Indian Guru holds victim responsible for gangrape

Indian Guru holds victim responsible for gangrape

Source

Asaram Bapu courted controversy after he said that the Delhi gangrape victim was equally responsible for the crime and the girl could have called her assailants brothers and begged them to stop.

Asaram's remarks on the gangrape of the 23-year-old girl sparked condemnation across the political spectrum and from women's bodies today with the BJP saying it was "regrettable, deeply disturbing and painful".

(visit the link for the full news article)

The older I get, the more I fail to understand "religion" or what pushes people to follow "religious" leaders.

I'm not against any religion. I am not a religious person myself. However, I always understood that it was about peace, bringing people together and spiritual enlightenment.

I guess I must have landed on the wrong planet. It is sickening to see what people say and do in the name of religion.
Source
(visit the link for the full news article)

reply to post by WhereIsTheBatman

Originally posted by WhereIsTheBatman

However, I always understood that it was about peace, bringing people together and spiritual enlightenment.

That's part of it.

Part of it is also about adopting a posture toward an ineffable mystery that utterly transcends dualities such as peace and war, togetherness and solitude, enlightenment and ignorance, good and evil.

A guru? Defenders of the caste system? Defenders of Manu? Defenders of the belief that people suffer because of karma? I guess she must have done something evil in a previous life!

How wonderful religion is! How ancient and holy the wisdom! Brahmin bronze-age wonders of the human mind.

Shame on him. Filth.

Someone should gangrape this guru until his insides are so damaged that he dies from it. Then, we'll see how he feels about it. An eye for an eye, right?

Originally posted by BlueMule

Originally posted by WhereIsTheBatman

However, I always understood that it was about peace, bringing people together and spiritual enlightenment.

Part of it is also about adopting a posture toward an ineffable mystery that utterly transcends dualities such as peace and war, togetherness and solitude, enlightenment and ignorance, good and evil.

edit on 7-1-2013 by BlueMule because: (no reason given)

To me that sounds more like philosophy and a way of life rather than some "classic" religion. Of course, I'm no expert.

I find this an unlikely way to convey the idea which this particularly unfortunate religious personality intended.

He, like many other religious people, seem to believe that the invocation of the object of their faith will engender a change in circumstance, even in the face of imminent danger.

I will not denigrate the idea of faith as a shield... but I think saying so does not necessarily imply attribution of fault on the part of those who don't.

I propose that saying this guru "holds the victim responsible" is something of an ignorant fallacy of logic.

I prefer to think that he intended to reenforce his doctrine, that the names of his gods have power, and they should be (in an ideal world) capable of inspiring would be criminals to reconsider the actions they are about to undertake and perhaps miraculously bring about piety, in it's best sense.

But then, this is the media talking, and we know how much they love to sew passion for angst....

He is one of many "gurus" who wants media attention, Indian people have seen so many fakes, they barely takes these guys serious. He is just a 1 in 1,000,000,000.

The real gurus don't seek media attentions and probably meditating in the Himalayas mountains.

"The accused were drunk. If the girl had chanted hymns to Goddess Saraswati and to Guru Diksha then she wouldn't have entered the bus...," he added.

"If she (victim) would have taken God's name or recited a mantra God inside her might have suggested her to how to avoid such crimes," she said, seeking to explain Asaram's remarks.

WTF am I reading this correctly?
Is he really saying that if this girl had prayed to herself, then 'god' would have advised her how to avoid such situations?

Thats the most absurd thing I have ever heard

Hinduism, on the whole, considers females as inferior to say the least. Hinduism is more at fault, that guru is more at fault for what happened.

Originally posted by WhereIsTheBatman
The older I get, the more I fail to understand "religion" or what pushes people to follow "religious" leaders.

I'm not against any religion. I am not a religious person myself. However, I always understood that it was about peace, bringing people together and spiritual enlightenment.

I guess I must have landed on the wrong planet. It is sickening to see what people say and do in the name of religion.
Source
(visit the link for the full news article)

edit on 7-1-2013 by WhereIsTheBatman because: URL malformed

edit on 7-1-2013 by WhereIsTheBatman because: URL still malformed

The average follower of religions that I have known, are involved simply for the group gatherings and instant friends.

They like to say "my church" it both gives them a backing for all they say and do and also makes them feel superior to the non church goers.

reply to post by Maxmars


What????

I dont quite get what your saying here. i see alot of fancy dancing.... but not alot of substance.

So forgetting to call out to jesus or vishnu when your being raped makes you complicit or not?

reply to post by seen2much


Hinduism is probably the least of all religion that look down on women... they even have female gods... unlike male-centric gods from other religions.

Sure you are not looking at cultural trends?

Originally posted by Maxmars
I find this an unlikely way to convey the idea which this particularly unfortunate religious personality intended.

He, like many other religious people, seem to believe that the invocation of the object of their faith will engender a change in circumstance, even in the face of imminent danger.

I will not denigrate the idea of faith as a shield... but I think saying so does not necessarily imply attribution of fault on the part of those who don't.

I propose that saying this guru "holds the victim responsible" is something of an ignorant fallacy of logic.

I prefer to think that he intended to reenforce his doctrine, that the names of his gods have power, and they should be (in an ideal world) capable of inspiring would be criminals to reconsider the actions they are about to undertake and perhaps miraculously bring about piety, in it's best sense.

But then, this is the media talking, and we know how much they love to sew passion for angst....

Ah he says clearly

He also went on to say, "Galti ek taraf se nahi hoti hai (mistake is not committed from one side)."

Female deities does not equal womens' rights, sorry. Where are Brahmin priestesses? Have you read the laws of Manu?

Whitewashing a religion that has aided human subjugation and made women 3rd-class beings is a joke.

A born-again republican said something to the same extant this summer, see a pattern? Sure, there are some sublime elements. Yet, look at the vajpayee, look at the caste system, and look at the plight of women. Hinduism is more exotic than Islam so it gets a get out of jail free card. Time for that to end.

reply to post by seen2much


I think in general, once you start to follow man made scriptures on how to live your life, it will all fail.

I just saw the quick version of it, i seen men's stench all over it(like bible). It was surely added on much later for control of women.

Im not sure if that is followed nowadays, unless in a strict religious households.

Many still follow the laws of Manu (no pun intended). However, the modern state of India was built on a western model which, as faulted as it is, grants equal rights and lays the foundation for positive change. Look at all those Indians, men and women, coming together to fight for human decency.

Any guru who throws around his opinion isn't a guru you should you should study under. Gurus don't work in opinions, and more so, don't blame crimes on innocent victims.