When was your first sighting of a (then) Top Secret Military Aircraft (not space ships)?

Mine was back in 1986, when driving home along U.S. route 2 in central Massachusetts just before dawn. I was returning home from a late work shift, heading east, toward a sky growing lighter just prior to sunrise. I had past Ft Devens a while back, and I happened to notice above me in the sky, over the road, an echelon formation of 4 triangle shaped black aircraft. They were also heading east toward Boston and the coast. They were moving at quite a clip, and I had a mixed feeling of intrigue and awe.

With Ft Devens still in operation at that time, I wondered if they were aircraft leaving there for an overseas mission. But, in the years I traveled that route, seeing A-10s and other typical aircraft over Route 2, they were always during daylight, and never that shape. I've always been a bit of a military aircraft watcher, and knew most of the past and present aircraft in the U.S. arsenal (the Navy WWII F4U-Corsair and the newer F/A-18 being my personal favorites). A former WWII Navy Veteran, my dad worked at Hanscom AFB my entire childhood, and I got to visit there many times and see some of the military aircraft on the base.

At this time, I had a buddy that was in the Army, he happened to be stationed at Ft. Devens. So I asked him if we had any delta wing aircraft in our arsenal or any he may have seen on the base. His response was not that he was aware, and could I describe them in more detail than a "black triangle". But, that really was all I could describe. They were definitely aircraft though, their flight characteristics were typical of fixed-wing and produced a very faint (but flat) darkened contrail. That in itself was odd to me, as I'd never seen a contrail quite like that before.

It was only years later, that when the F-117 Stealth Fighter was made public did I finally realize that was what I saw. There was no doubt in my mind, looking at the photos and shape, and even the beaver-tail like exhaust portal at the rear (explaining the odd contrail I saw). It was cool to think I saw a secret military aircraft, a few years before they were publicly known.

So, ATS'ers, what are your stories of seeing secret aircraft? I'm not looking for alien space ships stories, but things believed to be actual military aircraft. This thread is not limited to seeing US tech either, anything seen the world over would be fine too.

Thanks in advance for your stories.

reply to post by Krakatoa


It was about 12 years ago, in a hangar at Hawker de Havilland (a defense aircraft contractor) which used to be at Bankstown Aerodrome in Sydney Australia.

The aircraft was a cruise missile similar to the AGM-86B but with a slightly more bulbous nose, clearly marked with radiation hazard signs and a US logo.

The thing was that Australia's stance at the time was anti-nuke, so it was a surprise. The fact that it was a cruise missile was not secret, the fact that a nuke ready armament was on Australian soil was.

A few months later I saw one slung under a C-141 Starlifter at an airshow in Nowra, NSW. I showed my dad the radiation signs and the fact that it was fully slung, plugged & tagged (prepped for transport) indicated it probably carried a warhead.

reply to post by Krakatoa

People who see UFOs --Unidentified Flying Objects-- cannot say whether or not they saw man-made or "other" objects, since the definition itself says that the objects were/are *unidentified.* See, this is where it gets a little weird because people who claim to see extraterrestrial flying saucers cannot distinguish where they are from as much as people who claim to see man-made tech. It is difficult for this to be a double standard in the sense that you claim to have seen man-made tech (F-117) versus someone who claims to have seen alien tech. The essence of the definition of "UFO" is that the object is unidentified. And, for people who claim to have seen something "out of this world" to be ridiculed may be weighed against people who claim to have seen something man-made. It is tough to be objective in this realm, but it is necessary.

I was at Kadena Air Base in Okinawa during the second week of August 1968 waiting to board a Boeing 707 for Da Nang Air Base when I saw the fastest most advanced airplane I have seen to this day... I saw it take off and land on the same runway 13 months later while waiting for my flight to El Toro MCAS in Santa Ana California.. It was 3 or 4 years later that I found out that it was a SR-71.... I never would have believed that anything so large could go from a dead stop on a runway to disappearing into a clear cloudless in a matter of seconds or approach a runway when landing at such a high rate of speed like it did if I hadn't see it happen on those two different occasions...

Roughly 14-15 years or so ago. A large, black triangular craft hovering with blue flames directed downwards directly over a busy avenue in Tampa, Florida. I learned later that the Air Force/Special Force/Black Ops base there deals with test flights of new craft (many craft are since then shipped from aforementioned base out onto the Gulf before assembly and launches) but I recall that it was as silent as could be. I was with my mother even, that night, and we saw it together with other cars streaming down the street. Quite a sight. Intrigued me further to investigate the r&d fields. I actually since have not seen anything (publicly) that resembles it to the exact degree of what I saw that night.

