Professions with the most Psychopaths and how it effects our world

reply to post by UnlimitedSky


Actually I do know, I used to work in mental health and have cared for Psychopaths but some psychopaths lead a normal life and some do not.
My point was a psychopath can be devoid of all emotion and sometimes that is needed, The Psychopaths I cared for had other mental issues as well and could not function in society but many can function normally and do appear to be normal.
I'm sorry you had to live with one who couldn't function (sounds like it).
Another point is Psychopaths can be tested and they normally have something like frontal lobe damage in the brain but some people can have this and be normal.
I do admit the one guy I really remember scared the hell outa me he was diagnosed as a Psychopath with a personality disorder and he was the closest I have come to what I can only describe as evil.

reply to post by Aleister


There is a difference between psychopathy and psychosis, someone who is a psychopath is always a psychopath.

How ever, any one can have psychosis at any time. Stress, substance abuse, trauma, sleep deprivation, these can all trigger an episode of psychosis, and those that turn into crazy axe wielding blood thirsty killers are not usually psychopaths.

Jilted lovers, stressed out employees, troubled youth, these are your mass murderers, and not to many of them turn out to be psychopaths. Crazy, absolutely, psychopathic not necessarily.

The same goes for schizophrenics. Yes some of them have done absurd things, but pointing the finger at the fact they are schizophrenics is not likely the answer. Everyone, whether you like it or not has, or will have a mental health disorder at some point in their lives. Some of them will be permanent, some of them will go away on their own or with the help of counseling, but everyone will suffer some kind of mental distress at some point.

It really should not come as a surprise either.

I how ever am not surprised at this list. I wonder how many of these individuals exhibited psychopathic behaviors, before they came into their careers, and how many developed the behaviors as a result of their careers. Think about it, if you are a lawyer, you have to be calm, and withdrawn.

Think about that, as a defense lawyer you may be hired to defend a serial rapist. That's your job, irregardless of how horrible that person may or may not be.

Same for the prosecution, every single day you will be working towards convicting some of societies worst individuals and if you lose your cool, or become emotional you are likely to let the man/woman go because of your emotions getting in the way.

Same goes for a CEO, I may not agree with big business but if the livelihood of my company, family, my employees and their families are on the line, I have to put emotions aside and do what must be done for the better of the company. Even if that means squashing people in the midst. It's terrible, but I can see how these attributes would be necessary in these positions.

Psychopathy is actually quite common, and a great number of people actually exhibit attributes that could be considered psychopathy.

reply to post by dominicus


Interesting indeed, but not overwhelmingly surprising. There was a study out a few years ago that showed that most CEO's and successful business executives are psychopaths. Kinda scary in a way, but not a surprise. Many times in business, you are forced to step back from the "human" response and make decisions completely free of moral value. I know...that sounds completely broken...and in a sense, I guess it is. When we are willing to "sell our humanity" for the bottom line...we have taken a 180 degree turn from the evolution of the human species.

Me personally, I don't think we evolved to see who could hoard the most stuff...be it money, property or other material things. Something tells me that is not how evolution got us to this point. We evolved because we used to work together as a team...we hunted as a team and we lived as a team. Only since the rise of "civilization" have we learned to cut each others throats to acquire more "stuff". I assume in a way that is somewhat logical...the guy with the most stuff attracts the most mates...so therefore he assures his genetic continuity...still seems kinds f'd up though.

Don't be fooled though. Our species has remnant "hard wired" tendencies to grow and protect the immediate "tribe"...anyone outside of the "tribe" is considered a threat to our resources...and we will do whatever it takes to eliminate said threats...

Ok...that was kinda sliding off topic...

1. CEO
2. Lawyer
3. Media (TV/Radio)
4. Salesperson
5. Surgeon
6. Journalist
7. Police Officer
8. Clergy person
9. Chef
10 Civil Servant

The only one that really surprises me here is surgeon. All the rest, I can see the point...even clergy seem to consider themselves "above" the masses...aka...flocks...not a surprise. Anyone who thinks their position makes them "better" than the next guy is broken...we are all made out of dirt and one day we will all return to it...period.

reply to post by Raelsatu

...There is no "cure" for psychopathy. Nobody really knows what causes it or if it can be cured; evidently it's a disorder people are born with. There are many cases of psychopaths who are born and raised in loving, caring families; therefore cases have been raised of it being primarily genetic in origin --- neurobiological with defects in the amygdala and prefrontal cortex regions.

