Imam has explained better here

Originally posted by Angle
Hi all,

There are a lot of people here who've also read/studied or at least put a light on the bible/Qu'ran.
I want to know all about Satan. Let's say if everyone quotes out of the bible/Qu'ran verses about the nature of Satan we all get a good insight in this matter. This is the purpose of me starting this thread.

Out of the Bible I get Satan was a Liar and a Murderer.. from the beginning. Qu'ran says Satan is here to tempt and deceive people.

If anyone has examples out of the books, please post them.

A thx in advance. Who knows where this thread goes?.. The Most High, I know, I know. Jees..

You might want to check Book of Job and Book of Enoch
In Book of Enoch there is a prince named Satanael
In Book of Job, somehow Satan was a good guy

Guys, correct me if I am wrong. Thanks!!

and if you've read sitchin's stuff, you will put together that satan was enki and warned noah about the flood and god was enlil his part brother who knew about the oncoming flood and chose not to tell humans about it. Then you will also find enki helped adam by letting him in on knowledge (or satan setting up the forbidden fruit stuff)
then more of his work throws light on stuff like an explosion over in the sinai area. Heck then there's even an explaination as to why they left earth, think it was something to do with feeling bad about dropping nukes and causing so much damage. (to their own kind and humans) Pretty lame excuse to leave a planet if you ask me but hey, why spoil a good story. : )

Is it real? got no idea. But what it shows is how one person looks at stories and sees one individual as hero and the other as villain and another person looks at the same story and sees the hero as the villian and the villian as the hero.

Isn't there a saying about history being written by the victors. Well maybe we can add to that, that victims make up their stories too

But if you want to look into satan, the devil etc, maybe you would have to take into account other scenarios as well.
Have fun with all of your searching

Originally posted by greatfriendbadfoe
and if you've read sitchin's stuff, you will put together that satan was enki and warned noah about the flood and god was enlil his part brother who knew about the oncoming flood and chose not to tell humans about it. Then you will also find enki helped adam by letting him in on knowledge (or satan setting up the forbidden fruit stuff)
then more of his work throws light on stuff like an explosion over in the sinai area. Heck then there's even an explaination as to why they left earth, think it was something to do with feeling bad about dropping nukes and causing so much damage. (to their own kind and humans) Pretty lame excuse to leave a planet if you ask me but hey, why spoil a good story. : )

Is it real? got no idea. But what it shows is how one person looks at stories and sees one individual as hero and the other as villain and another person looks at the same story and sees the hero as the villian and the villian as the hero.

Isn't there a saying about history being written by the victors. Well maybe we can add to that, that victims make up their stories too

But if you want to look into satan, the devil etc, maybe you would have to take into account other scenarios as well.
Have fun with all of your searching

It sounds unreal to me... coz the architectures that were left by them, far from advanced, especially for aliens coming from outer space.

I expected the architectures to be something like in Star Wars, Star Trek, etc. It would be a better evident that our planet was visited by aliens

Too bad, we will never know.....

IMHO, both bible and sumerian stories make great sci-fi materials.

And Satan is most likely a myth. He's just a story character being used by writers to teach people about good and evil

Mideast said:

Evil or Satan are said to the state or frame of acting ungratefully and seducing other beings.

That is true.



Satan is an avowed enemy for he commands you what is evil and shameful, and that ye should say of allah that of which ye have no knowledge.

The Outstanding Qu'ran is an exceptional read.

Satan was created as a holy angel. Isaiah 14:12 possibly gives Satan’s pre-fall name as Lucifer. Ezekiel 28:12-14 describes Satan as having been created a cherubim, apparently the highest created angel. He became arrogant in his beauty and status and decided he wanted to sit on a throne above that of God (Isaiah 14:13-14; Ezekiel 28:15; 1 Timothy 3:6). Satan’s pride led to his fall. Notice the many “I will” statements in Isaiah 14:12-15. Because of his sin, God barred Satan from heaven.

Satan became the ruler of this world and the prince of the power of the air (John 12:31; 2 Corinthians 4:4; Ephesians 2:2). He is an accuser (Revelation 12:10), a tempter (Matthew 4:3; 1 Thessalonians 3:5), and a deceiver (Genesis 3; 2 Corinthians 4:4; Revelation 20:3). His very name means “adversary” or “one who opposes.” Another of his titles, the devil, means “slanderer.”

