SEAL Team Six Helicopter Crash: Let’s Debunk a Myth….

a reply to: MKMoniker

Thanks for your response

Regarding the the issue of did Bin Laden die during Neptune Spear or did he die in 2001, I would direct you to This Thread I wrote on that subject some time ago regarding the allegation that he died from kidney failure. I see time and time again people getting the history of Bin Laden and his organisation wrong or misunderstanding it and its understandable but peal back the layers of conspiracies and you will usually arrive at a much more tantalising truth.

a reply to: OtherSideOfTheCoin

Here's the issue I have with your reasoning:

ST6 Team Crash "Same Elite Unit As Seals Who Killed OBL"

I'm necroing this thread because it demands further discussion - hope this reply gets to you promptly.

straight from this article on August 6th, 2011:

"Insurgents shot down a U.S. military helicopter during fighting in eastern Afghanistan, killing 30 Americans, most of them belonging to the same elite unit as the Navy SEALs who killed former Al Qaeda leader Usama bin Laden, U.S. officials said Saturday. It was the deadliest single loss for American forces in the decade-old war against the Taliban.

One current and one former U.S. official said that the dead included 25 Navy SEALs from SEAL Team Six, the unit that carried out the raid in Pakistan in May that killed bin Laden. They were being flown by a crew of the 160th Special Operations Aviation Regiment. Both officials spoke on condition of anonymity because families are still being notified."

It then goes on to further introduce plausible deniability of what this article JUST implied above:

"We don't believe that any of the special operators who were killed were involved in the bin Laden operation," a senior U.S. military official told Fox News."

Here's also an interesting article from ABC news on the same day:

Taliban Or Insurgents?

Most notable quote for me here is:

"Although the Taliban have claimed to have shot the helicopter down, U.S. officials have only identified the attackers as insurgents.

On July 25, a Chinook was hit by a rocket propelled grenade fired by the Taliban. It launched in the belly of the aircraft which made a hard landing and only two soldiers were injured in that attack but this time all on board were killed."

So was it the Taliban, or "insurgents?" Where's this follow-up question? Where's the follow-through?

The challenge about having this discussion is that you solely rely on independent sources that get & relay their information directly from mass media channels.

When people rebuttal you in this thread for saying that you can't trust the media who you're depending on for your position, they're right. The two articles I posted above, including your links are the main reasons for that stance.

They understand the implication they're making, still make it, and then introduce just enough doubt to garnish your favor. Which is it? Are they part of the same unit or not? If they are part of the same unit, were any of them part of the crash? "We don't believe so," says the official source.

And really, how would you know if they were or weren't? Their identities are classified. On this premise alone, how can one not ask themselves this question when met with these circumstances? Namely, there's a crash that happened which killed classified members WITHIN the same unit as those which conducted the OBL operation.

Now you might reply and say "but red squadron and gold squadron retain different members." Here's my problem with this notion:

1. How can we be confident that both red and gold squadron weren't involved in separate portions of this operation?

2. How can we be confident that some men from red squadron weren't transferred to gold after the fact, or vice versa?

3. Who are we even talking about? If we don't have their names, why are you so certain you're being fed reliable information?

Members Of ST6 All "Black Operatives"

"The members of Team 6 are all "black" operatives. They exist outside military protocol, engaging in operations that are at the highest level of classification — and often outside the boundaries of international law. To maintain plausible deniability in case they are caught, records of black operations are rarely, if ever, kept."

Remember, the mainstream media introduced this implication that it was the "same unit," as well as the doubt associated with that implication.

This looks like a glass is half empty, half full kind of situation. That is to say, I think you're being an optimist about this when there's more than enough reasonable doubt for you to consider the opposite.

a reply to: facedye

The naysayer so far seem to be saying "you cant trust the media and official position" and losts"what if's".... "what if a member of red squadron ended up in gold...."

Sorry to be short in my response but honestly this thread is really quite old it has yet to be solidly debunked.

The real truth is that on ATS there is this really annoying preconceived notion that most members have which is that everything is a conspiracy.

Frankly its annoying and breads ignorance, its also one of the many reasons my posting on this site has pretty much stopped in recent months.

originally posted by: OtherSideOfTheCoin
a reply to: facedye

The naysayer so far seem to be saying "you cant trust the media and official position" and losts"what if's".... "what if a member of red squadron ended up in gold...."

Sorry to be short in my response but honestly this thread is really quite old it has yet to be solidly debunked.

The real truth is that on ATS there is this really annoying preconceived notion that most members have which is that everything is a conspiracy.

Frankly its annoying and breads ignorance, its also one of the many reasons my posting on this site has pretty much stopped in recent months.

You asked for responses based in articles and reliable sources - that's exactly what I gave you.

You didn't even respond to the several points I made here, which I fully believe and have shown are based in fact.

You even had several experienced military men throughout this thread tell you that it is possible for red and gold squadron to be used simultaneously - you rejected to answer that point as well.

Deny ignorance, don't become ignorance. If you're annoyed about conspiracy theories on a site designed to discuss conspiracy theories, maybe you're appealing to the wrong crowd. You're also coming dangerously close to asserting that my entire thought out response to you isn't informative, sourced nor relevant.

I didn't provide you with *any* "what ifs" that weren't cited and sourced - I'm questioning what you're readily accepting and not reading into.

I don't think you've successfully debunked anything here. Looks like you're just frustrated that so many here are simply not agreeing with you. They're not agreeing with you because of plausible deniability.

Unfortunate, I was hoping for a more detailed response from you. I certainly think you're wrong on this one.

a reply to: randomname
"the only info you get is released by the same people who could be part of the conspiracy."

And that says it all.