Originally posted by GhostLancer
reply to post by Krakatoa

 

People who see UFOs --Unidentified Flying Objects-- cannot say whether or not they saw man-made or "other" objects, since the definition itself says that the objects were/are *unidentified.* See, this is where it gets a little weird because people who claim to see extraterrestrial flying saucers cannot distinguish where they are from as much as people who claim to see man-made tech. It is difficult for this to be a double standard in the sense that you claim to have seen man-made tech (F-117) versus someone who claims to have seen alien tech. The essence of the definition of "UFO" is that the object is unidentified. And, for people who claim to have seen something "out of this world" to be ridiculed may be weighed against people who claim to have seen something man-made. It is tough to be objective in this realm, but it is necessary.

I hope you are not commenting on my "no space ships" aspect of this thread. I worded it carefully to avoid using the term "UFO", since I agree, UFO is a designation that it is an Unidentified Flying Object. That is why I asked for no "space ships" and not no "UFO" stories. I was looking for fellow ATS'ers who've had strange sightings that were later revealed to be actual advanced tech, suspected of being such due to context and location. I'm just trying to avoid the wild space ship theory and discussion in a Military Projects forum. I am not trying to belittle or berate believers in Alien visitations at all, I only wish to limit the discussions to terrestrial or suspected terrestrial technology sightings.

I would love to hear if you have had such an encounter in the past though....and welcome you to share that story with others here.

Originally posted by SoulVisions
Roughly 14-15 years or so ago. A large, black triangular craft hovering with blue flames directed downwards directly over a busy avenue in Tampa, Florida. I learned later that the Air Force/Special Force/Black Ops base there deals with test flights of new craft (many craft are since then shipped from aforementioned base out onto the Gulf before assembly and launches) but I recall that it was as silent as could be. I was with my mother even, that night, and we saw it together with other cars streaming down the street. Quite a sight. Intrigued me further to investigate the r&d fields. I actually since have not seen anything (publicly) that resembles it to the exact degree of what I saw that night.

That is an interesting encounter indeed. Makes me wonder of it was a modified experimental F-117 VSTOL?
How long was your sighting?
Did other cars on the road seem to brake in its presence (indicating they may have seen it as well)?

In my case, it was so early in the morning, there were not other cars on the road at the time.

Originally posted by chr0naut
reply to post by Krakatoa

 

It was about 12 years ago, in a hangar at Hawker de Havilland (a defense aircraft contractor) which used to be at Bankstown Aerodrome in Sydney Australia.

The aircraft was a cruise missile similar to the AGM-86B but with a slightly more bulbous nose, clearly marked with radiation hazard signs and a US logo.

The thing was that Australia's stance at the time was anti-nuke, so it was a surprise. The fact that it was a cruise missile was not secret, the fact that a nuke ready armament was on Australian soil was.

A few months later I saw one slung under a C-141 Starlifter at an airshow in Nowra, NSW. I showed my dad the radiation signs and the fact that it was fully slung, plugged & tagged (prepped for transport) indicated it probably carried a warhead.

Cool...and a bit unnerving I'll bet. Especially considering the case that it was a "nuke free zone" where you saw this tech. Kinda makes ya wonder more about the difference between the public and private nature of treaties.

Thanks for sharing.

Originally posted by Krakatoa

Originally posted by SoulVisions
Roughly 14-15 years or so ago. A large, black triangular craft hovering with blue flames directed downwards directly over a busy avenue in Tampa, Florida. I learned later that the Air Force/Special Force/Black Ops base there deals with test flights of new craft (many craft are since then shipped from aforementioned base out onto the Gulf before assembly and launches) but I recall that it was as silent as could be. I was with my mother even, that night, and we saw it together with other cars streaming down the street. Quite a sight. Intrigued me further to investigate the r&d fields. I actually since have not seen anything (publicly) that resembles it to the exact degree of what I saw that night.

That is an interesting encounter indeed. Makes me wonder of it was a modified experimental F-117 VSTOL?
How long was your sighting?
Did other cars on the road seem to brake in its presence (indicating they may have seen it as well)?

Difficult to say. As I mentioned, I haven't seen anything quite like what I saw that day. There were many cars around. I thought for sure this would be mentioned later on. I even checked the news the next day, and it had mentioned something being in the air, but it was confusing because there was no mention of any vehicle of any sorts. Go figure.

The traffic moved at a pace typical of a city. Red light, travel to the next light 100 yards ahead, stop at red light. Go again... There were a few cars honking oddly, so we were certain it was due to what was being seen, but who can say? It was low enough to be illuminated by the street lights themselves, on the flight craft's underside. Thus the shape was visible, and it's black paint job, despite the sighting being during the night time. I didn't see it even, initially, until she had pointed it out to me by saying "look up at that.." I asked what it was as we drove under it, and she reminded me about the base. The traffic was fairly congested, thus I mentioned the "city pacing" of slow stop and go. Typical for that one area, however.