Even though he was cast out of heaven, he still seeks to elevate his throne above God. He counterfeits all that God does, hoping to gain the worship of the world and encourage opposition to God's kingdom. Satan is the ultimate source behind every false cult and world religion. Satan will do anything and everything in his power to oppose God and those who follow God. However, Satan’s destiny is sealed—an eternity in the lake of fire (Revelation 20:10).

www.gotquestions.org...

reply to post by Angle


They are both right in a sense.

Satans task before he fell was that to tempt man, it was his task. But, after he fell he still has that same role, but now he is not apart of Father anymore. This task was not given to another above because there is already one that tempts. Before he would get his orders from Father, but now he does his own thing.

Originally posted by Angle
I want to know all about Satan. Let's say if everyone quotes out of the bible/Qu'ran verses about the nature of Satan we all get a good insight in this matter. This is the purpose of me starting this thread.

Out of the Bible I get Satan was a Liar and a Murderer.. from the beginning. Qu'ran says Satan is here to tempt and deceive people.

If anyone has examples out of the books, please post them.

Satan doesn't always lie. In the book of Job, Satan wasn't lying when he answered God's question of "Where have you come from?"
Satan has children, many whose end will be like that of Satan's.
I suggest you check out some ex-satanist's testimonies.

Satan is not real.
Please !!!!! "Satan" is a man-made construct, and a scape-goat.
Neither is hell real......

people, please, grow up and realize that "organized religion" and all of its myths, are FICTION for control!!

*facepalm*

What do you think of this wildtimes?

Evil or Satan are said to the state or frame of acting ungratefully and seducing other beings.

Originally posted by wildtimes
Satan is not real.
Please !!!!! "Satan" is a man-made construct, and a scape-goat.
Neither is hell real......

people, please, grow up and realize that "organized religion" and all of its myths, are FICTION for control!!

*facepalm*

Honestly, you're the one who needs to grow up and realize that you can not shame other people into believing your baseless accusations.

Do you seriously not see that you are trying to force your own beliefs onto others? You are right about organized religion, but any sensible person can come to the conclusion that a belief that Satan exists and that hell is real, isn't going to force anyone to love others.

reply to post by Angle

At the beginning of Job, the function of Satan is to draw God's attention to human sin.
In Revelation ch12, Satan is called "the accuser".
In Revelation ch12, and also Luke ch10, Satan "falls" as a result of the fact that the forgiveness of sin is being proclaimed.
So Satan's power is based upon (or Satan's power represents) the fact that humans are vulnerable to judgement because of their sin.

Originally posted by Angle
What do you think of this wildtimes?

Evil or Satan are said to the state or frame of acting ungratefully and seducing other beings.

I think you are attributing "human" qualities to a mythical notion.

reply to post by Wonders

Honestly, you're the one who needs to grow up and realize that you can not shame other people into believing your baseless accusations.

Oooohkay......
so, the Churches' history (yes, plural churches) do not shame people into believing their "baseless accusations"?

Do you seriously not see that you are trying to force your own beliefs onto others? You are right about organized religion, but any sensible person can come to the conclusion that a belief that Satan exists and that hell is real, isn't going to force anyone to love others.

And you tell me, friend, what "pastor", or "preacher" or "priest" is not TRYING TO FORCE THEIR OWN BELIEFS ONTO OTHERS???????

Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by Wonders

 

Honestly, you're the one who needs to grow up and realize that you can not shame other people into believing your baseless accusations.

Oooohkay......
so, the Churches' history (yes, plural churches) do not shame people into believing their "baseless accusations"?

Do you seriously not see that you are trying to force your own beliefs onto others? You are right about organized religion, but any sensible person can come to the conclusion that a belief that Satan exists and that hell is real, isn't going to force anyone to love others.

And you tell me, friend, what "pastor", or "preacher" or "priest" is not TRYING TO FORCE THEIR OWN BELIEFS ONTO OTHERS???????

edit on 15-1-2013 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)

Oh wow, friend huh, okay. Please allow me to tell you this: Cursed is the man who trusts in man, a preacher is a man, there are preachers and pastors and priests who go to hell, they would not even be there if it weren't for gullible folk who go to church and believe everything that a preacher tells you. I'm not asking you to take me at my word, seek the truth for yourself, don't be a coward whose too afraid or too lazy to consider a work of writing that you would NEVER be able to make non-existent, no matter how often you stoop to the preacher's level of spouting half truths.