Charles Manson didn't pop out his mothers womb a psychopath. He was trained that way. First by his mother, then by the "system" (his other mother). The end product is a long time coming, like building a wall, brick by brick. There may be a "genetic predisposition" but they really haven't proven that to a scientific fact. The treatment of a person during their formative years however, is well known. The most important contributing factor is how children are raised.

Again, there is no cure. A born true psychopath has no conscience, literally cannot feel love or empathy, or remorse. They don't regret their actions under any circumstances, and the only thing they possibly "fear" is being exposed. There's a reason the media & Hollywood has portrayed psychopaths as only ruthless killers... It's a well arranged lie to divert attention from the fact of who they really are, and their positions in the socioeconomic structure.

I agree. Once derailed its hard to get a train back on the rails. If you add all the factors together, including environment, nutrition, trauma and slow cook that for years until their teens or early adult. Look at the age of the recent rampage killers. I agree also they have little concern for others. They are only concerned about themselves. That is one facet. They do care... about themselves. That is slightly different than lack of empathy for others. That is learned behavior.

This blogger took the authors' hypothesis and twisted it somewhat. (The Wisdom of Psychopaths: What Saints, Spies, and Serial Killers Can Teach Us About Success ). He makes it sound like his evidence points to people in these roles as being crazy, dangerous or bad... when his point was that these traits are nearly good nor bad in themselves. Depends upon how they are used; specifically, if the person has anti-social tendancies.

These characteristics, we call different labels according to whether we deem they are using them in an acceptable way-

Leadership trait Psychopathic trait

Charismatic or Superficial charm
Self confidence or Grandiosity
Ability to influence or Manipulation
Persuasive or Con artist
Visionary thinking or Fabrication of intricate stories
Ability to take risks or Thrill seeking
Action oriented or Impulsive
Ability to make hard decisons or Emotionally poor

It seems to me that these are different ways to describe leadership traits.
If we judge that their leadership has been effective or successful
(they got us to the vision they proposed and we invested in)
we call them leadership traits, but if we judge that they failed, or or we feel unsatisfied with where they led us (it was not what we expected, it had aspects to it we didn't expect....) we then call them psychopathic traits.

What would a community be without anyone with these traits? Wouldn't it stagnate? Not evolve, not adapt to the environment and changes? Cause it's own demise through an excess of undecisive passivity?

Not surprising if it's true.. psychopaths can't feel emotion ( true psychopaths ) .. so it's easier to step on people to get ahead.. caring mostly about your own ambitions and less about helping those around you.. Which is why the latter part of the list deals more with people who help others..

Ironically .. I bet most of those in the upper list are republicans .. most of those I know that hold those positions are... I'm in the middle.. but it is kind of ironic..

Does that mean most Republicans are psychopaths?

Originally posted by intrptr

Charles Manson didn't pop out his mothers womb a psychopath. He was trained that way. First by his mother, then by the "system" (his other mother). The end product is a long time coming, like building a wall, brick by brick. There may be a "genetic predisposition" but they really haven't proven that to a scientific fact. The treatment of a person during their formative years however, is well known. The most important contributing factor is how children are raised.

Both true and not true... you may not be born a psychopath ( I can't say anymore than you could, and I doubt the professionals could either ) ... but I think you can be born with higher chances of something like that .. genetics, chemical makeup .. any number of things can make you predisposed to certain behaviors .. it would then just take something to tip you in the wrong direction..

Psychopathy is a mental illness much as schizophrenia is .. my uncle is extreme paranoid schizophrenic.. it came on gradually.. he had an amazing life .. but he gradually declined to the point he could no longer function.. he worked as an electronics technician and one day thought he heard lightbulbs talking to him.. then the radio .. then it just got worse and worse and worse... now he talks baby talk, you can't make much sense of him.. he says random things.. but when you present him schematics or present him with a technical question.. he snaps back into reality .. briefly

FFS! Either the definition of psychopath is too broad - or i'm a full blown psycho. ...i'm psycho

reply to post by miniatus

Psychopathy is a mental illness much as schizophrenia is...

They are two different things.

Sorry to hear about your uncle. I mean that. So many people get debilitating diseases and you know how capable they were. Sometimes we have to watch our family members degrade without really knowing why or being able to help.