Funny thing is when I asked her about it years later, we both remembered the occasion, but we both just kind of shrugged it off, I guess.

When I was a kid, I saw an SR71 take off before they were generally well known.

Oh, and we had access to secret test flight films. I had forgotten about that. OMFG.

When I was in fifth grade, one of the kids' dads owned a TS film processing lab for the government. So of course, he brought films to class that were classified, and our teacher was totally nuts so of course, after lunch we had Film Time every day.

We saw all sorts of different missiles get fired, some didn't go so well. And there were the ones that were nerve gas being tested on live subjects, that was sort of gruesome but we played them all.

I did see the smaller triangles, several times. The first time was probably back about 2000, out west on another systems gig. Unforgettable.

I was lucky to spot two black unidentified triangular crafts on Valentines Day 1989 with an ex-girlfriend driving in a car thru tiny Biscay, Minnesota.

Since then this sighting has been reported on a MUFON website (but a few things they got wrong though) and it was even quoted in a book (which I never authorized and contains author embellishments that I never made. Oh well..)

At any rate, whatever they are hasn't been released as yet so I suspect they were prototypes that were tested and never came to production or were produced in low numbers.

Essentially: stealth VS/TOL prototypes seen around 10 o'clock at night. They were triangular but "truck like" in their carriage and not sleek and low but were very quiet and could slow to near walking speed.

We initially spotted them hovering over a field where my ex thought it was aircraft warning lights attached to smokestacks but she couldn't see the "factory" they were rising up from when we realized they were planes.

I admonished her to pull over and got out of the car before the vehicle even fully stopped. It was at this point that the pilots must have noticed us stopping as they started pulling forward from a dead stop - just hovering there. But peculiar since there were two of them hovering somewhat close to each other.

As I looked towards the objects they continud to moved forwards slowly, almost but not quite silently and passed overhead with a muted jet enging sound and gracefully turned to the southeast and left the area.

These were flying pretty low - possibly as low as 250-350 feet and were visible because a sodium vapor streetlight lit up the underside of the aircraft fairly well.

General description: Wingtip green/red navigational lights, two yellowish lights pointing downwards at the point where the trailing edge of the wing would be in the center of the fuselage, empennage was weird: downwardly canted tailplanes like on a F-4 Phantom but curiously conical/pointy instead of airfoil shaped.

They flew in from the north-northeast, then low over the road slowly but as they started their turn you could hear the engines ramping up and took off towards the southeast.

I asked my then neighbor what significance Biscay Minnesota had with regards to aviation. He was a pilot for Northwest Airlines for many years. He said it was sometimes used as a connective conduit, to pass control to transiting aircraft from one part of the country to another.

Years later I emailed my report to Steve Douglass who had been known as a "stealth watcher" and ran the sighting to one of his connections, Jim Goodall a well connected aviation enthusiast with his own connections.

Allegedly the government was testing stealthy VSTOL prototypes in the "midwest and michigan" and that I may have spotted a test flight and that I was "very lucky" since they take pains to keep those things away from prying eyes.

February 14th, 1989 was a Tuesday and Biscay was fairly remote at the time and it was freezing cold out so only an idiot would be out driving (we were just on a "romantic road trip" at the time).

Sadly the sighting was lost on the girl - I'm an avid aviation enthusiast and seeing something like that has been a once in a lifetime event and given that it isn't "out of the black" might mean it was a prototype that didn't work out, didn't meet design spec, was too expensive or had some other problem. Or it's still under wraps until it needs to be used.

Originally posted by aliensporebomb
We initially spotted them hovering over a field where my ex thought it was aircraft warning lights attached to smokestacks but she couldn't see the "factory" they were rising up from when we realized they were planes.

I admonished her to pull over and got out of the car before the vehicle even fully stopped. It was at this point that the pilots must have noticed us stopping as they started pulling forward from a dead stop - just hovering there.

As I looked towards the objects they continud to moved forwards slowly, almost but not quite silently and passed overhead with a muted jet enging sound and gracefully turned to the southeast and left the area.

These were flying pretty low - possibly as low as 250-350 feet and were visible because a sodium vapor streetlight lit up the underside of the aircraft fairly well.

What did it sound like to you? The ones I've seen were very quiet. Heck, I'm pretty sure I could have hit one of them with a basketball, and we weren't really sure where the sound was coming from. We could hear something that sounded like a turbine pump in the distance, and some thruster quad sort of fire extinguisher popping we thought was coming from another building, but was probably just reflecting off of the building to us.

Originally posted by chr0naut
the fact that a nuke ready armament was on Australian soil was.