Evil or Satan?

Neither, please and thank you.

So what's next..?

There must be something better to talk about, right?

reply to post by Wonders


"not asking you to take me at my word, seek the truth for yourself, don't be a coward whose too afraid or too lazy to consider a work of writing that you would NEVER be able to make non-existent, no matter how often you stoop to the preacher's level of spouting half truths."

Can you explain what the above quote means please? I have read and re read it and can't quite get the meaning. I know it wasn't addressed to me, but I'm just trying to follow the thread. I think the part that is throwing me is "able to make non-existent"

And what truth are you referring to? Are you talking about the truth that the bible is a hotch potch of writings that were combined by a self serving pope with any literature that didn't help him and his associated cronies more powerful omitted, or the truth that there were beings that genetically engineered humans after many failed attempts and that some of these beings decided to let said humans perish and others that wanted them to flourish? (you see that is truth to some just as the bible is truth to others) or the truth that humans evolved from some ancient hominid and, over time gained time to think and progress by farming instead of having to spend all of their time hunting and gathering, or some other truth? Which one is the truth please Wonders?

Satans are also cowards.

also, have faith and constantly resist Satan and he will flee from you.

I have no biblepassages.


I hate cowards. heh, man speaks of rising of vibration and Satan being put in the Fire for a 1000 years. whatever, I thought it was linked somehow.

Originally posted by greatfriendbadfoe
reply to post by Wonders

 

"not asking you to take me at my word, seek the truth for yourself, don't be a coward whose too afraid or too lazy to consider a work of writing that you would NEVER be able to make non-existent, no matter how often you stoop to the preacher's level of spouting half truths."

Can you explain what the above quote means please? I have read and re read it and can't quite get the meaning. I know it wasn't addressed to me, but I'm just trying to follow the thread. I think the part that is throwing me is "able to make non-existent"

And what truth are you referring to? Are you talking about the truth that the bible is a hotch potch of writings that were combined by a self serving pope with any literature that didn't help him and his associated cronies more powerful omitted, or the truth that there were beings that genetically engineered humans after many failed attempts and that some of these beings decided to let said humans perish and others that wanted them to flourish? (you see that is truth to some just as the bible is truth to others) or the truth that humans evolved from some ancient hominid and, over time gained time to think and progress by farming instead of having to spend all of their time hunting and gathering, or some other truth? Which one is the truth please Wonders?

The truth can not be summed up in a mere sentence, hence my saying that context is important.
John 14:26 But the Counselor, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.
John 16:13 When the Spirit of truth comes, he will guide you into all truth. He will not speak on his own but will tell you what he has heard. He will tell you about the future.

The truth does not come in one lump sum just as while it is true that we need water, we need more than water to survive.
Matthew 6:30-33 But if God so clothes the grass of the field, which today is alive and tomorrow is thrown into the oven, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? Therefore do not be anxious, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ These things dominate the thoughts of unbelievers, but your heavenly Father already knows all your needs. Seek the Kingdom of God above all else, and live righteously, and he will give you everything you need.

We need the truth, which is why we have an inherent desire to discern the truth, we were made to ask seek and knock.
Jeremiah29:13 You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart.
We were not made to be satisfied with half truths, that is the reason that organized religion is insufficient, because we were made for so much more than social gatherings with scripture tidbits because man does not live on bread alone but by EVERY word of God which is the reason that the Holy Spirit remindes believers of everything Jesus has said because Jesus is The Way, The Truth, and the Life.
John 6:63 The Spirit gives life; the flesh counts for nothing. The words I have spoken to you are spirit and they are life.

I expect what I have said to raise more questions in your mind, because those who truly seek the truth want the whole truth and nothing but the truth, and that is not something that I alone can impart.
The parable of the sower comes to mind:
Luke 8:5 "A farmer went out to plant his seed. As he scattered it across his field, some seed fell on a footpath, where it was stepped on, and the birds ate it.
Luke 8:11-12 "This is the meaning of the parable: The seed is God's word. Those along the path are the ones who hear, and then the devil comes and takes away the word from their hearts, so that they may not believe and be saved.