I think public servants should be more clearly represented as politicians. It is not public servants. That is a cop out on the part of the author of this tripe. It is politicians meaning elected officials that are gamed by lobbyist and bureaucrats that are replete with psychopaths not public servants per say. I know lots of great mid level public servants that are good people that would never harm anyone if they could help it. I also know plenty of politicians and bureaucrats that have zero empathy for anyone and display common traits of sociopaths or psychopaths. Read the book "Political Ponerology" It is written by Eastern European psychologists.

reply to post by Bluesma

Charismatic or Superficial charm
Self confidence or Grandiosity
Ability to influence or Manipulation
Persuasive or Con artist
Visionary thinking or Fabrication of intricate stories
Ability to take risks or Thrill seeking
Action oriented or Impulsive
Ability to make hard decisons or Emotionally poor

I have been involved with several of these people, and the right hand versions of these traits are so accurate! HUGE tipoff is the grandiosity and intricate stories. When you try to get to the bottom of the story, it never pans out.

Here's one from my personal experience - told to me by someone who was in her mid-thirties, with children, but only weekend supervised visits, who was "temporarily" staying at her parents' house. I later found out she was addicted to methadone, although I did not know of the addiction until much later as I had moved to a different state and we only talked by phone occasionally. Bear in mind, this is not taking place in an inner city housing unit, this story is supposedly taking place in upper suburbia, in a 51 plus community in Colorado, surrounded by grassland, and the parents in the story are intelligent, middle class retirees.

There will be some fragment that is true, in this case, it was "my brother's ex-girlfriend followed him from California to Colorado". This is followed by a huge part that is false, "...so she came into my parents' house, and went to my room and stole money out of my drawer, so I called the police and she was cussing at me and wouldn't leave until they came but then she ran away and they couldn't find her."

It sounds possible on the surface, but a bit odd, considering the background info above, right? So you ask questions, but you will never get satisfactory answers from the person with these psycopathic traits.

Consider the flaws in the story and eventually you realize the truth - in this particular case, it was that the person telling the story was an addict and broke, and was telling a cover story to provide an explanation that would make the listener feel sympathetic "what, that evil wench your brother broke up with stole your money?"

The over-elaborate story puts the listener into a mode of empathy with focus on the parents "...oh, your poor parents, what were they supposed to do to get rid of her?", the brother with the evil ex-girlfriend "that poor guy", and oh yeah, as an afterthought (so as to keep you from focusing on the fact this is all actually an un-asked-for excuse) the sibling whose money was purportedly stolen "all that mess of a scene and she stole your money too???"

For those who think I may be one-sided - another trait is that the stories you get are JUST believable enough to leave some questions.... It MIGHT have really happened, right? After 15 years-ish of processing and trying to take these stories at face value, I finally realized that I had 3 people in my life who shared this particular trait and started to examine how that could be. I realized I was naiive and took too much at face value and needed to protect myself better. Now, over 10 years after ending the last of these relationships, I can identify these stories a mile away.

You WANT to be sympathetic and kind, but these people take advantage and take and take and never give, and if you aren't obedient, they get angry with you and try to punish you. When you find yourself constantly trying to figure out how you wound up as the one in the wrong, and the person is blaming you for not "understanding" their difficult circumstances, while you think you are bending over backwards for them... You may be involved with somebody like this.

In my case, it wasn't until after I had bought the person and her brother plane tickets to come to my state, picked them up at the airport, let them stay at my house for a week for work that never surfaced, and then finally bought more tickets to send them back to whence they came, that I finally realized what I had been dealing with.

Ack, mini-rant over. But seriously - these people are out there and it's very hard to recognize them until you get away from them and see it from a distance!!!

Originally posted by dominicus

Originally posted by Aleister
reply to post by dominicus

 

They are legion. Government, military and other power-hungry and controlling personalities will smile and look agreeable, all the time not hearing a thing you say.

Yeah, I had a buddy who was studying and now is a psychologist, who also went into the Military. He basically broke down the Military complex as a giant game based on mutual agreements between sadists & masochists, both under the tutelage of psychopathy.

My ex-son-in-law is a true psychopath who is very adept within the military world. He's young, still, and only a Major, but he's brilliantly political - even in his dealings with me. That said, he's missing that invaluable capacity for authentic human connection. This afternoon, I have been forced to begin the dismantling of his professional military career as a result of his senseless and ultimately self-destructive scheme (apparently in the planning and development stage for at least two years now) to force my daughter into homelessness and gain my two grandkids from her by legal default. And we hung out and exchanged warm pleasantries just 3 days ago, as the paperwork he'd initiated was preparing to descend upon her. Amazing.