A few months later I saw one slung under a C-141 Starlifter at an airshow in Nowra, NSW. I showed my dad the radiation signs and the fact that it was fully slung, plugged & tagged (prepped for transport) indicated it probably carried a warhead.

Seriously at an airshow? A missile containing a nuclear warhead? Your post is an example of how people can misinterpret what they see in relation to aviation. Are you sure you weren't mixing up a Radio-Frequency Radiation Hazard sign on a piece of equipment? I expect that you have seriously mis-identified the equipment that you saw and jumped to the wrong conclusion.

Tie down the exact date of the Nowra Airshow that you visited.

reply to post by aliensporebomb


Nice to see this confirmed. This was what we saw, roughly, as well. Did you happen to see the blue apertures underneath? You mentioned "lights" though what we saw had more function than just that of.

Strange that you mentioned the lights on the wings, I didn't even mention that in my post, but yeah, they were flicked on and off briefly on our sighting as well, that's what had drawn her attention in the first place. I feel really out of the loop now. I had pushed this to the back of my mind, but now it bothers me that I don't have any information on this particular bird.

Originally posted by tommyjo

Originally posted by chr0naut
the fact that a nuke ready armament was on Australian soil was.

A few months later I saw one slung under a C-141 Starlifter at an airshow in Nowra, NSW. I showed my dad the radiation signs and the fact that it was fully slung, plugged & tagged (prepped for transport) indicated it probably carried a warhead.

Seriously at an airshow? A missile containing a nuclear warhead? Your post is an example of how people can misinterpret what they see in relation to aviation. Are you sure you weren't mixing up a Radio-Frequency Radiation Hazard sign on a piece of equipment? I expect that you have seriously mis-identified the equipment that you saw and jumped to the wrong conclusion.

Tie down the exact date of the Nowra Airshow that you visited.

The C-141 was not part of the airshow. The airshow granted us access to the Nowra Air Force aerodrome and base which had an open day coinciding with it.

The C-141 was not hangared but standing in the taxiway, tied down. My guess was that it was passing through and that the air-show had disrupted its departure after refuel.

I worked on military aircraft as a civilian contractor for more than 11 years (sometimes working on classified aircraft and technology). I also did a stint in the Air Force and so I think I can differentiate between an RF antenna warning and a warhead warning (and the cruise missile did not have any external antenna that I could see, it was a particularly 'clean' profile).

I've seen drones flying over my house as early as 1990, I don't know if they are still classified, I don't think so, but I also don't believe many people look up and even notice them. I don't live there anymore, but when I did I would occasionally see them with binoculars, their design is old, missile shaped with small wings, colors from white to orange.

originally posted by: SoulVisions
reply to post by aliensporebomb

 

Nice to see this confirmed. This was what we saw, roughly, as well. Did you happen to see the blue apertures underneath? You mentioned "lights" though what we saw had more function than just that of.

Strange that you mentioned the lights on the wings, I didn't even mention that in my post, but yeah, they were flicked on and off briefly on our sighting as well, that's what had drawn her attention in the first place. I feel really out of the loop now. I had pushed this to the back of my mind, but now it bothers me that I don't have any information on this particular bird.

Sorry for the long delay in response - after my computer was rebuilt it's taken ages to get set up again on all the sites I used to frequent.

I did recall a number of lights underneath that seemed to have more functions than just illumination - possible infrared leds for station keeping during refueling but one of the interesting features was twin downward yellowish-white lights pointing straight down from just behind or at the rear edge of the wing.

Very quiet aircraft, we were able to have a conversation without shouting while the two aircraft flew over.

And now, after spending some time on the reddit special access projects thread I believe I have found the aircraft in question or perhaps
its little brother/sister variant: something called LOAVES (Low Observables Air Vehicle Engineering Study).

See thread there at this link:
imgur.com...

"Because of the Iran hostage crisis the DoD wanted a stealth VTOL way back in 1981! It had a shafted lift fan design long before the F35B was a twinkle in Lockheed's eye."

The very last picture in the file is as close as I've seen to what I saw. Kind of ungainly and truck like, the other views make it seem more streamlined. I couldn't see the upper part of the empennage from my view but it's possible what I thought were downwardly canted tailplanes were actually sensors or stabilators of a sort.

Seemed to work well enough in 1989.

a reply to: chr0naut

Except the C-141 didn't have external hard points to carry anything like a cruise missile.

Zap, about when was the SR-71 officially admitted to? I was snuck (sneaked?) onto a base to watch one take off, would have been '69 or so, I was in the first grade, but man, that thing looked like Star Trek.

a reply to: Bedlam

The SR was introduced publicly before it ever flew. The A-12 was flown for years before it was announced though.