His plan is really based on an extremely precarious confluence of timing that depends primarily on his withholding child support long enough to force her to lose her apartment - which he can now do legally since the entire situation is now in legal flux (even after two years of a settled support and custody situation). In short, his is a remarkably irresponsible plan that borders on pathological in its recklessness. The kids will find out this weekend that they won't be going back (in a different state, no less) to their school or back to their home or back to be with their friends - and he honestly sees this as a win that he was able to manufacture behind everyone's back (of course with the legal help of a Father's Rights group that does this sort of thing as their stock in trade). I wouldn't want to have to defend this insanity to those babies, and prevent them from deeply resenting their father for what he's done to them. Not that he's even considered this particularly ugly hitch in his plan.

This is what a true psychopath is like. He can't possibly win, since the charges will be so easy to challenge and ultimately prove unfounded. But, in his twisted mind, he sees the path to victory as winding through the fact that withholding his child support will severely cripple my daughter's ability to maintain the home that she has established with their children over the last two years. And that when she loses that home, he'll smile and show the home that he's made with the woman (also an officer in the USAF) that he dumped his wife and two kids for, and assume that his home will be the only available home for those kids. The result will save him $2,000 a month and he's placed a much more malleable female drone in place to raise his kids for him.

Done and done. Ironically, this entire adventure will actually result in his being forced into resignation and surrender of his commission, and definitely the loss of his new wife, as we have lots of evidence concerning his philandering behind her back (while he was cheating with her on my daughter) and with subordinates within his own USAF organization - which is extremely illegal according to the UCMJ. And this is what psychopaths do - to themselves as well as to others.

Yes, psychopaths are dangerous. Especially when you've allowed them into your life. I haven't decided exactly how to eat him alive yet, but I don't anticipate that I'll have to spend a lot of time on it. As a true psychopath, he's left himself wide open to obliteration. As they all do.

Psychopaths are reckless and irresponsible, and not only with the lives of those that depend on them. They're also reckless and irresponsible with their own lives. And this is how you kill them off. Find out where they've left themselves wide open (and that opening always exists) and they're yours to eat alive.

Those professions have the highest number of psychopaths, because of employment and population levels. But think about some occupations with high percentages of psychopaths; like President, General, Senator. Sure the corrupt low level psycho cop pulls the trigger, but the policy and the enabling behavior / encouragement are coming from higher up the ladder.

reply to post by NorEaster


Socios/Psychos apparently have difficulties in answering self-reflective questions;
www.management-issues.com/2010/5/4/opinion/questions-for-self-reflection.asp
I know that the one I was involved with had little or no capacity for self judgement.
This son in law of yours, did he believe he was smarter than everyone around him? I know that the one I knew did and, ultimately, this was her downfall but only after she left a trail of misery and one body (that we know of)

reply to post by gwynnhwyfar



Yeah, I gotta say, I got played a few times too. It's easy to be sucked in and they are very very good with their lies. The biggest one sucked away about 4 months and several thousand dollars before I wised up. It was a lesson hard learned but I won't make the mistake again.

They also LOVE using small children against you. They say EVERYTHING they swindle you out of is "for the children" and you're already very attached to them. They use that weakness to drain you dry. Sometimes you have to walk away from those poor little faces because those poor little faces are going to grow up to be exactly like the adults that are playing you

It would be great if they could be taken out of those "homes" (actually situations since feigned homlessness... until they find another sucker and move into their place... is one of the ploys used) while they still have a chance, but it's easier said than done.

reply to post by merkins


It seems that it would only have an evolutionary advantage in an extreme, prolonged SHTF situation. As you have pointed out in a society they are gotten rid of, at least the ones that fail to keep somewhat of a lid on their behavior.
The psychopath could be a kind of fail-safe in our species; they would be the ones that did what it took to survive without hesitation or remorse, not desirable charactaristics in day to day life at least if they are not controlled or at least disguised.
There was a mention somewhere in this thread www.abovetopsecret.com... that, I beleive it was eskimos, would push these people off an ice shelf once they were identified, very similar to what you are saying.

reply to post by gwynnhwyfar

Thanks for telling that story.

You WANT to be sympathetic and kind, but these people take advantage and take and take and never give, and if you aren't obedient, they get angry with you and try to punish you. When you find yourself constantly trying to figure out how you wound up as the one in the wrong, and the person is blaming you for not "understanding" their difficult circumstances, while you think you are bending over backwards for them...

I saw something in your recount I wanted to point out and maybe help you to understand one aspect. Practicing drug addicts aren't in charge of their lives. The drugs or the addiction to them are. Its like the drugs are in the drivers seat and the addict is along for the ride. Especially when it comes to the King of drugs... Heroin. No one can say no to the King. It controls every aspect of an addicted person, every waking moment is dedicated to obtaining the next fix. Without it, painful symptoms of withdrawal begin which are to to be avoided at all costs. So they steal and lie and promise to change, but really they have no choice as long as they are addicted.

It may appear they are psychopaths but really inside they are as upset about it as the people they victimize. "Nothing personal, just give me the friggin' money. You don't understand." That kind of thing. Once the person consciously chooses to get treatment then they can begin the long road to recovery and the real person that was in there before they become a drug addict will return. Sometimes addicts struggle a long time, vacillating back and forth between abstinence and relapse before they are successful (or die trying). That is norlmal too.

Not trying to excuse their behavior, just giving it some perspective from an addicts perspective.

Originally posted by LafingWithTears
reply to post by NorEaster

 

Socios/Psychos apparently have difficulties in answering self-reflective questions;
www.management-issues.com/2010/5/4/opinion/questions-for-self-reflection.asp
I know that the one I was involved with had little or no capacity for self judgement.
This son in law of yours, did he believe he was smarter than everyone around him? I know that the one I knew did and, ultimately, this was her downfall but only after she left a trail of misery and one body (that we know of)

Oh, he's a genius - in his own mind, anyway. He's smart, and he graduated as Regimen Commander from The Citadel. So, it's not as if he's deluded about his capacity to succeed. The bitch is that he's a real-life psychopath, and they always destroy themselves in the end. I would've preferred that he played this situation straight, since he could've been a good asset in connection with the societal and financial futures of my grandbabies. But, I cant have a mental case like that running loose inside my life.

I have enough ugly, stupid sh*t on him to send him to Leavenworth for the entire raising of both children, and I think it'd probably be best for everyone if I just let him have it. I hate that he just never realized that I'm infinitely more malevolent and evil than he'll ever be. You can be dangerous if you're selfish and self-centered, but no one is as dangerous as someone who doesn't care about losing everything just to watch you burn alive.

Poor bastard.

reply to post by NorEaster

I haven't decided exactly how to eat him alive yet, but I don't anticipate that I'll have to spend a lot of time on it. As a true psychopath, he's left himself wide open to obliteration. As they all do.

Psychopaths are reckless and irresponsible, and not only with the lives of those that depend on them. They're also reckless and irresponsible with their own lives. And this is how you kill them off. Find out where they've left themselves wide open (and that opening always exists) and they're yours to eat alive.

And risk becoming like him in the process. Then he truly will win. You have done well in ferreting out his true nature and bringing the legal system to bear to get your daughter and grandkids away from him. I know it would be sweet to wreak vengeance upon him.

Leaving it just short of that would leave him to eat himself alive rather than seeking revenge upon you for doing that to him. Thats his game. Prove you are better than that to him. That will burn him up enough. You'll be a hero to the kids when they grow up. And taught them a lesson about how to behave in similar circumstances.

Sorry, I know its none of my business to advise you about it.

Just observing...

Originally posted by intrptr
reply to post by NorEaster

 

I haven't decided exactly how to eat him alive yet, but I don't anticipate that I'll have to spend a lot of time on it. As a true psychopath, he's left himself wide open to obliteration. As they all do.

Psychopaths are reckless and irresponsible, and not only with the lives of those that depend on them. They're also reckless and irresponsible with their own lives. And this is how you kill them off. Find out where they've left themselves wide open (and that opening always exists) and they're yours to eat alive.

And risk becoming like him in the process. Then he truly will win. You have done well in ferreting out his true nature and bringing the legal system to bear to get your daughter and grandkids away from him. I know it would be sweet to wreak vengeance upon him.

Leaving it just short of that would leave him to eat himself alive rather than seeking revenge upon you for doing that to him. Thats his game. Prove you are better than that to him. That will burn him up enough. You'll be a hero to the kids when they grow up. And taught them a lesson about how to behave in similar circumstances.

Sorry, I know its none of my business to advise you about it.

Just observing...

I will be using the Uniform Code of Military Justice, when I feast on him. I'm not like him. I'm a lot worse than he is. He can't win. There's nothing to win for him. Too bad he's too stupid to realize that.